So how should passive supports be less passive?

Linna Excel··1 votes·723 views

It seems like there's an issue that the babysitter supports are a bit too reactive in the game and rarely proactive. In a way, I'm kind of surprised that riot was curious about what we think should be done because when you look at the passive supports, one thing they share in common is they lack tool to start a fight or trade aggressively.

So let's look at a few?

Janna - the once and future queen of win rate (seriously, support sion needs a nerf) P - boosts ally move speed towards janna, but janna isn't a tanky initator Q - the most telegraphed move in the game if you let it charge for damage, pretty weak if you don't. Even if you buy AP (and janna doesn't), it still not difficult to dodge after a second or two.
W - using this is basically a self snare that punishes the Janna player, even at full CDR you'll be slowed for longer than the guy you used it on E - defensive tool R - defensive/reset tool mostly. If you are good/lucky you can split an enemy team in two, but that doesn't happen all the time.

Soraka_ - Mercy's senpai (let's ship the two)_ P - enables you to play back from allies, yet if your EZ is kiting you despite being at 1% health and on fire, you still won't get to him in time Q - doesn't really deal damage, even if you build a bunch of AP, which you won't because support. This basically exists to enable your W and nothing else. Please let that sink in. Soraka's main damage spell is basically a set up for more healing and nothing else. In the past, you could go tank soraka and just wade into the enemy team to shred MR for your magic damage dealers. Now you can't.
W - Heals with no armor and more emo-ness! Using this can cost a ton of health, if you need to spam it, you better be using your ADC as a meat shield as you are just an extension of his health bar.
E - This skill really got butchered in the rework. While it does offer a root and AoE damage now, it's not hard to walk out of the zone. Even worse is it now costs mana and is on a long CD. Before the rework when it was manaless and on a 10 second CD you could easily trade with banana-E-banana on a consistent basis. I started this skill before soraka's rework because it use to enable aggressive play, but I don't any longer. R - Healorama! I guess this could be used as a passive aggressive skill in that if enough of your teammates are low in a fight you can ult to keep the fight going, but you've got no pick potential here, and as every Janna main will point out, hers heals more. Don't get me wrong, I like the skill and it shouldn't be changed, but it's not something you use to start a fight.

So for the iconic babysitters, their kits have little to nothing for them to encourage aggressive play. If you want them to be less passive, you'd have to rework both of these champ's Qs, Janna's W, and revert Soraka's E.

Basically if a champ is played passively, that is because it lacks tools for pro-active play making.

12 Comments

ChaddyFantome3 votes

there is nothing wrong with these supports. The problem is having to babysit the ADC.

A Doorknob2 votes

Soraka Q hurts... Maybe not like a Karma or zyra or annie, but land enough and watch their hp lower. Especially when the ADC is also aggressive.

As for Janna, she probably the most complicated in-lane support in game as well as the most OP. Watch Higher elos on youtube do it. Positioning is key with her. If you're hanging in the back behind your ADC like a lot of jannas I've seen do ,you might as well just not pick her up. She's kite queen extraordinaire and master of psychological warfare.

Skia Asteri1 votes

Delete item 3301 , problem solved.

Ravenhale1 votes

You could extend their AA range to 600 for chuckles. ^_^

RogueWill1 votes

That would broke them due to the Bandit mastery she woudl be able to get stupid amount of gold at no risk since they out ranges the adc. Hell, adc Annie used to work mainly due to stupid range she used to have so i could see some cheese build on raka an janna since both of them benefits quite poorly of AP or CD.

Ravenhale1 votes

Janna does poorly with CD...?

You know her W and E are fixed CD, right? They don't go down with levels.

I'll give you Soraka though. They had to amp up the mana costs on her skills because only her E had a notable CD. Soraka already has a 550 AA range anyways. I doubt the extra 50 range would even register. Either the Soraka player already knows she's got good AA harass or they like playing passive. Janna is one of those lowly 475 mages though. It's like trying to AA harass with Morgana (450 range there).

RogueWill1 votes

550 is the same range as most adc, so if soraka can hit them they can hit back. the extra 50 would give her safety since she would outrange anyone that isn't caitlyn or tristana, making possible to do some weird things like go full AD runes and punish the adc early without affecting her final build much (usually you run full defensive set of runes so you just will have to rush some MR and armor early)

Ravenhale1 votes

You speak as if Soraka (along with several Support Mages with the 550 range) is a hard counter to Sivir and Lucian (both with a normal AA range of 500).

RogueWill1 votes

You know why Annie support suddenly became unpopular and replaced with brand? is because her AA got reduced so her harass potential went really low (used to be 625). I'm not saying is a hard counter, I'm saying is a considerable buff and will increase the "hidden" harass tools of the champion. If you are used to AA the adc constantly the damage racks up pretty fast. Btw works better on sivir than lucian due to luc dash making him able to burst you down quite easily.

Ravenhale1 votes

I'm aware that Lucian has to use an ability to counter the harass. As does Sivir. As do most ADC. You were presenting the range as evidence of free harass. Free harass is more of a matter of when you do it, not negligible range advantages. It's either the ADC is not paying attention, or you are forcing them to chose between CS and trading.

Annie still outranges most ADC with 575 and also can hold her stun for free stun harass. She is a single target nuisance. If she is harassing the ADC, the support is not taking damage or vice versa.

My opinion is Annie fell out of popularity when there were options to damage both of your laning opponents. If you're going to go damage, pick someone that can do more. Brand AND Vel'Koz both replaced her because they can zone off both opponents better with their long range AoE abilities.

Maximum Morde1 votes

Reduce range of Soraka's heal to 125.

Aptest1 votes

There is no real problem in champion diversity in the support role. We've got a bunch of protect the carry guys Soraka Janna , a bunch of kill the other carry guys Annie , some overall damagers Brand , Zyra , a bunch of tanks Alistar Braum Blitzcrank , a bunch of roamers Bard TahmKench . one or two jack of all trades Sona Lulu Thresh and for some reason also an ADC MissFortune, thank you gorilla, and a split pushers Singed .

The problem is the role, not the champions.

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