Items don't force players to made decisions, and they are out of control

Failog··3 votes·765 views

Items in general do too much and are too, well general--jack of all trades often.

You should be giving up some potential in one area if you pick a certain item vs another.

For example, Armor pen items should be specialty items for when you need to be able to kill a tank(s), but getting that armor pen item should make you less effective against say, squishy champions, that will respond more to raw damage and higher AD, and movement speed that might be associated with those items. Every armor pen item seems like a catch all general first item for too many champions, what with their AD and movement speed bonuses and how they work with their kits.

Perhaps one of the reason why its so hard to balance the game and champions is because items do TOO MANY THINGS? They create an unbelievable amount of variables making it hard to see all ends when you change a champion.

Also, they homogenize champions. Champions become more similar than different when they purchase the same items.

7 Comments

Serevas2 votes

For example, Armor pen items should be specialty items for when you need to be able to kill a tank(s), but getting that armor pen item should make you less effective against say, squishy champions, that will respond more to raw damage and higher AD, and movement speed that might be associated with those items.

The one thing I'll say for that is that there is a difference between bonus armor penetration, percentage armor penetration, and flat armor penetration and they have different/better uses in varying circumstances.

Failog1 votes

Yeah but, come on, I mean how many champions rush Ghostblade or Black Cleaver regardless of the situation, while being totally correct to do so? Too many!

Serevas1 votes

Well every AD assassin needs flat penetration to assassinate squishy targets effectively, which is the entire point of the champion as a whole.

While every AD bruiser finds Black cleaver to be their option as it provides percentage penetration to cooperate with their base damages, while providing AD and HP, both stats they want.

I'm not sure what you're suggesting, should each Penetration item only have penetration on it and nothing else?

There's a reason core builds for champions exist, why some items are perceived as better than any other to start your build off. Items like Black Cleaver and Ghostblade fill necessary voids.

AD Bruiser needs to build HP, AD, CDR, and preferably some sort of Penetration to help get their damage through the base stats of their opponents. That's why it's still % penetration of all armor and not bonus armor. Nerf cleaver and you effectively plummet all bruisers straight into the ground, simply because some champions abuse the item much more than other champions.

Ghostblade is a similar situation, there are a bunch of champions that abuse it, but you don't hear people complaining about Gangplank or full AD Jarvan building the item.

Failog1 votes

My point is that there is no decision to make. You build Black Cleaver Ghostblade etc. The game is so static and boring now that there is little variation. I would like to see the game set up so you see a broader range of builds on a given champion for the situation they are in.

Serevas1 votes

That's largely not possible, being that a meta game exists there will always be an "optimal" path that will be the usual one taken on a champion.

Jhin is a prime example for this: Before Lethality became massive, the full CDR Crit build was his optimal build path, armor penetration was still a viable option, but crit was the stronger of the two builds, now Lethality is the better option, and the crit build is fully viable, but Lethality functions better in the current meta, it's the most optimal path.

Literally every game where options like this exist, there will be optimal build paths that present themselves and become the consistent. Other builds exist, they're not just as strong as the optimal choices.

The only way for this to not happen is for all items to be equal in power, at which point you might as well remove them, then you end up with Heroes of the Storm, which is actually the most boring game that I've ever played in my life, and I've been gaming for a long time.

Failog1 votes

Well I am sorry, but this sounds like very limited thinking. You have wrote it off as not possible because there will always be an "optimal path". Sure, as things are now. Instead of reducing it down to no items like Heroes of the Storm, I would want to

A)reduce items down to 1 or 2 things that they help with B)Make the strengths of different items more pronounced

More focused and pronounced items would produce a wider range of build paths if different items really did profoundly bring different things to the table.

Serevas1 votes

The difficulty of that you end up with it being nearly impossible for a Bruiser class to actually build items and get the stats they need. Items like item 3071 item 3078 item 3748 item 3074 item 3156 exist in order to aid in the difficulty of acquiring the stats they need to acquire. In my opinion the issue that actually comes in is when other champions that these items aren't necessarily intended for, begin to build them instead.

Things like MissFortune Lucian building item 3071

Or Yasuo building item 3022 to become a pseudotank in top lane

Shaco building tank/bruiser items like item 3748

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