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Riot... Why are you adding RNG to my jungle?

Mira Arya Enthe··41 votes·2,317 views

Why? Why Riot? I try to be a good jungler. I love your game, thank you for creating Shyvana I love her, and many of your other champions. I actually love the smite buffs(that you are removing?).

But for heaven's fucking sake. I stopped playing ADC because I hate RNG, I do not want my game decided by luck. We already have the luck of the draw on 9 other players skill levels and strategy which is fine, it is a team game. I already had to adapt to your stupid ass RNG dragons that my team never comes to when I ping that it is a fire drake and we need it, but then they all die at 30 minutes for a damn water drake.

Whatever.

But please... do not put fucking RNG knock back in my jungle, to make it even easier for Nidalee and Graves to kite me. Don't put fucking free healing all over the map so there can be even more toxic rage every time "OH FUCKING GREAT! OF COURSE THERE IS A HEALING FRUIT SO THEY CAN ESCAPE!"

Please do not put massive, fucking, Ashe invalidating levels of free vision. All over the map. RNG. So that I can never predict vision and do vision counterplay.

Please Riot... please for the love of Godyr. Don't put RNG in my jungle.

Thank you - Concerned junglers everywhere.

28 Comments

EndlessSorcerer10 votes

Honestly, I wonder if they just adjust the jungle for the sake of changing it at times.

Mira Arya Enthe4 votes

{quoted}

Honestly, I wonder if they just adjust the jungle for the sake of changing it at times.

Feels like it.

Leetri2 votes

They don't want the game to be solved. Everyone jungles a set route, smiting specific camps at specific times and so on. They hope to change that.

Karn Bishop1 votes

I might have accepted variation jungle camps, such as traditional wolf, frost wolf, wolf king, fire wolf, ect ect. with each providing a unique buff and the icon revealing which camp variation it is.

This would have made me go, well i usually start krugs>red, >raptors but wolf king + wind raptors spawned so i'll actually start raptors + wolf then gank or go blue.

MrWasjig5 votes

That must be the Season 7 buzz-word "Solved" and "Unsolved".

Get ready to hear that non-stop, everybody!

Mistress Shyvana10 votes

Have fun Melee champs. Chasing anyone past blast plants

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mistress Shyvana,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k2WATdEz,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-10-13T18:40:29.983+0000)

Have fun Melee champs. Chasing anyone past blast plants

This, blast plants are hugely slanted towards ranged champions.

Shyvana chasing Caitlyn? Caitlyn shoots it and escapes.

Caitlyn chasing Shyvana? Caitlyn shoots it and knocks her back towards her team.

TehNACHO2 votes

Okay let's be fair though, that second example you are giving is entirely impractical.

If it was like, Kled being chased by Cassiopeia, sure. Most ADCs can't chase down a Shyvana though, at least not for long distance and especially not while breathing down her neck like your example basically requires.

TyrekGoldenspear1 votes

Olaf Okay. I will. >:)

Squidsmastah1 votes

MasterYi ok :D

Vistha Kai4 votes

Because getting 3 Infernal Dragons in a row wasn't fun enough.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Vistha Kai,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k2WATdEz,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-10-13T18:37:46.844+0000)

Because getting 3 Infernal Dragons in a row wasn't fun enough.

You mean the enemy getting 3 inferno drakes and when you manage to get your team together to secure one it is a water drake.

Vistha Kai4 votes

Still better than a Moutain Drake, if you can't get near objectives in the first place.

EndlessSorcerer6 votes

Honestly, I think Ocean Drake is my favourite of them all.

The ability to stay topped up on health and mana when roaming or sieging is rather nice.

AlienPrimate1 votes

Because infernal drakes are SOOOOOO good...I got one the other day while I was looking at my damage scaling. Q damage went from 475 to 485. Totally worth the effort.

EcchiOtakuTM4 votes

Let's see 30 sec warning timers, check.

Spawn in fixed locations until late game, check.

Noone even tried them yet and still complain, check.

Not like it's wrong to be worried but complaining before even trying it gets pretty out of hand.

Xeruon4 votes

Do you remember how the new dragons' RNG completely fucked game balance and nobody but a couple champions who could abuse the drakes were good?

Me neither.

Legacy Hydralpha4 votes

Dude, we aren't even in preseason yet. Dragons, IMO, were a good addition to the game and allowed for more reaction (should we prioritize this drag or not?) Wait for us to even get the plants and see how it works. With Riot doing community stuff (Baker Panth, Devil Teemo, Solo Queue, etc.) they may be openly showing that they're listening.

Mira Arya Enthe3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Legacy Hydralpha,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=k2WATdEz,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2016-10-13T20:32:54.965+0000)

Dude, we aren't even in preseason yet. Dragons, IMO, were a good addition to the game and allowed for more reaction (should we prioritize this drag or not?) Wait for us to even get the plants and see how it works. With Riot doing community stuff (Baker Panth, Devil Teemo, Solo Queue, etc.) they may be openly showing that they're listening.

Exactly why we talk about it now and voice our complaints and ideas?

Weathered3 votes

Riot specifically said they are not RNG and don't spawn in the early game much.

resumed3 votes

what part of spawning at random isnt rng?

dragons spawn in certain locations too but they still rng

dont b dumb

IPromiseTomorrow3 votes

I totally agree. I'd want league to stay in touch with players being skillful and wise. Instead of having random elements favor a certain team via chance. If I lose because a computer reduces or eliminates my chances of succes... Then.... I'm not cause over my wins... I don't affect any thing because rng...

Wtf am I playing for? To win, to have fun, or to get lucky?...

Skjöldolfr2 votes

Hear Hear!!!!

Hige2 votes

it's not particularly loose RNG, a blast plant won't appear in the river for example, not to mention that control over the plants is a valuable skill for junglers, you say you'd tilt if you were chasing someone and they took the healing fruit but the real issue here is that everyone is able to know that the fruit is there, if you keep chasing that's YOUR fault.

Vision plants aren't ALL over the map either, plants have a very long spawn time and even after spawning they aren't collectable immediately, they need 30 more seconds to mature into the effects you list. If you don't collect the plants the map won't be filled with them, I believe they stated that there can only be one of each plant for both teams? so a total of 3 plants and one of them dedicated to vision isn't exactly ALL OVER THE MAP.

Teridax682 votes

I think it's worth waiting a little more to see how this turns out, since there's a lot Riot mentioned about plants that didn't get conveyed in the videos, plus this is still very experimental stuff.

With that said, I share the sentiment. As a jungler main, I agree that Smite buffs ended up not being interesting at all, but I don't think these plants are a good replacement, or really a good way of adding "diversity" to the game. Yes, League does feel like a solved game after a while, but there are a ton of reasons for why that is, and none of them will be answered with random power-ups. For one, there's the issue of the game still largely revolving around marksmen, which has been around for most of the game's lifetime now and still hasn't been addressed, despite massively locking up diversity in team comps, strategy and overall gameplay. There's also the issue of games feeling like they're decided way too early in some cases, a factor made worse by Preseason 6's minion snowball system. On top of this, diversity always contracts periodically whenever some flavor-of-the-month build/champion makes others unviable, which is currently the case with Rylai's/Frozen Mallet sidelining a lot of melee champions.

What annoyed me the most when watching those videos is that they all made it look like whoever used those plants were arbitrarily handed out a get-out-of-jail-free card. Perhaps there was much more tactical gameplay, in that the players knew where those plants were ahead of time, and moved towards them to get that bonus, but we didn't see any of that there. What was also annoying is that Fearless mentioned how plants were supposed to un-solve "fights that have trended towards predictability and being solved" (his words, not mine), yet when I saw all of those situations in those videos I wanted those fights to be solved. Graves committed and went into the enemy jungle, Karthus blew his ult on a correct target, and Nunu put himself at risk to get a sneaky solo Drake steal. By contrast, all Jayce, Gnar and Lee Sin did was basically hit a plant and win, each one countering a play that took a lot more effort or resources to pull off. Sure, those plants added variance, but it felt like the wrong kind of variance, and variance in the wrong places. Adding random or pseudo-random power-ups might add some novelty to the game, but it's not going to add that much more freshness to each new match unless Riot really makes them game-changingly powerful, which I absolutely do not want.

Narvuntien1 votes

Thier arguement about the on camp buffs not being equal and people finding the optimal camps to smite perhaps has some validity. But I don't see how the plants change anything for the better.

I actually like the jungle this season, as in they had a nice balance between Sustained and AoE clearing, which they had trouble with in the past.

The problem was basically champions that could avoid damage, either through range or spawing minions, giving them very fast and very sustained clears. I think they should be focusing on solving this and not trying to randomise the jungle.

People are always going to optimise thier jungle paths and the knowleadge or optimal paths will give both fast clears and an understanding what your opponent will do. Trying to randomise isn't going to help anything, I remember how much work they put in to removing randomness only to decide to put it back in. That seems like a mistake.

I support thier move to remove the smite buffs on camps, I am okay with some change, it keeps things fresh but I just don't see the benefits of the randomly spawning plants, what is it adding to the game?

xBenny1 votes

I personaly actually like the idea of plants being added to LoL, I think the problem is the way they are added in. The RNG factor can be really tilting (remember why the Ocean Drake Buff got changed to out of combat sustain). But instead of just complaining I also want to make suggestions how you could add plants in a way most people would appreciate it: You could make plants spawn at specific locations at specific times (like Junglemonsters). I think the effects of those plants are not really good either (Zac Blobs, Ziggs Jumppad and Ashes Hawkshot). In my opinion plants should spawn at determined locations (e.g. at the river entrances or in the center - around Blue/Red Buff) and can be smited to get there effects (e.g. the plant gets corrupted and if an enemy gets near in the next minute or so it will explode, slow and reveal the target/s or the plant attacks enemys close to it). These effects should have a delay though and must have been set up in advance to get an advantage in the fight itself. Maybe the plants also do not have to be smited - but auto-attacked to also give other players but junglers the opportunity to set up a fight with an advantage. In conclusion I wanna say please get rid of the RNG and give the plants cooler effects. PS: Please also do not remove smiting camps to get a buff - I think some Buffs are really unique and can cover weaknesses in the jungle clear of most junglers. Removing it would just unnecessarily take some diversity from the game.

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