Nerf ALL damage done by champions with 10%

TrikzterzArma·Jun 10, 2018·105 votes·19,877 views

Literally everything that makes champs deal more damage.

Their base AD, attack speed, stats and damage granted by items, AD and AP ratios. Literally ALL damage done by champs, and keep the damage monsters, minions and turrets deals.

Try this out for at least one patch, and if it doesn't solve any problems, just revert it.

The damage IS way too high atm. It's a game of "who can oneshot the other faster", rather than "use your brain" like it was back in Season 1 when I started playing. I don't feel "outplayed" when an enemy with 1 more kill oneshots me. It just feels frustrating.

115 Comments

Dorans PantsJun 10, 201837 votes

idk how the amount of dmg should be reduced, but I would really appreciate if the time to kill was a bit higher. teamfights that only last for like 5 seconds just aren't satisfying. longer fights would also reward players who can consistently hit their abilities and put a greater emphasis on dodging/movement in general instead of positioning, engaging and then statchecking.

Lux TizerJun 11, 20185 votes

Remember the tank meta in Season 5 when fights could last 15-20 seconds? I thought I didn't like that at the time, but compared to THIS....

ProvengreilJun 11, 20182 votes

I loved that at the time because I knew what the opposite would be. Season 5 was my absolute favorite.

Spicy RiceJun 11, 20183 votes

Lol, 15-20 secs? What kind of hyper fast games were you playing?

I remember matches where everyone but a tank on both side died, respawned, died, and respawned again, while the same 2 tanks were still duking it out

BârdJun 10, 201827 votes

...how do threads like this get upvoted?

Ok, say they actually did this. The following things would happen.

First off, every champion who relies on their burst would become barely unable to kill their intended targets, so all of the following champions would either become garbage tier if they build around their burst. Ahri Akali Annie Diana Ekko Elise Evelynn Fizz Jhin Kassadin Katarina Kayn (SA) Khazix Leblanc Nidalee Nocturne Pantheon Pyke Quinn Rengar Riven Shaco Syndra Taliyah (JG) Talon TwistedFate Udyr (Tiger) Veigar Velkoz Viktor MonkeyKing Zed Ziggs Those above who have off-meta builds that make them tanks, bruisers, DPS, supports, or otherwise utility oriented champions would be forced to do so, since their primary playstyle is no longer viable. Those above who don't have such a build path would become irrelevant.

What happens next is that in-combat sustain and shielding become too strong, since there isn't enough damage to kill people through it in any reasonable amount of time. The following would become too strong. Aatrox Akali (tank) Darius DrMundo Gragas Illaoi Janna Karma Lulu Maokai Mordekaiser Nami Nasus Nautilus Nidalee (Athenes) Ornn Pyke Renekton Sona Soraka TahmKench Taric Vladimir Volibear Warwick Additionally, item 3074 would become more dominant, so it's best users become much stronger. Fiora Fiora Fiora ADC's would undoubtedly catch onto this, and item 3812 would become the new meta item. Draven could use the buff, but Kaisa absolutely does not need this.

Oh, and with the burst required to kill them gone, champions whose main counterplay is "Lock them down and burst them" just got a massive buff. A lot of those are champions who themselves are bursty, but not all of them are. The hypercarries with incredible DPS become king. Azir (come late game) Cassiopeia Jax Kaisa KogMaw MasterYi Ryze Tristana Twitch Varus Vayne Yasuo

But sure, go ahead and request broad sweeping changes to the entire roster. I'm sure there would be no unintended consequences.

Raid Boss MordeJun 11, 20183 votes

You can't really count Mordekaiser in there, since his shielding is based off his damage dealt, so he would be doing less damage and shielding for less

LordGeovanniJun 11, 20181 votes

same would go for any type of lifesteal healing or sheild by that logic because you can only shield so much before it breaks and have to wait for the cooldown and you can only heal so much before its you can heal again. Mordekaiser Caps his Shields in 2 q's any time after 1 item. longer fights benefit him more than most champions in the game because he has a refreshable shield with no cooldown. Not that i think a 10% damage reduction would do anything to morde except make him better since he overkills things so hard. his only thing is that he dies to adcs combined with mage burst while chain cc'ed which makes it less likely when he takes 10% less damage from all sources but he was overkilling in the first place so even if he takes a 10% damage cut he is still probably killing things.

LightningShadoJun 11, 20182 votes

Nothing truer was ever said.

BIGCAT2000Jun 11, 20182 votes

at first i agreed with the post, then you helped me see it was wrong... so nerf everything besides health by 10% might as well then increase health by it instead

Ulquiorra0123Jun 11, 20183 votes

So, all of the full burst champions are doing almost 2 health bars to squishies. You literally get one shot by a Kha'zix auto if he has any sort of a lead... They are well overkilling their target, and I really do not think this is something that needs to be worried about.

Half of the champions in the list you gave shouldn't be in the list anyways as their objective isnt to one shot. To name a few: Akali (sustained pressure), Elise (hello this one is so super obviously not a burst mage XDDDDDDD), Jhin (you are joking right? This is an ADC not an assassin), Kassadin (again sustained pressure), Nidalee (i miss when she was sustained pressure, now she is a 1 shot carry which just doesnt feel good), Pantheon (this is where I know you are trolling, he was never supposed to one shot people like he does).

The problem with your argument is you are taking the current meta and supporting it with current meta roles. Half of their roles in the game have changed just this year where damage was ramped to obscene levels. Burst champions that are supposed to burst can still burst, nobody cares about that because that is what they are supposed to do. With Items and base damages they are doing it a full healthbar over what they need to. I've seen a 2-0 fizz 1 shot a Nasus through ulti who was 1-0. When that starts happening there is an issue with damage.

The across the board change is needed. A full reduction of base damages and scalings. The problem stems from the amount of damage that any champion going any build can put out. Soraka is better off poking than healing when given the option because she does alot of damage from level 1. Tanks who build one off-tank item are 1 shotting ADCs. Burst mages are 1 shotting tanks with alot of MR. ADCs are shredding everything with little to no effort. Bruisers have their sustain while still doing obscene amounts of damage. And this is the thing, if you played enough, you would know that all of this is an issue.

Cheetah NidaleeJun 11, 20184 votes

{quoted}

...how do threads like this get upvoted?

Ok, say they actually did this. The following things would happen.

First off, every champion who relies on their burst would become barely unable to kill their intended targets, so all of the following champions would either become garbage tier if they build around their burst. (SA) (JG) (Tiger) Those above who have off-meta builds that make them tanks, bruisers, DPS, supports, or otherwise utility oriented champions would be forced to do so, since their primary playstyle is no longer viable. Those above who don't have such a build path would become irrelevant.

What happens next is that in-combat sustain and shielding become too strong, since there isn't enough damage to kill people through it in any reasonable amount of time. The following would become too strong. (tank) (Athenes) Additionally, would become more dominant, so it's best users become much stronger. ADC's would undoubtedly catch onto this, and would become the new meta item. could use the buff, but absolutely does not need this.

Oh, and with the burst required to kill them gone, champions whose main counterplay is "Lock them down and burst them" just got a massive buff. A lot of those are champions who themselves are bursty, but not all of them are. The hypercarries with incredible DPS become king. (come late game)

But sure, go ahead and request broad sweeping changes to the entire roster. I'm sure there would be no unintended consequences.

thats is why 10% is flawed and it needs to be much higher.. the only thing 10% will do is stop all but the most broken assassins from 1 shitting their target it wont do anything else.

if people think damage has only increased by 10% they clearly haven't played for very long, don't remember, are choosing to remain ignorant.. or are flat out in denial.

there was trading in lane. the only "trading" the exists now is from a two full tanks fighting. every lane used to trade.

damage needs to be reduced by at LEAST 50%

healing and shielding needs to be removed items like need to be removed ( as if their addition didn't prove damage creep was absurdly out of control) life leech needs to again be lowered to reasonable values needs to also be removed

assassins need to do this job at assassinating low hp targets. not "1 shotting people" mages need freaking mana regen back...

adc's have for the most part been addressed for now. grats riot.. it took you 2 years... support needs to have to spend thier gold on item 3312 and sightstone so we cant just build full damage after item 3098 the reason why supports do "too much damage" is because we are no longer required to spend our first 2k gold on support items..

when the t2 support item works just as well and we can build full damage after that

junglers need trackers knife back

the idea of "10% nerf" will fix nothing...

damage creep has gone WELL BEYOND a mere 10%

we had http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=201128

now we have http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=phyrexian%20obliterator

ModWulf HelhammerJun 10, 201826 votes

And that does nothing but make tanks and bruisers overpowered, and games become hour long slog fests of nothin happening.

Game balance is never as simple as something like a universal damage decrease.

TrikzterzArmaJun 10, 201815 votes

How do you know that? Has it ever been tried before?

ModWulf HelhammerJun 10, 20188 votes

We don’t know that removing traffic lights and stop signs will cause a bunch more accidents, so we should just test it out. After all, we can always revert it, right?

Or for League related example: say we gave all bruisers 20 more MS, armor, and MR. Going by your logic, then we couldn’t say that would be OP, even though we all know that would put the class way above all the others.

You don’t have to test things to know that an idea does not work.

y0r1ckJun 10, 20185 votes

Your analogy doesn't work because before traffic lights, there were lots more accidents. It's already been tested in a sense.

Tim From WorkJun 10, 20182 votes

We have had times in league where it was nearly impossible to kill teams and those games tended to be won by whoever didn't burn out first

Morgana Q MisserJun 10, 20186 votes

Imagining Irelia being even more of an unkillable soloq wraith...

I completely agree that this change is a bad idea

TrikzterzArmaJun 10, 20183 votes

What? Irelia would also deal 10% less damage

Morgana Q MisserJun 10, 20187 votes

But her effective health pool would be 10/9 times bigger which is a larger nominal amount than a squishy target

N1ghtOGJun 11, 20182 votes

[{quoted}](name= Król Wilk Sam,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EifXYnwy,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-06-10T13:34:20.535+0000)

And that does nothing but make tanks and bruisers overpowered, and games become hour long slog fests of nothin happening.

Game balance is never as simple as something like a universal damage decrease.

THATS THE ENTIRE POINT. Tanks should be "unkillable" cc monsters and bruisers should be a mix between an assasin and a tank(less tanky than a tank and lower dmg than an assasin). None of these 2 classes should be able to one shot but as the game stands they do.

ModWulf HelhammerJun 11, 20181 votes

Except if your ability to kill them goes down, then they won't care about how much longer it takes to kill you with their reduced damage, since they are even tankier, while you're just as squishy.

If currently tanks and bruisers and doing "more than enough damage" with "correct amount of tank", reducing that to "enough damage" and "more than enough tank" makes them overbearing to deal with.

Metal JannaJun 11, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name= Król Wilk Sam,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=EifXYnwy,comment-id=0001000b0000,timestamp=2018-06-11T21:01:59.097+0000)

Except if your ability to kill them goes down, then they won't care about how much longer it takes to kill you with their reduced damage, since they are even tankier, while you're just as squishy.

If currently tanks and bruisers and doing "more than enough damage" with "correct amount of tank", reducing that to "enough damage" and "more than enough tank" makes them overbearing to deal with.

That's true. Glory97 brought that up on page two, and I addressed it on page two.

RatpieJun 10, 201823 votes

No. We actually need Riot to stop doing across the board changes. While some champs are OP, some are struggling heavily. There just needs to be tweaks to certain small groups or individual champs. These nerf all mana users, or nerf all damage don't apply equally to all champs. It is more about reducing certain champs ability to snowball really early. That needs a scalpel, not a machete.

BakedLotionJun 10, 201817 votes

this creates more problems than it fixes. If suddenly an assassin can't do their job then they end up completely trashed

ADCs are just gonna get a net buff because they're a dps class and what's one more auto to them?

Burst classes will just not be able to burst and therefore they're fucked

echorevJun 10, 20184 votes

People are already overkilling though...

TwitchInMyPantsJun 11, 20183 votes

{quoted}

this creates more problems than it fixes. If suddenly an assassin can't do their job then they end up completely trashed

ADCs are just gonna get a net buff because they're a dps class and what's one more auto to them?

Burst classes will just not be able to burst and therefore they're fucked

You say that as if burst mages and assassins didn't manage to be meta in seasons well before runes and base stat buffs increased the levels of damage. There's been entire metas centered around assassins in environments where tanks were waaaaaaaaaay tankier.

And this opinion that tanks will win every fight when they've had their items' AR/MR gutted season after season is so dumb. The main things increasing their durability are overloaded sustain/durability in resolve and if you nerf that tanks don't have much to speak of other than maybe Gargoyle's Stoneplate. Go look at things like Force of Nature or old Randuin's Omen. Tanks used to be way tankier and burst mages and assassins still had a place because guess what - YOU STILL NEED DAMAGE TO END GAMES!!! No meta has ever been stack 5 tanks. There's been 1 hypercarry 3 tank comps during patches where they were strong but those typically don't last long after item/mastery/rune tweaks.

Like honestly even if you leave Resolve as is, the other trees are offering penetration and burst which outclasses Resolve early especially after that change that splits the health into other stats. And if their health does become a problem look at all the champs that can pack % damage. And those BorK and Liandries buffs. Tanks are entirely based on health these days and health stacking has counterplay baked into soooo many champion kits.

Lux TizerJun 11, 20185 votes

Every assassin in the game already went through their phase of having their damage be approx. 10% less than it is now. They survived and played fine in S2-5?

five oh tree Jun 10, 20188 votes

"let's do one massive sweeping change, that'll really fix everything. I'm a balancing god. How has rito not thought of this already? they should hire me!"

KingRaffaJun 11, 20181 votes

Really sums up these boards

mythsealaesJun 10, 20186 votes

instead of nerfing dmg might be a good idea to give all champions extra base armor and mr

Gramps69Jun 10, 20183 votes

^The extra armor comes in real handy now that everyone has access to true damage through Conqueror and IE

VICHEL CHAOSJun 10, 20186 votes

Great idea! Then lets test another very subtle change, IDK, something as non-impactful as removing 20 items fomr the shop (randomized). If it doesn't work, revert it. And to finish off the slight tentative changes, I propose removing mr as a stat. If it doesn't work, lets revert it.

By the way, so you sort of understand how brilliant your idea is. If you decrease stats that multiplicatively interact for damage such as as and ad, you end up redicing it by much more than 10%. I'd say food for thought but after such a propolsal it is doubtful that such thing means anything.

Glory97Jun 10, 20185 votes

That is not how balancing works. Such a global nerf to everything would create a lot more mess than it fixes. The game has it's problemes. And not just a few. But if you think you can fix problemes like that, it's not going to work. A change like that would completly crush some champions. Champions, that can't deal with this change would go down to 20%- ish winrates, And bruiser type champions that do consistent damage thorughout fight would explode, achieving 80+% winrates.

If a 10% dmg-nerf across all champions was made and not reverted within one week the game would probably loose 80% of it's playerbase. And fixing the whole mess of this nerf without straight up reverting it would take at least 2 years until the game stabelises with every champion being decently strong but not way out of hand.

RocketRelmJun 10, 20182 votes

During last preseason they implemented a global buff along those lines to all damage. This'd be more of a reversion than anything. The global buff happened, and lol didn't lose 80% player base from it. Also, 80%+ win rates? Come on. That's literally impossible. I mean, potentially for a single champion hyper buffed I could see it before it gets hotfixed, but if it's a dozen they'd run into each other and the win rates would equalize.

(For reference, all mages lost 8.4 penetration, but all champions lost 9-27 mr depending on runes, and mages got sort shoes 'buffed' by 3 pen, resulting in higher magic damage across the board from mages. Also, all mages got stuck with 0 armor bonuses while all ad champions got AD buffs and Armor bonuses, resulting in higher physical damage to mages. The changes to the resistance system bloated damage significantly.)

RimramJun 10, 20184 votes

i dont agree with this change but i do agree with the goal in mind, the current meta is doing way too much damage atm.

There are two possibilities i can think of that resulted in this:

1.) There was alot of discussion about game balance that came to the conclusion that buffing instead of nerfing to balance a game made it more exciting, and in a certain way it does, and i believe that Riot has actually taken this to account.

OR,

2.) There has been some power creep over the last couple of patches and metas that have gone unnoticed.

If it were the first point, meaning Riot has purposely focused on buffing champs, they need to realize that continually buffing will, yes make the game more "intense" and "exciting", but that will only become a case of URF; something that's intense and fun for the first few games but quickly wears down and, by Riot's own words, makes even long term players quit the game.

If it is the latter however, i would be rather disappointed that they haven't noticed such a change occurring so drastically. With all the talk about games becoming faster and faster and with more and more people finding that their games end up incredibly stompy and one-sided one way or another, Riot really should have recognized this problem much earlier.

Either way the solution is to carefully turn down the notch for all characters and most importantly, talk with the community about what your goal is with the meta: Not some "we want to make the meta exciting and dynamic" descriptive BS that avoids actually communicating but actual goals like "Slow down all out teamfights but avoid making it into a game of cat and mouse where nothing happens till a team gets a clear advantage and the losing side just backs of and the winning side just slightly push an advantage while no kills occur" as. well, this is whats happening all too often in the pro scene: Anybody remember the "fight you fking psies!" line? yeah. Final rounds to decide the winner of the year and of the league cup and no kill for 20 minutes. incredibly disappointing.

Along with the great points that Dorans Pants have mentioned this is all i really have to say. Hope this great game doesn't go down the drain :(

Recon1212Jun 10, 20184 votes

I remember when I came to league after playing mostly call of duty and I loved how long it took to kill someone cause it made me feel like I earned it. But as the years went on, I could tell something was changing cause more and more often I would get oneshot and it always felt like shit. Like some champs I understand burst, but champs like Kha and Teemo have so much burst and DPS its actually insane. I want to get into a 1v1 and feel like I have time to outplay and not get blown up by point and click moves that do half my health.

MhihnjJun 11, 20184 votes

Nerf Literally everything that makes champs deal more damage.

So that means that we will be nerfing

Base AD
Base ability damage
ability ratios
Item passives
Penetration
Attack speed
CDR
Offensive Summoner spells
Offensive runes
Offensive Dragon buffs(Infernal, Mountain)
Baron buff
Rift herald buff
Blue buff
Red buff a Essentially: Tanks would essentially become raid bosses, ADC's would become even more necessary and enchanters would become even stronger, whereas most burst mages and certain artillery mages would be kicked out of the game or transition to support, battle mages would be picked only for utility/waveclear and assassins would essentially become fancy splitpushing duelists. Games will last 40+ minutes because no one can destroy towers except the ADC. Ocean drake will become more valuable.

game balance would become worse than preseason

SdarsJun 10, 20183 votes

Damage needs to be nerfed all around, but the right way to do it isn't something as straightforward as this. Nerfing everyone the same would make assassins and burst mages pretty bad while making dps'ers like adcs stronger by comparison. I agree damage needs to be lowered by a substantial amount, but it needs to be tuned properly.

I guess a way to do something straightforward like that without messing up the game for 1 patch is to make it a separate game mode. Maybe something like cutting all damage, sustain and shields in half and then checking the data to see what needs nerfs and what needs buffs.

PrinceOfStormsJun 11, 20183 votes

I'd go even further and say reduce the AS cap to 1.25 and remove all items that support the on-hit playstyle.

WerdxJun 11, 20183 votes

{quoted}

Literally everything that makes champs deal more damage.

Their base AD, attack speed, stats and damage granted by items, AD and AP ratios. Literally ALL damage done by champs, and keep the damage monsters, minions and turrets deals.

Try this out for at least one patch, and if it doesn't solve any problems, just revert it.

The damage IS way too high atm. It's a game of "who can oneshot the other faster", rather than "use your brain" like it was back in Season 1 when I started playing. I don't feel "outplayed" when an enemy with 1 more kill oneshots me. It just feels frustrating.

Why would they do that?Don't you see game evolves around worlds and other tournaments?

That's what brings the most money,you and me buying skins is nothing compared what tournaments bring in.

Tournaments are long as it is,if they were any longer,no one would watch 3 hours matches and that's - profit.

Sure there would be no lifers who got nothing better to do.

Its all based on who has better champion and who's champion is going to shit on opponent's team faster.

Game has 141 champion,and only 40 of them playable.That says a lot about how they doing things around their company.Champions played at worlds get the most attention,and its always going to be like that.

Twitch is op,so lets nerf it.Why?Because of worlds. That's one example.

You cant actually stand and fight vs most champions,its all based on who's going to jump who,and kill within seconds and jump out.If you build survivability,you won't be able to do damage,if you build damage,well u gonna get oneshot by adc's and assassins...

I play 20 champions on 3 different accounts,and i always watch streams,opgg and other sites for new builds etc...There's no champion who uses defensive items anymore,mostly because you invest 5-6 k gold just to get melted by adc.

Its like armor and hp items do not exist no more.Everything comes down to 'hey lets get most dmg,so we can kill eachother faster,nevermind not being able to take one hit,so you end up dying 20 times'

item 3075 item 3065 item 3800 item 3143 item 3025 item 3083 Literally non existent anymore.

20 min into game,every AD build ' hmm lets see' item 3147 item 3071 item 3142 item 3095 item 3812

People completely forgot about item 3139 item 3156 item 3814

If people built differently,they would be able to survive more,but then they would get multiple reports from their teammates because they decided to go some armor and hp...But i get it,RIOT evolves all around who's gonna burst who fastest.

Real Sexy YoonaJun 11, 20183 votes

A few days ago, there was a highly up-voted post with a title regarding the balance team that had a video with Scarra explaining the issues with League. In that video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrdF1Y4aPPw) he actually replies to someone's suggestion of nerfing all damage by 10% or 20% (can't remember) saying it's a horrible idea and that they should keep it in reddit and not take that suggestion anywhere else.

The votes for that post was almost entirely up-votes. Because of that we can assume that some people who upvoted that post upvoted this post as well. I mean Scarra also suggested deleting the rune system, but I'm just pointing out the inconsistency of the community in Boards.

Metal JannaJun 10, 20182 votes

If all champions are hit with the same nerf, how can they become overpowered? If, for example, Cho'gath and Annie were fighting, and you suddenly nerfed both of their damage by 10%, why would either of them get an advantage out of it? I ask because i've only been around since some time before the start of season 7, so I have never seen a tank meta.

Gramps69Jun 10, 20182 votes

It's not so much a nerf to impact that early game/lane phase damage, it would be more impactful later on once team fights are starting. If no one is getting one-shot any more, it means fights can last longer, which allows for more skill expression and macro play instead of just praying that your team has a marksman that can right click better.

Glory97Jun 10, 20183 votes

Annie would suffer a lot from the 10% damage nerf. Her kit revolves arround oneshotting enemy champions. With 10% less damage this will be extremly difficult, even impossible. With her low range and squishiness playing annie would be a lot more difficult.

On the other side, cho gath is very tanky. Building tank items is a lot better, because their item efficiency is not reduced, whereas all ad/ap-items are 10% less efficient for the same price. Cho gath would be much harder to kill for a team, and he'd survive a lot longer in a teamfight and so he would do a lot more damage. Despite the 10% damage nerf. He can stay longer in a teamfight and do more attacks.

Yes you could argue that annie also survives longer because enemies do less damage, but this will probably not matter. After Annie flash tibbers and uses q and w, her spells are on cooldown. Even despite the enemies doing 10% less damage, they will still kill annie before her spells are off cooldown. In the time she survives longer she can do one auto attack at most.

If we only look at 1v1 annie and cho gath are not the best examples. Let's take leBlanc and jinx: In the current version leBlanc uses all her spells, jinx dies within 1 second. During this time jinx can attack once or twice. Leblanc looses half her hp. After 10% dmg nerfs, leblanc uses all her spells, but it's not enough to kill jinx. LeBlanc spells are all on cooldown, she can only auto attack for the next 5 seconds. Jinx kills leblanc after 3 seconds.

Smithy2QJun 10, 20182 votes

A more logical decision would be to buff the base armour and magic resist by ~10, or whatever the old runes gave. Eliminating those invisible sources of stats is what first caused the damage spike, or at least made it noticeable. It was surprising how important those relatively minor stats actually affected balanced.

This is where the new runes system has failed, imo. Think of old runes: reds affected damage, yellows defence, blues for magic/ability, and glyphs were an extra boost to any one thing. The new 'runes' (which are really masteries, idk why they called them runes) don't follow this at all. Imagine if instead of the trees we have now, we were given a similar choice:

Pick one damage modifyer: damage, attack speed, penetration, etc.
Pick one defence modifyer: armour, HP, regen, etc.
Pick one ability modifyer: magic resist, mana regen, CDR, etc.
For glyphs, they could be the same as before (pick one stat to give a bigger boost), or they could be the keystone. This would make more sense, as it would then more truly combine runes and masteries in one tree.

They could make this more sexy than just pure stat boosts. They could implement the gathering storm idea, where you sacrifice early game stats for more late game. You could do the opposite. You could have stats tied to kills, to kda, to minions killed, to number of enemies nearby. You still give players a chance to make the runes apply to their playstyle without introducing ridiculous things like Boneplate or Manaflow Band which is just the default choice for everyone.

It would be easier to balance, easier to understand, better able to adjust pre-match (similar to old runes, where you have a special armour page to use against assassins in lane, for example, whereas now you just go your default page most times) and put a serious dent on the early-game damage, which should reduce snowballing. Doesn't solve the turret problems, but it's a start.

IfnethJun 10, 20182 votes

Pretty much no champion deals too much damage. If you are in the middle of the enemy team and not a Vanguard tank initiating a fight, then you are in the wrong place and will be blown up. You cannot just set yourself up for an all-in from the enemy mage, let the enemy marksman free-fire, and expect to survive. Those players, and especially the marksman, spent the past twenty or thirty minutes carefully farming their kit. This is their time now.

SirLapseJun 10, 20182 votes

If Burst > DPS then Burst -10% > DPS-10% in any scenario where the duration of the fight does not allow the DPS user any real kind of interaction...saying that nerfing everything will create a slower game is the same as saying that nobody would be affected by the changes and the game would just proceed slower with the same picks. Which is far from true due to early game champs existing.

I understand the complaint but this is literally the worst possible way to solve it since it's a one-dimensional viewpoint on damage. Let's just ignore all the CS'ing complaints that Riot has only recently resolved for AP champions via Doran's Ring changes and damage the ability to last hit on every non-jungle role. Yeah!

Let's also ignore that base damage has next to nothing to do with how important items are to scale into the game where all these quick fights are happening! YEAH! [slayer-pantheon-popcorn]

Seriously why has nobody suggested nerfs to items across the board which enable these champions and instead point to base stats which affect early to mid game way more? We have 70-80 AD items in the store with Luden's and other high damage options rolling around everywhere to add onto burst so much that ACTUAL BURST CHAMPIONS like Syndra are garbage since there's only presence in the items, not the champions. Speaking solo queue of course.

SaiannaJun 11, 20182 votes

More like nerf dmg across the board by AT LEAST 30%.

Ofc all utility/support abilities/passives, such as shields should also be reduced to match.

Armor/Mres/HP should stay the same.

BlueBilberryJun 11, 20182 votes

It's a bit high - but I think you are on the right track. The means of reducing damage and countering damage are out of hand atm.

HäxelJun 11, 20182 votes

To quote Scarra: "That is one of the dumbest things someone could come up to". People on boards and reddit always come up with this idea while realy having no idea how balance work with 6 classes or 13 subclasses and 141 champions.