Wait what? Meddler says Gnar needs nerfs. But you're buffing him?

DarwinTheory·Feb 7, 2018·3 votes·1,545 views

http://www.surrenderat20.net/2018/02/26-pbe-update.html

PBE Buffs as follows:

Gnar Hop (E) damage increased from 20/60/100/140/180 to 50/85/120/155/190

GNAR! (R) [Mini/Passive] Boomerang Throw on catch cooldown reduction lowered from 50/55/60% to 40% at all ranks

[Mega/Active] bonus AD ratio increased from 20% to 70%

Yet on same page same time:

Meddler: "Gnar - Needs clearer weaknesses enemies can play around, particularly in lane. Details also TBD."

Gnar is already supremely oppressive and toxic to play against so the solution is to buff him giving his AD ratio for R (amongst other buffs) a 250% increase???????

He can hop more now, do more damage and poke more with a lower CD boomerang?

I'm sorry this is just a joke. I get the distinct impression by these conflicting statements that there's little to no internal conversation at RIOT over balance.

10 Comments

CptPICHUFeb 7, 20183 votes

[Mega/Active] bonus AD ratio increased from 20% to 70%

Oh well... well shit. Thats pretty damn scary. To be fair, his Mini-Form gets nerfed on his most important spell: The Q. Since its CDR ist now LOWER. That means MORE cooldown on catch. But we'll see, there's still a lot of time for Riot to adjust Gnar, since this PBE Cycle ends.

BroLaneMar 16, 20183 votes

They need to buff him. Also the purpose of the changes was to punish passive play and encourage aggressive play, because the last thing we need is another Maokai .

redniwediSFeb 7, 20182 votes

My guess is they don't actually want him to be weaker, but do want to adjust where his power is in his kit. This would mean buffs to some parts of him to counteract nerfs to other parts, but it's very possible they are starting with one and handling the other after they see the effect of the first changes.

They do this a fair bit, but normally lead with the nerfs. I wonder what they are looking at to start with the buffs this time.

MordepoolFeb 7, 20183 votes

{quoted}

My guess is they don't actually want him to be weaker, but do want to adjust where his power is in his kit. This would mean buffs to some parts of him to counteract nerfs to other parts, but it's very possible they are starting with one and handling the other after they see the effect of the first changes.

They do this a fair bit, but normally lead with the nerfs. I wonder what they are looking at to start with the buffs this time.

He's been below 48% winrate for several patches. Probably. No offense I think a douche kit like this should be beaten more often

redniwediSFeb 7, 20181 votes

Before the new runes I had a decent ability to beat him in lane as Garen, though I think that's more because the Gnar always went into it expecting an easy lane than anything. I have no issue with a bit of short term guttering going on for him.

SalronFeb 7, 20182 votes

{quoted}

http://www.surrenderat20.net/2018/02/26-pbe-update.html

PBE Buffs as follows: [Mini/Passive] Boomerang Throw on catch cooldown reduction lowered from 50/55/60% to 40% at all ranks poke more with a lower CD boomerang?

Work on your reading comprehension, that's a nerf to the boomerang CD His core item is also getting nerfed very hard http://puu.sh/ziuUN/2997f763e4.jpg

Gnar doesn't build much raw AD, the ult buff isn't gamebreaking

DarwinTheoryFeb 7, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name=Face The Win,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jwydhb1e,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2018-02-07T09:10:32.596+0000)

poke more with a lower CD boomerang?

Work on your reading comprehension, that's a nerf to the boomerang CD His core item is also getting nerfed very hard http://puu.sh/ziuUN/2997f763e4.jpg

Gnar doesn't build much raw AD, the ult buff isn't gamebreaking

This is coming from a Yasuo and GP main. Safe farming endless poke freelo champs if there ever were. Jesus.

You have no idea how stupidly oppressive Gnar already is when you can safe farm and escape quickly. So what if the catch reduction is reduced slightly that still doesn't make up for the other buffs. He can already poke the nuts of you then jump away at will because of its stupidly low CD.

And Gnar also does % health damage with his ult after plastering you with poke and now when he all ins he will be even stronger with that AD buff. Hard CC, %health dmg and now a 2.5x buff on his AD ratio in an early game meta????? Yeah this won't end well.... I'll just watch the boards then when everyone starts crying I'll link this porter with a great big "I told you so"

Admiral FoobsterMar 16, 20181 votes

I think you missed the part where he is at about a 47% winrate (49% in proplay) in this patch. Mostly because he can't poke and his core item is nerfed too much. Even champs that he should counter like Nasus are shitting on him in lane.

LemurMonsterFeb 7, 20181 votes

Frozen Mallet slow for ranged champions has been nerfed to 15% from 30%. now useless on him.

So r buffs!! so useless.... Mains dont build damage. He doesnt have the attack range of a adc plus has the worst base armor in the game as well scaling as he levels up. pop goes gnar if you try to get close.

bad vs gapclosers.

stop making these threads you monkeys. thanks.

Admiral FoobsterFeb 26, 20181 votes

So, I am a Gnar main and I thought I would weigh in here. I have somewhere around 2k games on him since his release, which includes a two year period of not much activity on him. I have noticed until this last patch that his laning phase has a couple of key components that were addressed in the nerfs. Firstly, his Q poke is very strong. He has the ability to poke and farm from a relatively safe distance and then choose when to all in as form pops. I noticed laning wasn't too difficult and, unless I was getting camped, I usually came out ahead. Secondly, his E is very useful for avoiding ganks and all in situations. Against many champs, it's imperative that e is up when you farm so that you don't just get jumped and killed while in mini form. So this patch does a couple of things. First, it gives other laners some room to do their thing by reducing the refund on his Q. He can't just abuse people for 10 minutes anymore. He really has to work to position and catch all of those Qs. Secondly(and I think this is to compensate for his Q loss), he received damage on his E. This helps him not die to these bullies in lane that he has to deal with now. Although, I think the damage on his E may be negligible. I think this is fair in a world where Frozen Mallet isn't changed. Without access to the extra 15% slow, he is going to struggle in a lot of matchups. Just look at his winrate now as it stacks up from before the patch. He was already batting .49 and now his is sub .48. Clearly the nerfs were pretty hard on him. I don't know why you guys are all complaining. I think that people that complain about Gnar's ability to poke them out of lane are probably not playing the laning phase well. These people boil down to one of three categories. 1: People that just eat Q like it's some sort of delicacy. 2: People that don't know how to freeze lanes in good spots. 3: People that don't know how to trade and either go for extended trades when his cds are up or go for poor trades in minion waves. Can't tell you how many times a Nasus has tried to just stick to me and lost half of his health before he gets close enough to Q. I think that the rune page changes are slight nerfs to him also, but I haven't played around with the new resolve tree yet enough to know one way or the other. The changes to his AD ratios may lead him to play a different role in top. Maybe he will have to build slightly differently, because Frozen Mallet kind of sucks on him now. Thank god Black Cleaver still exists. He might be unplayable otherwise. Moral of the story is, Stop bitching about Gnar. His winrate is below 48% and he's struggling in the current patch. He struggles against the anti-tanks like Urgot and Trundle and he is break even with most of the other popular top lanes. He has an impressive 50.37% winrate vs Nasus, someone that he should crush in lane. He has a 50.29% winrate vs Trynd, another lane that should be easy until 20 minutes. I would love to hear how I am wrong. Always interested in getting better.