What the fuck is wrong with Yi?

TrikzterzArma··84 votes·17,556 views

I can't be the only one fucking hating Yi. Such an unbalanced champ. Just rightclicks you to death. Trying to kill him? No fuck you, he just needs to press Q.

"Just stun him". If stuns is the only counter to a champ, that champ is not balanced.

Fuck Yi.

95 Comments

BLIGHTBRINGER44 votes

I like that he can't be countered by items like item 3110 item 3143 because you know, slow immunity on his R applies for attack speed slow as well.

Daddy Ants4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Darkin Hybrid,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ivG4vrah,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-09-25T13:12:55.502+0000)

I like that he can't be countered by items like item 3110 item 3143 because you know, slow immunity on his R applies for attack speed slow as well.

He is immune to slows and cripples yes.

Randuin's Omen, Frozen Heart and Thornmail are Cripple effects.

Awoof17 votes

Thanks for repeating the same thing they said.

ZerglingOne2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Darkin Hybrid,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ivG4vrah,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-09-25T13:12:55.502+0000)

I like that he can't be countered by items like item 3110 item 3143 because you know, slow immunity on his R applies for attack speed slow as well.

The game was worse when it didn't count as a regular slow. It made AD Yi and Olaf almost unplayable. It was part of the reason AP Yi arose in the first place.

It's one thing in DotA where attack speed is a flat integer, and reductions are also integers. But the way it worked always felt awful in LoL. A 20% attack speed reduction means total attack speed. And with no BKB in LoL, there's literally no way around an attack speed slow when it's not considered a normal slow.

Hence, the way it works now is better than it was before. But the ASPD slow numbers on FH and Randuin's also need to be higher now because slow resistance exists, and AFAIK it should affect attack speed slows.

I say they should each reduce your bonus attack speed by 30%, reducible by all sources of slow resist. Not able to be reduced below your base attack delay...same for wither.

This gives a very real reason for Phase Rush to be used often rather than as a niche pick against Nasus, and makes item 3009 a more valid choice of boots overall.

It also makes FH and Randuin's feel less bad for people who don't auto attack as a normal means of damaging, as well as making the items overall stronger in the mid and late game against their intended targets.

Just the Lip11 votes

?

yi main here.

very complicated champ to play properly,

if you dont believe me you try playing him, see if u can dodge spells with q, reset ur AA and aa again with w, use ur items and smite at proper times to stop run aways and do dot dmg.

if you do not have foresight as to what the enemy will do against u, u will die easy.

So basically the only way yi's are good is if they can predict enemy movements/spells and farm up as much as possible.

Dont see why your are mad at yi, learn how to play him, and you will see countering him is easy.

Rαy39 votes

"very complicated champ to play properly"

XD

AggressiveWolf26 votes

'Garen bro i garen main he champ hard play yes?'

TehNACHO10 votes

I'm probably gonna get murdered for being a Mastery 7 Yi and Garen player but

Perhaps we can separate complicated and difficult? Like Hellawhite is just straight up wrong, Yi is mechanically simple unless you play Mid Lane Yi which is nobody, but being a squishy melee with no good defensive waveclear is pretty difficult against a team with basically any macro coordination.

Just throwing in 2 cents.

Mecha Incognito5 votes

Very true, people think that being mechanically simple instantly means your champ is "easy" to play - not understanding that that simplicity is what causes them to be weak more often then not. Ofcourse, there are times when patches / certain items can be exploited by them and they become overbearing but those tend to be few and far between, usually the simpler a champion is the worse they tend to be.

Bjørnetjenesten4 votes

Yeah i stopped reading after that line xd

Wilyum7 votes

{quoted}

?

yi main here.

very complicated champ to play properly,

if you dont believe me you try playing him, see if u can dodge spells with q, reset ur AA and aa again with w, use ur items and smite at proper times to stop run aways and do dot dmg.

if you do not have foresight as to what the enemy will do against u, u will die easy.

So basically the only way yi's are good is if they can predict enemy movements/spells and farm up as much as possible.

Dont see why your are mad at yi, learn how to play him, and you will see countering him is easy.

This is a lie. Yi is a beginner champion if the champions only challenge is predicting otherwise players movements and spells than he is easy because literally every other Champ has to do the same. The problem with yi is how he can delete someone with auto attacks, a Zed ults me then lands every q or a lux hits full combo on me I deserve to die. There is no counter play to a yi running you down and auto attacking. Also there is no counter build, even a full tank Nautilus gets rekt by yi because of %health and conquer

Blackii72 votes

{quoted}

This is a lie. Yi is a beginner champion if the champions only challenge is predicting otherwise players movements and spells than he is easy because literally every other Champ has to do the same. The problem with yi is how he can delete someone with auto attacks, a Zed ults me then lands every q or a lux hits full combo on me I deserve to die. There is no counter play to a yi running you down and auto attacking. Also there is no counter build, even a full tank Nautilus gets rekt by yi because of %health and conquer

Zed kills you with a single spell rotation without an Ult, what are you talking about? So do most Champions. With Yi you got 2 options, On-hit and Crit. You need to learn how to stack your Guinsoo's properly or you are screwed in a fight. If you go Crit, it is very expensive to build and tanks counts that build. Unless you go Dark Harvest Yi, with Warrior, Stormrazor and Shiv you can't one-shot someone. Unlike Lux's QER or Zed's WEQ at 1 item.

I usually pick assassins against Yi, or Tanks if their team is AD based. Assassins like Zix and Eve. Tanks like Rammus and Amumu. and If i have the chance to i pick Jax, works great against Yi, counters him, currently strong but not broken and does well generally.

Wilyum2 votes

{quoted}

Zed kills you with a single spell rotation without an Ult, what are you talking about? So do most Champions. With Yi you got 2 options, On-hit and Crit. You need to learn how to stack your Guinsoo's properly or you are screwed in a fight. If you go Crit, it is very expensive to build and tanks counts that build. Unless you go Dark Harvest Yi, with Warrior, Stormrazor and Shiv you can't one-shot someone. Unlike Lux's QER or Zed's WEQ at 1 item.

I usually pick assassins against Yi, or Tanks if their team is AD based. Assassins like Zix and Eve. Tanks like Rammus and Amumu. and If i have the chance to i pick Jax, works great against Yi, counters him, currently strong but not broken and does well generally.

But what I am saying is once it reaches the point where Yi has 2 items then there is no counter. I admit Jax is a counter but he also has a high ban rate, zed and lux at least have counter play in my opinion, I have never been one shot by a zed with one spell rotation without his ult. You said Yi only has 2 build paths but most assassins only have one viable path. Most ad champs have one viable path. But again its just my opinion.

Blackii73 votes

{quoted}

But what I am saying is once it reaches the point where Yi has 2 items then there is no counter. I admit Jax is a counter but he also has a high ban rate, zed and lux at least have counter play in my opinion, I have never been one shot by a zed with one spell rotation without his ult. You said Yi only has 2 build paths but most assassins only have one viable path. Most ad champs have one viable path. But again its just my opinion.

All ADC have 2 build paths (At least) Other than Sivir and Kog (Those are the only 2 that comes to mind). Most Top laners have 2 or more, so that is not really it.

Yi has many many counters, Jax, Rammus, Zix, Vi, Amumu, Evelyn, Graves, Shen, WW, etc... Jax counters Yi so hard. Rammus makes Yi useless. Zix Smashed Yi, invades him, eats him alive. Vi is just good overall against Yi, not a strong counter, but it works. Evelyn one shots Yi, Charm, Runs away from him, Her ult is a good escape tool too, she also camps him in his own jg post-6 Graves weakness (Supposedly) is that his shots can be blocked by minions, unfortunately Yi can't abuse that. If Yi fights graves, AA W E Q, and sometimes R, and yi is dead. Also he is just a broken champion overall so he abuses Yi, invades pretty hard, always healthy while clearing due to his knock-back, his a blind which is priceless against Yi. Shen due to his shield and W, he makes Yi beyond useless. EW and the R. WW is simply one of those champions. has good CC, quick, Healthy, and if Yi uses his R and Qs you, the fear will send him to the other side of the map, apart from that, he can then R you, and catch you with his W and Q.

Those are just other Jg options, there are plenty of other counters you can use at mid lane or bot. If he goes On-hit then the best build against him one shot build, and Stopwatch. If he goes crit then some armor and health and you should be good.

I mean there is a reason Yi doesn't really work in gold or higher elos. you sacrifice so much.

Wilyum2 votes

{quoted}

All ADC have 2 build paths (At least) Other than Sivir and Kog (Those are the only 2 that comes to mind). Most Top laners have 2 or more, so that is not really it.

Yi has many many counters, Jax, Rammus, Zix, Vi, Amumu, Evelyn, Graves, Shen, WW, etc... Jax counters Yi so hard. Rammus makes Yi useless. Zix Smashed Yi, invades him, eats him alive. Vi is just good overall against Yi, not a strong counter, but it works. Evelyn one shots Yi, Charm, Runs away from him, Her ult is a good escape tool too, she also camps him in his own jg post-6 Graves weakness (Supposedly) is that his shots can be blocked by minions, unfortunately Yi can't abuse that. If Yi fights graves, AA W E Q, and sometimes R, and yi is dead. Also he is just a broken champion overall so he abuses Yi, invades pretty hard, always healthy while clearing due to his knock-back, his a blind which is priceless against Yi. Shen due to his shield and W, he makes Yi beyond useless. EW and the R. WW is simply one of those champions. has good CC, quick, Healthy, and if Yi uses his R and Qs you, the fear will send him to the other side of the map, apart from that, he can then R you, and catch you with his W and Q.

Those are just other Jg options, there are plenty of other counters you can use at mid lane or bot. If he goes On-hit then the best build against him one shot build, and Stopwatch. If he goes crit then some armor and health and you should be good.

I mean there is a reason Yi doesn't really work in gold or higher elos. you sacrifice so much.

LMFAO Yi doesn't work in gold? Yi is a solid champ booster champ all the way up to diamond. But anyways, top lane is the most diverse item lane. But even then they have some core item then often go full tank, Nasus, Urgot, Renekton, there is a reason that the most popular build is often the highest winrate build. Your counter picks are all early game solutions to him, unless those tank champs build full armor they don't counter Yi. Jax and evelynn are good picks into him but everyone else gets outscaled incredibly hard. Vi, graves, warwick none of them beat a late game Yi my man, which is what my point is. Once he gets his items he is unbeatable unless specifically built against. But building just for Yi doesn't work if they also have a Brand support and a Fizz mid.

1800NICECLIENT9 votes

The real issue is Yi seems so strong vs low elo players and gets much worse as you move up the elo ladder.

If you pick Yi early in higher elo draft you'll get a bunch of counter picks drafted around him making sure Yi is uselsss including strong early invade junglers who can duel him and take his farm plus CC supports, etc. He also doesn't have much time to come online in higher elo.

In low elo players just play whatever they want, let the games go on forever so Yi can freely farm, and don't have the skill or forethought to deal with how he operates and how hard he can scale when fed.

SEKAI2 votes

{quoted}

The real issue is Yi seems so strong vs low elo players and gets much worse as you move up the elo ladder.

Not just low elo. Try BOTTOM elo.

Because, apparently, he's sitting at 50% win rate even in Silver (and obviously the lower the higher elo he goes, with 44% win Diamond), and only in Bronze where he's strong with a 52% win rate.

So Yi is literally only actually strong against Bronze players, and that's it. And that's not a statement of the champ being broken, if anything he's broken for being dogshit because of his 44% win rate in Diamond.

For reference, Shyvana has actually better win rate curve in all of her divisional stats barring Diamond where she performs worse than Yi with a 39% win rate; both her Bronze and Silver win rates are approaching 53%, and her pick rate while is not high but it's not low enough to raise an alarm in her low elo stats too. And last time I checked, people don't call Shyvana broken just because she's performing well in Bronze and Silver, in fact I remember people are calling her weak and rightfully so due to her pitiful win rate in Diamond.

So why is Yi such a mean bully, god of the low elo as some would proclaim, when his performance in low elo is worse than Shyvana, a pick people seem to universally consider a bad pick with bad balance atm due to her sucking so hard in high elo in spite of that she's in fact actually doing very well in low elos?

What is such a big difference between these 2 VERY relatabe champs and their performance curves to warrant such a different reaction from people? Oh, I know. It's because of the memes, the Master Yi memes. And that's it, that's quite literally how deep this pool goes, and that's very sad.

If you pick Yi early in higher elo draft you'll get a bunch of counter picks drafted around him making sure Yi is uselsss [...] In low elo players just play whatever they want, let the games go on forever so Yi can freely farm,

Yi is literally countered, either soft or hard counterted, by like 80-90% of the 'formal' jungle roster. The issue isn't about drafting at all because no matter what you pick to go against him in jungle chances are your champ already counters him to varying extent, it's just about player skill (macro, pressure, etc) as you'd mentioned in your follow up point which I believe is the sole contributor rather than the secondary topic.

Sure, if we expand into 'informal' junglers we could also be looking at say if you're trying to go for some obscure idk Nami jungle or some shit that clearly doesn't work when going up against Yi, but we really these shouldn't even be relevant and thus out of the discussion.

Madsin252 votes

The best master yis in the world have an avg WR of 56.3% in diamond+.

For comparison Kled has a 53% WR, the best kleds only have a WR of 55.7%.

You can't look at the statistics of the people who are good AND suck with yi and say "welp that's how good he is". No. It just doesn't work like that.

Sleepcoma2 votes

I mean he cant teamfight for shit since hes a squishy melee champ so he's kinda bad in low elo as well.

Sexy Jack Rabbit1 votes

He's a squishy melee with a VERY high damage output late game, as a result he's punished less in lower elo.

Source: Am lower elo.

Sleepcoma1 votes

He needs to stack conqueror AND rageblade before going in though, otherwise his damage is really weak.

PhearBunny6 votes

I don't think hes that great, he turns won fights into aces. because hes a reset champ. Every reset champ has that effect. Kat, Kass, Yi, Darius, Pyke, etc etc. So yeah, Yi thrives in reset situations.

But id consider Jax(same melee hypercarry role) to be a far better champion. Build 1 item and you are a God tier Tank, Assassin, Split pusher, Bruiser, Tank buster, Baron soloer, and pretty much everything else.

Sir Prepuzius1 votes

{quoted}

I don't think hes that great, he turns won fights into aces. because hes a reset champ.

Every reset champ has that effect. Kat, Kass, Yi, Darius, Pyke, etc etc. So yeah, Yi thrives in reset situations.

But id consider Jax(same melee hypercarry role) to be a far better champion. Build 1 item and you are a God tier Tank, Assassin, Split pusher, Bruiser, Tank buster, Baron soloer, and pretty much everything else.

i tend to agree with this since i tried jax and it felt easy and op, while with yi i always feed :D but how yi is a "reset champ"? you mean with his w cancelling AA or i'm missing something?

random gay guy1 votes

His cooldowns get reset if he kills someone and his Highlander is extended by X seconds AFAIK

Sir Prepuzius1 votes

oh, right i recall now, thanks

Mews996 votes

laughs in Jax

BobaFlautist5 votes

Laughs in Fiddlesticks Lissandra Alistar Amumu Lulu Thresh

Hayaishi5 votes

Yi's only counterplay is blowing him up. which isnt very good counterplay.

Just the Lip4 votes

i hardly ever use conqueror, but yes, it is a busted rune on a lot of aa melee champs.

Slim Gragas4 votes

Uuh, theres a lot of unbalance this season, but not Yi. Yi is never played in high elo unless its some rare one trick for him. He is terribly easy to deal with with the right team comp you just need CC. Of course if you are champions full of just slows and no hard CC then it'll be easier for him to roll you. Hes one of the most useless junglers if hes behind as he brings nothing else to fights besides damage. Of course you'll think hes a problem when he easily kills the whole team without CC when hes 15/0.

The Oasis7 votes

His exaggerated feast or famine state is what makes him so unbalanced. That doesn't mean he's op, but when a champs only 2 speeds are steamroll or be steamrolled theres something wrong. His entire play style is simply stat-checking the enemy while trying to avoid hard cc.

Quort6 votes

The most painful feeling is when your team successfully preys on Yi all game but he cleans up one team fight and gets shut down gold and just instantly becomes untouchable. :(

Bjørnetjenesten3 votes

If i could choose to delete Master yi at the price of also deleting one of my favourite champs i would probably still do it.

ForFoxSakes3 votes

So dont burn all your abilities all at once or dont 1v1 him. Lots of champs are like that where you cant expect to win 1v1

2Charmnot2Charm3 votes

"Just stun him"

I remember when that actually worked, but no soon as he comes out of Alpha you're dead already because it's a 1 shot auto attack as soon as he comes out, and you can't just throw the stun before hand because he will dodge with Alpha.

Good job balance team.

CIayman3 votes

Just use your brain. I won't tell you how, just use it.

Tegash3 votes

Fiddlesticks Nocturne

That's it.

Have fun making Yi mains cry.

IainG101 votes

Rammus Jax

Tegash1 votes

Jax does work, yeah. Rammus not so much. That's more a skill matchup.

You can disrupt his meditate. And if you taunt him before he uses wuju style, he's boned. But if you don't crush him early and let him get ahead? That thornmail won't save you lmao.

Lil Homie busta3 votes

Yi's counterplay is strategical or macro-play-wise, while most of league champions has focus on mechanical counterplay with a lot of them being popular. Here's the problem.

Sacred Math3 votes

Needs to be reworked completely. Way too easy to play for how much carrying he can do, and his kit is old, stale and simple compared to more nuanced and complex champions to require a little more thought process to play.

AirKingNeo3 votes
SEKAI3 votes

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/champion/MasterYi/graphs/

Yi is literally only strong in Bronze, and nowhere else. Everywhere else outside of Bronze, he's either just 'k' or being so bad he's a troll pick as seen with his glorious 44% win rate in Diamond.

Consider it's on your end, OP.

Yi's counter is not only just stuns, nice strawman there. Let's see:

  1. Any forms of single-target instant cast CC that have no travel time, which are impossible to dodge by his Alpha Strike. This would include, but not limited to: Ryze's W, Fiddle's Q, Lulu's W, Lissandra's R, Rammus's E, etc. This makes sure that even if Yi is some kinda bot who has the monster timing and able to dodge every possible threat coming at his way, he won't be dodging any of these.
  2. Any early game dominant jungler shits on Yi. Take your pick, Jax, Udyr, Shaco, Zac, Lee Sin, Warwick, Rammus, Hecarim, Gragas, Xin Zhao etc; basically, almost any jungle pick that's not some informal or troll jungler shits on Yi; literally, just run to Yi's jungle at the start of the game, and whatever you do Yi's going to have a bad time later. And if I'm making it sounding like if he's up against another scaling jungler he'd have a chance.. no, not really, because he still gets shit on by say, Nocturne or Graves both in early game or late game.
  3. There are also more than a handful of champs that directly counters everything Yi stands for. For instance, Zilean is the biggest cock-blocker in the entire game, and not only that, he shits especially hard on do-or-die champs such as Yi. There's also Fiddlesticks, who uses Yi's immunity to slow to his advantage, who can nullify Yi's engage with a press of a button and make him run in the opposite direction to where he came from at mach 7; the best part, as mentioned above, his Q/fear has no travel time and Yi can NOT dodge it with his Q. Or Kayle, whose ulti blocks Yi's engage as hard as running into a wall, and Kayle can also DPS just as much as Yi does too. Or Rammus, who is the apex predator preying on all Master Yi's, with his undodgeable taunt and making Yi killing himself to death with his W while also hiding behind Thornmail just to rub it in. Etc etc.

Have I not given you enough clues?

...........

And while I know it's every guy and his mother to complain about his Alpha Strike and its supposedly short CD that's actually flat out false, let me explain to you exactly why it's a problem on your end and not on the champion:

Yi's Q has nearly 20 second base CD at level 1 and nearly 15 second CD at spell level 5. Yeah sure, he can cut down its CD by AA, but it's still a solid 15sec-10sec even when he's wacking away your ass, and it also requires him putting himself at a risk given you know, he's also in melee range waiting to be CC'ed and mobbed (this remains the case until Yi becomes super fed, in which case much like any super fed champs, he's allowed to win the game). "Just needs to press Q" implying that he can just spam it to win the game is something like Yasuo's Q and by extension his entire kit, not Yi.

And if you're just mad about the refresh, well, Yi has to kill someone to refresh it and it is also unavailable pre-6, essentially he has to already be winning in order to win more. It's not a problem at all, there are far bigger cancers who front-load their power by becoming a win condition as soon as they do something (which can be as simply as pressing a button, like Vel'Koz pressing R while aiming at the general direction of the teamfight and auto-win if they're all stuck in a choke point), unlike Yi's back-loading where his condition to access the greatest power in his kit is that he's ALREADY won without it.

Yi hardly wins games more often than not, he just makes you feel saltier when you lose. There is a difference.

...........

Really, just don't be bad, and not like any bad but super bad. Ever wonder why Yi has such a stupidly bizarrely bad win rate in Diamond, and he's not even doing super good but only like average even in Silver?

Oakleaf Ranger1 votes

Why I want to see rank next to names tbh.

Find out who the wood scrubs are to make it easier to tell who actually knows wtf they are talking about.

PopcornBunni3 votes

"Just stun him"

The champion has a 0-skill expression intangible Q on a 3 second cooldown he can press with the reaction speed of a dead sloth and still avoid any hard cc in the game.

Smashed Hash2 votes

I love when the other teams JG picks Yi, it makes my game extremely enjoyable. Destroying a Yi gives me a high for hours.

WhiteAcres2 votes

It's not so much that Yi is unbalanced, he just isn't balanced in an interesting and "feels good" way. The only real counter to Yi is hard CC, which if you land it, is really effective. This feels really bad for the Yi player, since he / she gets locked down and can't contribute at all. On the flip-side, if you fail / miss your hard CC, Yi likely will get several kills due to his high, easily-accessible damage output and reset mechanic. Everything kinda hinges on hard CC-ing the Yi, and there's not much middle-ground which I think is both uninteresting and potentially feels bad for both sides.

5050BS1 votes

No champ should REQUIRE 2-3 stuns to stop

SEKAI2 votes

{quoted}

No champ should REQUIRE 2-3 stuns to stop

You only need 1 for Yi. And it doesn't even have to be a stun since anything that's not a slow is enough to kill him as long as team follows up the CC.

If you're worrying about his dodge, there are also plenty of CCs in the game that can not be dodged. And Yi would have to have some sort of external help either from his teammates being able to grant him spell shields to tank CCs or if he goes out of his way to buy items he really has no need for just for the spell shield.

Or else he has to deliberately let his team 4v5 while he only goes in to collect the kills; which would also raise another problem, because it would also mean Yi becomes the most fed person in his team who doesn't actually participate in fights, a super bad resource distribution that in fact often loses the game in the end.

Yi's Q also has a long base CD (and his lack of incentives to build CDR due to risk of spreading his build too thin) that goes out of its way to make sure he won't spam it unless he's on a big roll with the refreshes.

And if you're complaining about the refresh, the refresh can only exist if Yi has KILLED an enemy champion. In other words, he has no access to it if you just killed him outright, which as demonstrated before, can be super easy to do.

The only case if Yi requires 2-3 hard CCs to stop, would mean your team has to completely fucked themselves over before the game had even started all the way to the end of the game (pick a team that has no CC, not bothering to pick someone with instant CC, not bothering to pick ANYONE from the 70% of the entire champ roster that either hard or soft counters Yi, can not land your CCs, have no focus for ANY of Yi's engages, build no counter items, 0 attempt at counter jungling against Yi in the early game, not taking advantage and pressure if Yi is playing the clean-up and absent during teamfights, not taking advantage of Yi's DPS handicap if he goes out of his way to purchase a spell shield, not taking advantage of Yi's weak early to mid game presence, etc etc etc). It is not an excuse to say Yi, or any champion for that matter, is broken, it just means your skills is up for question.

For the record, Yi is only actually strong in Bronze and meh to super bad everywhere else as proven by his divisional stats. Unless you are a Bronze player, Yi should never be a problem; and even if you are, it doesn't mean Yi himself is a problem champion just because you may or may not be unable to deal with something while also being a part of the worst players in the game.

Sacred Math1 votes

just needs a complete fucking rework. not that he's strong...he's just a noob fucking magnet. The majority of Yi players are tards that don't want to play with a team...just want to get themselves fed and play on their own. Dumb, boring, stale kit that scales way too hard for what kind of champion he is.

#FuckYi2018

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