that you don't understand jungle routes. that you don't ward. that you ignore wards. that you don't know how to control your lane. that you make yourself a free kill.
its not your junglers fault that you are bad, and feed the enemy. Ultimately losing your lane, and feeding the enemy jungler in the process.
FrozenFrostFyre34 votesI get that junglers in lower elo get blamed for random things that's out of their control, but i've seen enough junglers still at 0/1/0 at the 20min mark to know that some of you don't even bother look at lanes. I've seen junglers KS both kills tax half the wave and wonder why you are still losing the lane since their gank obviously helped so much. I've been blamed when they want to counter jungle while im shoved in and literally cannot roam to help them. I've seen junglers camp that toplane shen and sure gets him ahead, but it's also a fucking shen who's definitely not going to carry. I've been blamed about losing lane all by myself or losing the 2v2 when in reality their jungler/midlane roam constantly meanwhile i can't get even a single gank in 20mins csing under tower.
I try to stick up for junglers who are doing their best or doing other things on the map when the rager goes off blaming them from not setting up tent in their bush 24/7, but SOME of you guys are real assholes about the multiple mistakes you make and only try to shift the blame so you can continue to feel good about yourselves while learning nothing.
two sides to the coin huh?
Dllesh12 votesu said what i wanted to say with less swearing, rage and hate and i thank you for that
Larriet3 votesAs a support player, I agree that it's silly to always assume it's never the jungler/support's fault, which is a common sentiment (at least outside of games, lol). Generally, if I'm losing lane (mid more than support; botlane is pretty volatile and some of my supports lack agency in lane) for whatever reason, I don't blame the jungler though; ultimately, there's likely something I could've done better to not be losing, regardless of how well our jungler is doing.
Hügö4 votesSo when the jungler is 0/1/0 at 20min your team did something horribly wrong. Most likely they all lost lane and then it would be the most %%%%%%ed idea for your jungler to just try anthing. He is better of with trying to farm as much as he can.
FrozenFrostFyre2 votesSo when the jungler is 0/1/0 at 20min your team did something horribly wrong. Most likely they all lost lane and then it would be the most %%%%%%ed idea for your jungler to just try anthing. He is better of with trying to farm as much as he can.
I'm going to try and be as constructive about this advice as possible: this is a bad mentality to have. you will gain elo by not having this mentality as a jungler. you blaming things outside of your control is never going to gain you more lp. you actively trying to gank other lanes and make the difference will however gain you lp. I know there are some games that maybe it was completely out of your hands right? it's really hard to win them all, but there are also same games were by doing nothing you secure the loss on an otherwise completely winnable game. these types of games impact a large amount because then you must win 2 games to make up for this one loss where you should have won. and both of these new games your mentality and therefore your mistakes have a chance to creep in and force you to lose even more.
H1de on blue2 votesI'm going to try and be as constructive about this advice as possible: this is a bad mentality to have. you will gain elo by not having this mentality as a jungler. you blaming things outside of your control is never going to gain you more lp. you actively trying to gank other lanes and make the difference will however gain you lp. I know there are some games that maybe it was completely out of your hands right? it's really hard to win them all, but there are also same games were by doing nothing you secure the loss on an otherwise completely winnable game. these types of games impact a large amount because then you must win 2 games to make up for this one loss where you should have won. and both of these new games your mentality and therefore your mistakes have a chance to creep in and force you to lose even more.
Spoken like someone who hasn't spent any meaningful time in the Jungle the past 6 months
FrozenFrostFyre1 votesI mean I don't main jungle, but I could play the role at a low plat level because I have a good mentality and know what the jungle position is suppose to be doing at any given point in time. It's a really simple role when you get right down to it. It's about who has initive and who doesn't. It's about being in the right place at the right time. It takes a lot of game knowledge to know where or when that right place and time is. And I can understand how many people stuggle with it. But if the very first thing you do is try to shift blame then yes you are trapped in your elo for a very specific reason. Even more tragic is how easily you could climb out if you focused on what you could have done better, but it's easier to play the victim isn't it?
H1de on blue1 votesI mean I don't main jungle, but I could play the role at a low plat level because I have a good mentality and know what the jungle position is suppose to be doing at any given point in time. It's a really simple role when you get right down to it. It's about who has initive and who doesn't. It's about being in the right place at the right time. It takes a lot of game knowledge to know where or when that right place and time is. And I can understand how many people stuggle with it. But if the very first thing you do is try to shift blame then yes you are trapped in your elo for a very specific reason. Even more tragic is how easily you could climb out if you focused on what you could have done better, but it's easier to play the victim isn't it?
Lol you're a funny guy. I can't wait till the new multi ranked system comes out so you can see just how wrong you actually are. Also i love how you say it's a simple role and then say it "takes a lot of game knowledge" like you couldn't even go 2 sentences without contradicting yourself.
FrozenFrostFyre1 votesNot a contradiction at all. Jungle isn't mechanically intensive at all it's a very basic role you just have to not be a complete moron and look at your map to play it. I can pm you again my plat rank in jungle once it comes out. Plat players make a ton of mistakes so it won't be very hard for me.
FrozenFrostFyre1 votesAlso the very first time I got plat in season 3 was playing jungle, because I wasn't a very mechically strong player, but knew how to actually use my brain instead of going on autopilot. I also looked at my minimal constantly and tracked enemy jungler. This stuff isn't hard.
Hügö3 votesGood thing I climbed high enough with this mentality to judge it. In the case that your jungler is 0/1/0 and I mean in THAT case your team most likely failed in every lane. So your teammates are weak and the enemy is strong, going for a gank will most likely end in a double kill or a 1 for 1 trade which still sucks and is not worth it. When your jungler is 0/1/0 and yout lanes are doing good it is the fault of your jungler won't say anything else. But in most cases it is that your lanes fail and they then expect some miracle from your jungler which he can't deliver and it results in "lul better jungle wins ggez". But I forgot that saying something against laners in this board is forbidden. [sg-lulu]
HeeroTX1 votesIf jungle is 0/1/0 at 20 mins, they need to gank. Period, full stop.
Here is why: Pick one lane, ANY lane, I honestly do not care which. Get THAT lane ahead or at LEAST on an even keel. Jungler farming up from 0/1/0 does NOTHING. You're NOT going to carry because if ALL the lanes are losing then all those lanes have lost and 99.9% of the time THEIR jungler is ahead of you ALSO. So basically you can either proactively TRY to claw your way back into the game by getting a numbers advantage with YOUR superior insight and planning , or you can watch all your lanes bleed to death while you impotently do nothing.
I say this as a laner who has lost many games because all the OTHER lanes and my jungle fell behind and my farming/even play against my lane opponent did JACKSHIT once they all started rotating in midgame. If you think farming is the best choice after 20 mins BECAUSE all the lanes are losing then just say what you're REALLY thinking and spam FF.
Hügö3 votesYou suck at this game. Period, full stop.
You have no knowledge about the game. Forcing ganks is the same thing as running it down mid.
As i said i climbed high enough with what I said, and as long as you are not smurf (what i doubt at 44% wr) you shouldn't talk like you know anything about the game.
HeeroTX1 votesAlso, since you apparently haven't played in over a YEAR, let me let you in on a "secret", with Riot's current design decisions, if your whole team is BEHIND at 20 mins, you're not gonna be able to "farm up" to get the win. The other team is gonna steamroll your ass with the snowball they've already built. Honestly, the game in its current state will not ALLOW you to climb back in with only farm from that state. You can't get enough vision to do it safely, and they're gonna be way too strong for you to fight on your own.
Kovorix2 votesJust accept that you have no clue of what you are talking with your whooping 44% wr in fucking silver.
HeeroTX1 votesOK, Diamond-sensei, please explain to me how YOU are going to win a game where your WHOLE TEAM is behind at 20 mins, you're 0/1/0 as a jungle and you're gonna just "farm up". That's all I wanna know. EDIT: And I don't even mean that as sarcastically as it reads. In this META please tell me how you (or anyone) would win the game that way
My winrate is 3 things:
Kovorix1 votesI climb and win with the exact same thing as Hügö said. When you as a jungler fall behind you can't force things it will end badly in 4 out of 5 times. The way to win is be patient farm and wait for an opportunity where the enemy makes a missplay. When you force things you throw.
To your winrate:
HeeroTX1 votesI generally don't blame others, my primary goal is always to make myself NOT "too heavy to carry". "Don't feed" is my mantra, but that's not going to get the W when the rest of your team IS feeding (that's not me blaming my team, that's Hügö's contention that I was questioning) If ANYONE (jg or laner) is 0/1/0 and other lanes are WINNING, then I agree, patience is key, the point is when they are LOSING.
Example: when I have a game (true story) where enemy duo bot dives our duo bot lane, my support dies. Enemy adc stays at Tier 1 turret (which is over half health), enemy (tank) support CONTINUES chasing me to Tier 2 turret and my jungle is literally farming the camp RIGHT NEXT TO MY LANE. A solo enemy is between 2 of our turrets, we KNOW there's no enemy jungler because OUR jungler is right there and instead of helping me out, they're farming. Enemy support kills me and then gets away, our jungler farms for the whole fight and leaves after clearing his camp (not even an attempt to threaten the support). And the enemy laner wasn't like 4 levels higher or anything (we got poked and then bullied back).
The above is not what I consider a "normal" game, but an example of the problem with "afk farm" junglers. But if the whole team is losing at 20 mins, there's no way the jungler can farm "safely". At that point laners can't even farm safely without conceding too many objectives, because all the enemy has to do is apply pressure to the weak lanes. Once all the Tier 1s are gone you have priority on most of the map. If you abandon all lanes (waiting for the "perfect" opportunity) you're just going to slowly bleed to death minus a HUGE mistake by the enemies. And even those are usually correctable after the fact if lanes have been losing THAT badly.
Kovorix1 votesYour example is what I said an opporunity and not a forced gank. But when you jungler is like "oh fuck my whole team is losing I need to do something" he is going to make stupid decision and will lose you the game.
Rock MD1 votesBut I forgot that saying something against laners in this board is forbidden. [sg-lulu]
Yes that's why OP's post with sweeping generalizations against laners got downvoted and sweeping generalizations about junglers being garbage at knowing how to macro get upvoted.
Oh wait...
Baby Ghoul2 votesI get that junglers in lower elo get blamed for random things that's out of their control, but i've seen enough junglers still at 0/1/0 at the 20min mark to know that some of you don't even bother look at lanes. I've seen junglers KS both kills tax half the wave and wonder why you are still losing the lane since their gank obviously helped so much. I've been blamed when they want to counter jungle while im shoved in and literally cannot roam to help them. I've seen junglers camp that toplane shen and sure gets him ahead, but it's also a fucking shen who's definitely not going to carry. I've been blamed about losing lane all by myself or losing the 2v2 when in reality their jungler/midlane roam constantly meanwhile i can't get even a single gank in 20mins csing under tower.
I try to stick up for junglers who are doing their best or doing other things on the map when the rager goes off blaming them from not setting up tent in their bush 24/7, but SOME of you guys are real assholes about the multiple mistakes you make and only try to shift the blame so you can continue to feel good about yourselves while learning nothing.
two sides to the coin huh?
I'm glad someone said it. I'm so tired of these types of threads. They're annoying and pointless. The people who blame junglers for their own mistakes aren't going to magically see the light. Meanwhile there are soooo many junglers in Gold and Platinum that ignore lanes and don't apply pressure anywhere on the map.
Literally anywhere. I don't even care if it is my lane. As long as pressure is being applied somewhere, then there's hope for late game.
I don't even expect counter pressure anymore from the majority of junglers. If I'm ganked, then I just accept that I will be camped with no outside help and try to brace as best I can for the impact, and sometime that's just the way the cookie crumbles. Getting other lanes ahead that will be more viable is sometimes the best option.
I'm so thankful when I get one who actually LOOKS at what is going on in the lane. If a Lucian/Brand enemy bot are pressuring bot really hard under their tower, and then get a gank from both their jungler and their midlaner, MAYBE it is a good idea to make sure that situation doesn't spiral out of control.
If you don't apply pressure anywhere or try to help out lanes that clearly aren't playing dumb, but are getting hit hard by the enemy TEAM, then you, as a jungler, are also to blame for why an ADC gets so far ahead.
Jungling is the most demanding position in League, so I excuse a lot. Effort is what matters. Sometimes you just lose, but I'm so over junglers who have contributed nothing to any lane getting snotty in all chat talking about how X lane fed or is useless.
It is a big problem right now.
[sg-lulu]
Rewt13 votesIf your top laner is 0/2 before we even reach level 3 we usually just say "oh well I guess Ill just camp bot lane.
Warlord Rhinark2 votesIf your top laner is 0/2 before we even reach level 3 we usually just say "oh well I guess Ill just camp bot lane.
...which is kinda sad, don't you think?
That the meta has gotten to a point where completely ignoring a teammate in order to (hopefully) get someone else incredibly fed is the only viable option, instead of trying to get him back on his feet by helping him out.
It might always have been like this, I don't know. I just certainly feel it a lot more nowadays.
xxxDogmanxxx4 votesIt's always been like that for as far back as I can remember, and I've been playing on and off since before season 1, before there was even a jungle ROLE. Helping a losing teammate has never been worth the time you could have spent helping a winning teammate win harder.
Mimr4 votes[{quoted}](name=Warlord Rhinark,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jakANHT2,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-12-17T07:30:59.848+0000)
...which is kinda sad, don't you think?
That the meta has gotten to a point where completely ignoring a teammate in order to (hopefully) get someone else incredibly fed is the only viable option, instead of trying to get him back on his feet by helping him out.
It might always have been like this, I don't know. I just certainly feel it a lot more nowadays.
Trying to help a toplaner who has gone 0/2 in 3 mins has never been option for about as long as I can remember (and I've actively jungled ever since S2) because at that point most toplaners can 1v2 you.
Rewt2 votesIts always been this way. Plus. If your Top laner is 0/2 before you even reach level 3. Then likely they are a pretty shit player. And if you help them come back that just means that they are worth gold and XP again for the enemy top laner to farm.
The jungle role has always been about figuring out the who is worth helping on your team and who is gonna hold you back if you dedicate any time to them.
LordGeovanni1 voteswhich is stupid because the enemy top laner is now more worth more gold for you to snowball harder if you your self arent brain dead along with your top laner which dieing twice in a low range heavy fight lane is not an idicator as you slowly jungle and chase scuttles while the enemy may or may not be ganking or pressureing that gets their allies ahead even without a successful gank.
Rewt2 votesif your top laner is 0/2 before you even reach level 3 they probably arent worth helping. The best way to handle it is to wait for your top laner to die and then have Mid help you kill top. This keeps your top laner worth jack shit, but allows you and your laners to get the shutdown bonus. And hey. If your top lane dies 2 more times then the enemy top laner probably like 100 gold and a pathetic amount of XP. But you can roll up with Mid lane again and fuck him for a bunch of gold and XP.
In reality. As a jungler you have to be able to identify when one of your teammates is straight brain dead. Ive had times where I rolled up top lane once. And my laner killed the enemy before I even got there. Then the enemy ganked him 4 times. The enemy top got all 4 kills. My top laner 2 levels down 1v1d the enemy top laner 7 times in a row. That enemy top laner was actually %%%%%%ed.
AR URF1 votesIf your top laner is 0/2 before we even reach level 3 we usually just say "oh well I guess Ill just camp bot lane.
As someone that lanes. If I'm mid, going even 0/0 or 0/1 or 1/1 and bot lane is 3/0 within 5 minutes and top is 0/2 within 5 minutes. And I see my jungler focus top lane, I'm going to speak up and tell him to camp bot lane. Likewise if i'm 0/2 I'm going to say don't come to my lane. But this narrative that junglers are without fault needs to stop.
PhearBunny10 votes9/10 times a guy is spamming me for a gank. Its a 0-3 top laner who cant even participate in the gank without dying, and theres no chance in hell I can duel your fed opponent unless he tower dives you.
In which case ill be at your tower when the wave crashes onto it.
OneMustFall10 votesOh this topic again.
The bad jungler's warcry...
"It's not my responsibility!"
I love when a jungler doesn't gank at all and expects a laner to win their lane when the enemy jungle has ganked them four times and is 2v1 turret diving them. My favorite kind of jungler.
WøOxer6 votesOh this topic again.
The bad jungler's warcry...
"It's not my responsibility!"
I love when a jungler doesn't gank at all and expects a laner to win their lane when the enemy jungle has ganked them four times and is 2v1 turret diving them. My favorite kind of jungler.
I love when my mid laner dies near enemy turret and then blames jungler "what a trash jungler".
I love when my mid laner's vision score entire game is 8 and bought pinkwards/placed pinkwards 0.
I love how my mid laner's don't understand how the wave push / freezing works.
Ionian Vulpix9 votesTrue. But I will blame the jungler for doing nothing if the enemy jungller is camping my lane. If you aren't going to gank us, that's fine. Get something done elsewhere. Take their camps, gank a different lane, Do SOMETHING other than wait for your raptors to respawn.
y0r1ck6 votesI hope you feel better, but this is just another rage post from a salty jungler...
How about you make another post. This time give some tips: when you expect a jg to gank, when to ward, how to control your wave. Since you're so knowledgeable about the jungle I think you've got a great opportunity to help out.
nelogis6 votesyou know.... this also works the other way
Not your laners fault that you can't ward and get counterjungled constantly. Not your laners fault that you can't secure the scuddle. Not your laners fault that you get invaded 24/7 and get killed non-stop or get denied of all your jungle.
It's not your laners fault that
you are bad, and feed the enemy. Ultimately losing your
jungle and feed the solo-laners in the process
FioraWillCarry1 votesNot your laners fault that you can't secure the scuddle.
This one is actually wrong. Every single high elo streamer I've ever watched ALWAYS mentions lane priority when deciding if they want to contest scuttle. If a scuttle is up and they suspect the enemy jungler is near, they will always check to see if the nearest lanes have priority. If they do, they will contest. The laners must use that priority to help get that scuttle. Every player in Masters and Challenger understands this instinctively. You never have to ask laners in high elo to do this.
nelogis1 votesYes like I shouldn't be asking the jungler to do his job that is what I'm trying to get across
Like ganking a lane that is balls-deep pushed up for 3mins straight
Sometimes the jungler should be asking himself if maybe he was the problem in this situation, hey maybe that top laner that got counterpicked and was under his tower trying his best to cs anything while getting dove twice in laning phase is actually the junglers mistake, maybe he should have done something to help him out.
But no, the jungler has the gull to tell him "ward and play safe" "damn top diff unlucky" while he tries to gank a Fizz mid for the 5th time and fails again.
Junglers are really good at telling themselfes that they did nothing wrong and it's the laners fault for losing and not warding to fend off ganks.
Also they are really good at asking for help at scuddle while no lane in range has priority then blaming laners for not understanding game mechanics since they didn't help him.
But thinking that HE did something wrong? no, never!
1 Nasus 4 Tards5 votesIts generally not your laner's fault:
that you invade when they dont have priority and you die in the process. that they keep getting ganked and tower dove while you afk farm and do nothing. if they dont help when you get invaded because they are pushed in and would lose the early 2v2. they can't lane anymore because your stupid ass fed their lane for no reason.
ØrnnToGetTrolleÐ4 votesAFK jungler confirmed.
Illabethe3 votesWhy are you posting biased crap?
It goes the other way:
If the jungler does the latter, It IS the jungler's fault. That shows a lack of understanding, teamwork, and knowing the basics of keeping a team balanced.
If the jungler does the prior, then perhaps the laner has some fault.
If the jungler solo camps top in this game, he's playing an extreme risk that bot will lose the balance, or prolong lane too long, and a hard carry adc will get ahead of the other lanes and win team fights/split pushes.
If the jungler idles mid, he's probably wasting some time except on some exclusive junglers who are good at diving short lanes. He risks top and bot both losing the balance, and making the mid lead negligible. He also has the highest risk of feeding in mid lane, because it is the shortest distance for the other jungler too, and turrets play a larger role in this fight.
It's not as cut and dry as blaming teammates for you not doing your job.
P.S. I play both sides of the fence. I get my share of negative criticism from players who don't know the strong gank patterns or always have to blame the jungler where they die 2 seconds after getting back to lane. I know it all. There are exceptions to what I'm saying. But generally..... junglers need to accept this side too.
FioraWillCarry1 votes{quoted} 3) If the jungler camps a winning lane who counters its opponents strongly, then he is probably wasting resources, stealing their XP, CS, and putting them behind where they would be.
This is so wrong, it's not even funny. Camping the winning lane should be the default behavior of all junglers. Nothing tilts me more than to see a jungler trying to camp for a feeder. On the rare occasions that I feed in lane, going like 0-2 or more, I have to beg my junglers not to come. I never understand why they would even bother coming to my lane when I've already died like 4 times and our bot lane is 6-0. Fucking go bot. They are in the best position to carry. Make sure that the enemy mid lane and jungler don't fuck up our winning bot lane. My lane is already lost. You coming top is only going to give him a double kill.
I've been hard winnin top lane a lot the last week on Fiora and I've lose count of how many times I've had enemy junglers try to help their top when I'm 3-0 and I ended up killing them both. I got so used to it that when I go 3-0 or 4-0 in lane now, I want the jungler to come and try to help his feeding top laner. I'd start hard shoving and deliberately over extending just to attract his attention.
Camp your winning lanes. Stop ganking for feeders.
Illabethe1 votesThis is so wrong, it's not even funny. Camping the winning lane should be the default behavior of all junglers. Nothing tilts me more than to see a jungler trying to camp for a feeder. On the rare occasions that I feed in lane, going like 0-2 or more, I have to beg my junglers not to come. I never understand why they would even bother coming to my lane when I've already died like 4 times and our bot lane is 6-0. Fucking go bot. They are in the best position to carry. Make sure that the enemy mid lane and jungler don't fuck up our winning bot lane. My lane is already lost. You coming top is only going to give him a double kill.
I've been hard winnin top lane a lot the last week on Fiora and I've lose count of how many times I've had enemy junglers try to help their top when I'm 3-0 and I ended up killing them both. I got so used to it that when I go 3-0 or 4-0 in lane now, I want the jungler to come and try to help his feeding top laner. I'd start hard shoving and deliberately over extending just to attract his attention.
Camp your winning lanes. Stop ganking for feeders.
You really need to actually read the posts you reply to.
In this situation, you replied to a scenario where a winning lane COUNTERS ITS OPPONENT STRONGLY. There is no net benefit from ganking such a lane. The results are as follows:
-1) You set them behind where they would be if they absorbed the SOLE benefits of winning that lane -2) You dramatically shorten any farming phase they might have had by accelerating their lane win, which on net puts them behind in gold, levels, and makes them shut-downable by team play. -3) You risk part of your jungle being taken over. -4) Lanes who actually might do okay with some help..... won't..... because you are being greedy and trying to mooch a more competent player than yourself.
FioraWillCarry1 votesIt doesn't matter what the circumstances are, if you have a lane that 0-3 and one that's 3-0, you gank the one that is 3-0, no exceptions. Doesn't matter if the winning lane is winning because he is hard countering the enemy. You just don't play around a lost lane. Today I had several games with a jungle duo where I had to ask him to play around bot because I fed in top, going like 0-3. It was the right call in every single game.
One particularly memorable game, I went 0-3 or 0-4 or some shit like that. While I was feeding my ass off, we had a 7-4 Lucian in bot lane. My jungler came top to invade and we ended up in a skirmish which we lost badly because the enemy top was too far ahead. I told him to stop playing around top side and go play around bot because they are stronger. He did. Lucian was like 17-5 or something next 10 minutes. Many of those kills came from the our jungler just going berserk in skirmishes near bot side and Lucian was able to win them all the skirmishes and get super fed very very quickly. If he wasted time trying to help me, that would have left the enemy mid and enemy jungler free to turn our 7-4 Lucian into a 7-8 Lucian. Want to take a guess what happened to me that game? Well the fed Lucian and the rest of my team was outputting so much pressure that the fed enemy top had to help his team. As a result, I was able to peacefully farm myself back into the game, a thing that would not have been possible had our jungler not ignored my lane. The enemy top just couldn't sit on me anymore to keep me from becoming relevant.
There is no downside whatsoever to ganking a winning lane.
GripaAviara2 votesAs someone who occasionally rages at junglers and an ex jungler main, it generally is the jungler's fault.
In lower ELO, jungler is 50% of the early game.
I stopped playing jungle because is a hard dynamic role that in the end is unsatisfying. You need to have constant map awareness and imho the most game knowledge. It's HARD and DRAINING. But people that play it pick it despite this and not being proefficent.
But most people in silver/gold elo go jungle without any idea and literary lose the game. Mostly because is a feedback less role that's very very important.
You can be the main cause the game is lost, but you might have a positive score compared to your team and "the feeling" you were better.
You are not directly punished for not doing your role. Every lane has a turret, has constant interaction and you can literary stay all the game in your jungle and farm, get a random kill and at the end : "why you noobs lost the game?"
As a jungler you need to put your lanes in an advantage, you need to apply pressure and you need to be there at key moments. The early game is literarily decided a lot of times by a good proactive vs bad jungler. No to say most times junglers are out of team comp, last picking champs like master yi when the team needs early support due to comp
To exemplify this: Imagine a game in which every lane is midly losing. Enemy jungler forces bot lane and your jungler just ganks an easy mid lane where you have an assassin like zed. Now this can be good-ish, but then that Zed never ganks, it's already lvl 7, Zed stays in lane but your jungler still just ganks mid. The enemy keeps getting advange in bottom lane and top can't leave a high pressure lane to help. In the end who thinks wins?
tl;dr In lower ELO, a big chunk of junglers don't play the role ok. This is not their fault, is mostly Riot's because there is no direct feedback mechanism for the jungler so that he can improve his game
UlyssesISR1 votesAs someone who occasionally rages at junglers and an ex jungler main, it generally is the jungler's fault.
Textbook example of an appeal to authority.
One of the worst possible ways to establish an argument, that couldn't be any further from the truth.
GripaAviara1 votesthat couldn't be any further from the truth.
Care to expand the idea?
UlyssesISR1 votesCare to expand the idea?
Elaborate on the idea that "I have experience in said role, therefor what I say is true about said role". Or the idea that one player in a group of five is solely responsible for that groups loss. Essentially saying in a game where there are ten players in total, only two actually matter...
I don't know man, what do you think is wrong with both of these claims...
Malix Farwin2 votesIt's not your laner's fault if you:
Pick bad river fights. Die when you invade. Gank when the lane is not setup for one. Miss Smite Don't Ward your jungle Don't know how to control your Jungle Make yourself a Free Kill.
Not HeIping You1 votes[{quoted}](name=Malix Farwin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jakANHT2,comment-id=001a,timestamp=2018-12-28T17:12:51.719+0000)
It's not your laner's fault if you:
Pick bad river fights. Die when you invade. Gank when the lane is not setup for one. Miss Smite Don't Ward your jungle Don't know how to control your Jungle Make yourself a Free Kill.
you forgot to include, "pick a champion that can't jungle and afk farm for 20 minutes while being 0/0/0 while we lose 4v5"