It's not even about them being op(which both of them are),I'm just completely sick of vayne thresh vayne thresh vayne thresh vayne thresh,every,fucking,game.
What happened to variety? If nothing else can't we nerf them for the sake of not seeing the same shit every game?
KayleeT6 votesNeither Vayne nor Thresh are op lol
Dunkrius2g1 votes
Is that you...?
Penns6 votesEvery game I play against this fking cancer assassin adc I get reminded of how bs she really is lol. Like, kiting better than Kalista is one thing, but then running around the map dealing more burst dmg than a Zed is something else. In fact, Im in champ select against a first pick Vayne right now because my first pick ignored that "pls ban Vayne". Rip me.
Jasiwel3 votesThat's what puzzled me about the World patch. They claimed they didn't want the top percentage pickrate/winrate champions to be the primary picks, yet they leave bottom lane completely untouched despite blatant excessive power in the kits of Vayne/Thresh/Jinx.
Archon X2 votesJinx has a better winrate than Vayne
Leona has a better winrate than Thresh
http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&type=champion-popularity&range=weekly&map=sr&queue=1x1
manbearswine26 votes[{quoted}](name=Archon X,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-09-16T20:13:53.316+0000)
Jinx has a better winrate than Vayne
Leona has a better winrate than Thresh
http://www.lolking.net/charts?region=all&type=champion-popularity&range=weekly&map=sr&queue=1x1
OH BOY IT'S THE WINRATE "ARGUMENT",HAVEN'T HEARD THIS WORTHLESS SHIT BEFORE,THANK YOU FOR ENLIGHTENING ALL OF US!
Cowgirl Ed7 votesOH BOY IT'S THE WINRATE "ARGUMENT",HAVEN'T HEARD THIS WORTHLESS SHIT BEFORE,THANK YOU FOR ENLIGHTENING ALL OF US!
but dude look at dem numbers, they are higher!!1
Archon X1 votesNot sure how both can be "op" when Thresh doesn't even have a positive winrate and Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs.
You should have made the thread title "I can't be bothered to ban champion I dislike so Rito pls do it for me"
Player of Games14 votes[{quoted}](name=Archon X,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2015-09-16T20:17:04.836+0000)
Not sure how both can be "op" when Thresh doesn't even have a positive winrate and Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs.
You should have made the thread title "I can't be bothered to ban champion I dislike so Rito pls do it for me"
"Thresh doesn't even have a positive winrate and Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs" "winrate and Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs" "Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs"
Stopped reading right there, if you really believe Vayne is outclassed by multiple adcs I feel bad for you.
Crossette1 votesYou act like there weren't 5 bans already taken up before this patch (now only 3?) and that people only play draft. Or that people AREN'T ALWAYS BANNING. Sure, you'll be able to ban sometimes, but it's RNG if you aren't in a 5-man group.
WolfChases3 votesBecause both, Jinx and Leona are easy as hell and a lot of people are playing those easymode champions.
In the other hand, Vayne and Thresh are more mechanically demanding and yes...broken as hell when played decent.
magic pole2 votesthat doesn't even apply to what OP is talking about.
s/he is sick of their ubiquity more than their win rate or "opness".
Meep Man2 votesNot nerf, make them have more defined strengths and weaknesses/less safe to pick. Name a Thresh weakness that is as glaring as the weakness of someone like, say, Tahm Kench or Shaco. Tahm Kench has no escape and no reliable engage. Shaco has little contribution in team fights. Thresh... has no heal? Exactly. His kit doesn't revolve around a central theme besides his Q and R. Most everyone else's kits revolve around the perfect combo/the perfect way of play. Thresh is so adaptable that he can be safe to pick into ANYTHING. And it is NOT because his kit is overloaded with so much stuff, its because his kit is loaded with so much vastly different stuff! Same goes for Vayne. She has a weakness I can point out, lack of poke, yes, but she is just too safe to pick due to her knockback.
Valrun2 votes[{quoted}](name=Inept Maverick,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-09-16T20:17:07.069+0000)
Shaco has little contribution in team fights.
Shaco is a god if you actually know how to use him... He's just as viable as any other champ in team fights if you're mechanically adept at him.
luckmallory2 votesYou could use this argument for any champion lol. That doesn't make it correct. I could name 20 junglers who have better team fight presence then him
Athenes Lulu1 votesImagine if Thresh have legit heals... oh yes.
freya od2 votesvayne is not OP, and i wish you all would stop crying like she is.
Vayne doesn't even tip over the 50-ish win rate until you hit CHALLENGER tier. Everyone's complaining about vayne, yet no one says anything about tristana. Trist and corki can hard-wreck vayne so easily. Not to mention trist can drop a turret in one E-pop, and does it faster than jinx.
Slamurai Jack2 votesYou'd honestly have to make Thresh completely unplayable garbage to get people to stop playing him. He really is just that more appealing than other supports and the only one that comes close is Blitz, who is popular for similar reasons.
A Miss Fortune4 votesThey need to flat out remove a part of Thresh's kit. He can be balanced but they released him with an overloaded kit, he just doesn't do bad at any point of the game.
It's the same thing like Ekko. He'll never be a healthy (fun to play vs), balanced (fair to play vs) champion since his kit is so overloaded. Even if he isn't overpowered, he's still cancer to play against and is viable in and against any team comps in any meta since he has so many things in his kit.
Mimaropa1 votesYou're right but thresh i think is in a good spot right now.
he does have an overloaded kit however they are relatively long cooldowns. He also requires skill and great prediction that's why people cheer if someone in Lcs hits a hook since it has a casting time and thin size. lantern saves requires distance and awareness and flay disrupting jumps requires Timing. His ult is decent for zone control and more cc.
I have seen first time threshes and Bronze-gold threshes that do horribly. missing everything and not using his utilities well. It just depends on type of thresh youre playing
IiIiana1 votesHis hook hitbox is quite tricky, it's not that thin but gives a false idea of width because everything but the tip is narrow Thresh could use less damage, as his kit is overloaded with utility and that's what people play him for. The thing is, when comparing Thresh to the other supports, even if he is balanced, he will seem overpowered as his class buddies are in a bad/boring/binary/neglected state. Basically the entire support role is right now. The balance team needs to look into the other supports and how to make them better with well thought buffs/changes that will not simply make them become mid/top laners instead. And make some damn changes to support itemizations
A Miss Fortune2 votesThresh's balance isn't determined by how bad people play him.
manbearswine2 votes[{quoted}](name=Slamurai Jack,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2015-09-17T01:55:04.803+0000)
You'd honestly have to make Thresh completely unplayable garbage to get people to stop playing him. He really is just that more appealing than other supports and the only one that comes close is Blitz, who is popular for similar reasons.
Except that blitz is at a fraction of thresh's popularity,and his kit is more appealing than that of thresh.
How about we make thresh no op garbage for a few patches,see where that puts him.
C9 Gloomy2 votesthey need to just buff lucian/graves/caitlyn more to keep vayne in line they nerfed her counters so shes running rampant
VDc0zCqe0w2 votesHow the fuck did you manage to get so many upvotes saying nerf Thresh?
Must be the fact that you said nerf Vayne in the same thread
Anyways: brace yourselves, winretards are coming.
manbearswine1 votes[{quoted}](name=Puffball Reborn,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2015-09-17T13:00:10.373+0000)
How the fuck did you manage to get so many upvotes saying nerf Thresh?
Must be the fact that you said nerf Vayne in the same thread
Anyways: brace yourselves, winretards are coming.
winrateards are always coming,there's a never-ending stream of them.
Tyren1 votesIt should go down now since both of them were on the last free week rotation, especially if you play normals.
Visurreal1 votesI think you might need to rethink a couple of things. Thresh can be shut down. Vayne can be shut down.
In fact, my brother just played a wildly successful game as Nunu support. You can beat Vayne with a multitude of champions. If you don't like seeing Thresh and Vayne ban them. If you think Thresh needs a nerf, then I implore you to look at the list of buff/nerf changes to Thresh over the last two years. It seems to me like maybe other supports might need some buffs, instead...
Malix Farwin1 votesI think you might need to rethink a couple of things. Thresh can be shut down. Vayne can be shut down.
In fact, my brother just played a wildly successful game as Nunu support. You can beat Vayne with a multitude of champions. If you don't like seeing Thresh and Vayne ban them. If you think Thresh needs a nerf, then I implore you to look at the list of buff/nerf changes to Thresh over the last two years. It seems to me like maybe other supports might need some buffs, instead...
the big problem with bot lane is that it's diversity has alway been pretty bad compared to other lanes by a long shot. There is usually only 2 champs played almost evey game where it is nowhere near to case for other lanes.
manbearswine1 votes[{quoted}](name=Malix Farwin,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2015-09-17T02:34:56.559+0000)
the big problem with bot lane is that it's diversity has alway been pretty bad compared to other lanes by a long shot. There is usually only 2 champs played almost evey game where it is nowhere near to case for other lanes.
That's cause they refuse to nerf thresh,and the vayne problem is rather new,adcs generally didn't get to this level of popularity unless something was very wrong.
MrWasjig1 votesOr another suggestion I heard once was bringing up other Supports and ADCs, rather than nerfing those two. I dunno what the best solution is either way but I thought it was mentioning alternatives for your pondering.
manbearswine1 votesOr another suggestion I heard once was bringing up other Supports and ADCs, rather than nerfing those two. I dunno what the best solution is either way but I thought it was mentioning alternatives for your pondering.
Nah it's a bad idea,you want to buff an entire class? you do it through itemization. Otherwise you will just choke on thresh/vayne for years while buffed champions invalidate older ones even harder,eventually when everyone is buffed it will be okay,but it will be a horrible process,on top of it just making your job harder.
Nerf op shit,buff itemization if the role isn't strong enough.
MrWasjig1 votesWell if item buffing would bring more diversity to botlane then honestly I'm all for it. Over the past few months I've seen many threads suggesting ideas for such a change.
manbearswine1 votesWell if item buffing would bring more diversity to botlane then honestly I'm all for it. Over the past few months I've seen many threads suggesting ideas for such a change.
Yes buffing certain itemization will help but it doesn't change the fact that YOU NEED TO NERF THRESH,he is over the top and he will stay that way unless something is done about it. As to vayne,vayne appeared recently,and is part of a meta shift,so maybe item changes will push her to balance,thresh however isn't part of a meta shift,no reason to believe item changes will move him anywhere. Even so one needs to to think what the itemization changes will mean,you might need to nerf vayne anyway.
But yeah,reworking the spellthief line should be able to bring some diversity,might also consider face of the mountain line nerfs,as tanks(supports that is) are clearly dominating hard right now(mind you it seems not to be an issue with itemization,but more that they fit the role better,this one will be hard to change).
JnFnRu1 votesI said in another thread already. This is what they need to do with the 3 (i add Jinx to the holy trinity of bot lane)
Thresh: Half his Grab range OR Half his Lantern OR Remove his e slow OR Remove the additional 50% slow of his Ult Walls (and reduce the ult dmg, its too high for 90% slow)
Jinx: Lower Rocket Range OR Increase toggle CD to, lets say 5seconds so she can't poke endlessly OR Increase Mana cost per rocket OR Remove 110% dmg and critchance from Rockets.
Vayne: Make e a skillshot OR Change True Dmg to Magic OR Remove silver bolt proc from E.
MrWasjig1 voteshttp://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/p8wpz1pW-why-is-thresh-allowed-to-remain-as-the-best-support-since-his-release?comment=0005 In regards to nerfing Thesh. This comment pretty much sums it up.
Silents4291 votesThat's the board spirit, nerf a champion just because you don't want to see them!
Call A Dr1 votesAmen,
Vayne is beyond broke, her kit is so powerful, thresh is ok, he is just amplified if he gets a good team, more so than others, but in lane, dodge his Q, win ur lane, its as simple as that.
But vayne, true dmg, dmg % HP, knockback/stun Gapclose/Dmg, let's just not even talk about her R.
Athenes Lulu1 votesI've grown used to Thresh because it's possible to stop anything he does. Janna and I can force him to drown in our shits. I actually see other supports being played, so I don't see the deal this time. And then there's me who's just as overloaded, without the lockdown cc this time
The real problem here is Vayne. She's overloaded because she has the mobility of Kalista + scaling of Jinx combined, which stirs up into a nightmare that we have wondered why this exists in the first place and attracts toxic players too.
It's okay if you have to force yourself to deal with her like how you should deal with a Katarina: kill them ASAP. Katarina is not a problem because she is forced to stop and channel in to get damage done, therefore making her vulnerable. However, Vayne can roll across the map, STEALTHED, and will end up dealing more damage than Kat does WITH MORE SAFETY.
If you want Vayne to remain "balanced" without changing her kit... nope, you're out of luck. Same goes for Thresh.
manbearswine1 votes[{quoted}](name=Cancerous Lulu,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iinTEvYf,comment-id=000e,timestamp=2015-09-17T18:39:20.852+0000)
I've grown used to Thresh because it's possible to stop anything he does. Janna and I can force him to drown in our shits.
1)You're not lulu. 2)That's only if he's bad.
I actually see other supports being played, so I don't see the deal this time.
And then there's me who's just as overloaded, without the lockdown cc this time
And hows your kill pressure in lane? Roam potential? safety prior to 6? You know how big a focus bot lane is for ganks right?
The real problem here is Vayne. She's overloaded because she has the mobility of Kalista + scaling of Jinx combined, which stirs up into a nightmare that we have wondered why this exists in the first place
and attracts toxic players too.
It's okay if you have to force yourself to deal with her like how you should deal with a Katarina: kill them ASAP. Katarina is not a problem because she is forced to stop and channel in to get damage done, therefore making her vulnerable. However, Vayne can roll across the map, STEALTHED, and will end up dealing more damage than Kat does WITH MORE SAFETY.
And here I thought "you" had a point click reveal and cc,and could bully her out of lane...
If you want Vayne to remain "balanced" without changing her kit... nope, you're out of luck. Same goes for Thresh.
Except that vayne has been balanced for a very long priod of time before getting out of control again,thresh they never actually tried to balance,but he can be.