New Conqueror bother me a bit...

Daddy ReTaric··9 votes·12,355 views

Conqueror (Precision Keystone) [New Effect] "Attacks or spells that deal damage to an enemy champion grant 3-15 Adaptive Force (based on level) for 3s (8s for melee). Stacks up to 5 times. When fully stacked, heal for 10% of damage dealt to champions and convert 10% of that damage to True Damage."

Now if you think about it it will be extremely strong. because now ''"Attacks or spells that deal damage will apply a stack so AD caster can now take this runes , same for Mage. That's the first thing that bother me.

Second is this ,** heal for 10% of damage dealt to champions**.. this is basically a item 3812 or item 3146 on a keystone.. Champions that build either of said item , will most likely take Conqueror. Not only that, champion who have healing in their kit make the runes just over the top. Think of Red Kayn . He heal for a % everytime he hit an enemy champion, and deal Max health % damage physical. Red Kayn player tend to take Conqueror or Dark Harvest but once new Conqueror hit the live server, I garentee you that everyone will take Conqueror. Not only it will be easier to stack for Kayn as he will have to Q+AA+W+AA+Q again and conqueror is stacked. Most of Red Kayn also take Death dance somewhere in their kit so basically he will just be a sustain monster while receiving a good chunk of AD and deal 10% of his % max health damage in true damage. This rune apply to many champion as well, like Darius . His passive is 5 stack ,and his kit is made so he can get 5 stack rather quickly, and now that it apply to spell as well, it's basically a second Darius passive on top of his bonus AD. Not to ignore the fact that his Q heal for missing health of the 3 champions he hit. Hell, even Akali might take this runes to get healing back on every spell including the item 3146 she take every game... The true damage is lame but the 10% damage heal added randomly is just stupid.. It should not hit live server.

54 Comments

PhearBunny9 votes

the change is better than live Conqueror. From a balance standpoint.

Daddy ReTaric8 votes

{quoted}

the change is better than live Conqueror. From a balance standpoint.

So everyone being able to use conqueror is a better balance standpoint for you? May I say that it refresh as long you attack an enemy? That's Fervor of the battle boosted on steroids... it's not going to be okay.

Solo Q Memes9 votes

I agree that it will not be okay. No balance changes are ever okay anymore because some champions can abuse the shit out of something at all times. Its always the excessive healing, shielding, or damage that causes problems. Something is always fucked.

AirKingNeo2 votes

from a balanced bruiser rune to a broken rune ranged champions like Cassiopeia abuses?

Are you sure?

PhearBunny5 votes

itll be fine.

Daddy ReTaric4 votes

{quoted}

itll be fine.

I highly doubt it.

five oh tree 4 votes

It's going to be a primarily marksman keystone, calling it now. Welcome to the adc class being indirectly buffed. Again. It was only inevitable as it hadn't happened this season yet.

heroikc3 votes

I thought you're only healed for the same amount as the true damage (10%, in this case)? Also, not all mages may be interested in Conqueror in the long run; remember, most mages are more interested in using their abilities for damage, rather than autos. At most, it would only be a small handful of mages who'd go for it. I'm more concerned about whether or not tanks will come back...

Daddy ReTaric3 votes

{quoted}

I thought you're only healed for the same amount as the true damage (10%, in this case)? Also, not all mages may be interested in Conqueror in the long run; remember, most mages are more interested in using their abilities for damage, rather than autos. At most, it would only be a small handful of mages who'd go for it. I'm more concerned about whether or not tanks will come back...

No, 10% of damage dealth once full stacked heal you and 10% of said damage is converted in true damage, not the opposite and it will affect battle mage the most, like Cass, Ryze, Azir.

Grimspeake3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Quinn Is Bae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-02-15T19:40:29.396+0000)

No, 10% of damage dealth once full stacked heal you and 10% of said damage is converted in true damage, not the opposite and it will affect battle mage the most, like Cass, Ryze, Azir.

Its actually gonna be nutty on ryze

heroikc1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Quinn Is Bae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-02-15T19:40:29.396+0000)

No, 10% of damage dealth once full stacked heal you and 10% of said damage is converted in true damage, not the opposite and it will affect battle mage the most, like Cass, Ryze, Azir.

Azir, maybe, but I'm trouble seeing Cass and Ryze use it, giving they're more spell MGs. Maybe rumble for sustain reasons...

Daddy ReTaric2 votes

{quoted}

Azir, maybe, but I'm trouble seeing Cass and Ryze use it, giving they're more spell MGs. Maybe rumble for sustain reasons...

well damage done apply to spell as well... so they can still use it.

heroikc1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Quinn Is Bae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=0004000000010000,timestamp=2019-02-15T22:02:45.940+0000)

well damage done apply to spell as well... so they can still use it.

OK, I see it now; had to double check my sources. Problem was I kept thinking it as a pseudo successor for Fervor.

Daddy ReTaric2 votes

{quoted}

OK, I see it now; had to double check my sources. Problem was I kept thinking it as a pseudo successor for Fervor.

it is but way stronger..

Bjørnetjenesten3 votes

Damage down, Burst down, sustain up idk sounds like a win to me.

Jenivie3 votes

dont knock it till you try it, playing against it on pbe feels so much better than current conqueror so...

Z3Sleeper1 votes

Yeah cuz it sucks on almost everyone the current one is good on.

Risk of Fate3 votes

[deleted]

Tempist2 votes

Imagine playing a relatively immobile melee bruiser top into something like Cassi, Ryze, even Teemo using the new conqueror. Even now, those are all awful matchups from the melee's perspective. With the new conqueror, it will be far worse.

Z3Sleeper4 votes

Duration is refreshed on each hit so yeah, Ryze can.

In situations where Ryze/Cass don't need the utility of Phase Rush, Conq is just a massive dueling power spike. +15-75 AP at max stacks and 10% healing? That's old Ryze's ult all over again and current Cass on steroids.

Daddy ReTaric1 votes

{quoted}

Duration is refreshed on each hit so yeah, Ryze can.

In situations where Ryze/Cass don't need the utility of Phase Rush, Conq is just a massive dueling power spike. +15-75 AP at max stacks and 10% healing? That's old Ryze's ult all over again and current Cass on steroids.

Exactly

Wild Geese3 votes

There's Two big problems with this new conquerer I can foresee:

  1. The proc window timer for melee is 8 seconds, that's insane. That's an eternity to disengage if somebody is stacking it on you, to compare that's twice as much as PTA.

  2. The healing has no aoe or dot reduction. You heal 10% of all damage dealt.. no other heals do this (33% effective) Imagine Darius hits a 3+ man Q? Katarina 3+ man R? MF R? Any big damage aoe- They are going to heal for full with conq stacked up. If this isn't patched before live I dunno what to say..

Daddy ReTaric3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Wild Geese,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-02-16T00:51:58.297+0000)

There's Two big problems with this new conquerer I can foresee:

  1. The proc window timer for melee is 8 seconds, that's insane. That's an eternity to disengage if somebody is stacking it on you, more than twice as bad as PTA.

  2. The healing has no aoe or dot reduction. You heal 10% of all damage dealt.. no other heals do this (33% effective) Imagine Darius hits a 3+ man Q? Katarina 3+ man R? MF R? Any big damage aoe- They are going to heal for full with conq stacked up. If this isn't patched before live I dunno what to say..

Exactly. There is no restriction... it will be just insane. Kat also build Hextech gunblade so the healing she will get will be a nightmare like in the early seasons where hextech gunblade spellvamp was not unique and best Kat /Akali build was to stack hextech gunblade... Something need to be done or else it will be a nightmare to balance.

Grimspeake2 votes

Lucian gonna be so broken

ContDeCaterinca12 votes

Top lane nerf, because you can't stack it on minions and huge jungle buff.

Once MasterYi and Jax get some attack speed, they are gonna proc it instantly in ganks.

ModWulf Helhammer2 votes

It’s not “heal for 10% damage dealt”, it’s for the amount of true damage it deals (rather, an equal percentage of damage that gets converted to true damage) and only once it fully stacks.

Daddy ReTaric2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Wilk Łucznik,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-02-15T19:18:08.905+0000)

It’s not “heal for 10% damage dealt”, it’s for the amount of true damage it deals (rather, an equal percentage of damage that gets converted to true damage) and only once it fully stacks.

It's the opposite, you heal 10% of the damage done once full stacked and 10% of said damage is converted to true damage. Not the other way arround.

ModWulf Helhammer1 votes

Attacks or spells that deal damage to an enemy champion grant 3-15 Adaptive Force (based on level) for 3s (8s for melee). Stacks up to 5 times. When fully stacked, 10% of your damage is converted to True Damage and you heal for that amount.

https://1.bp.blogspot.com/-xfNQZ8m1xak/XGHtiVDCb6I/AAAAAAABOxU/FKAO5Yf_6qkyJeBr0uEGzaO-l_PW4uYTgCLcBGAs/s1600/conqueror.png

Incorrect.

It's true damage first, heal based off of that.

five oh tree 1 votes

Do (either of) you not realize that it's the same effect either way? The only instance where the order of effects matters is against targets who have negative resists.

Chembaron Yamada1 votes

Doesn't that mean it is even higher than OP expected? If 10% of your damage is converted to true damage, then the true damage will represent more than 10% of your damage over all, meaning that you will heal more than if you heal for 10% of your damage dealt and the true damage is calculated afterwards.

Or am I mistaken?

Z3Sleeper1 votes

Nope you're right. Healing from true damage is much more. At 50 armor that's already only 6.6% healing if it was after resists but true just bumps it up to the flat 10% of pre-mitigation.

Moonscourge2 votes

It has the healing because the combat requirement means they will actually have more room before they actually want to fight. Very short trades are their counter, compared to now where they just hit a minion and keep it ready to proc forever, then jump you and there is absolutely nothing that you could have done about it.

Daddy ReTaric2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Snake of Avarice,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=000a,timestamp=2019-02-15T22:05:28.490+0000)

It has the healing because the combat requirement means they will actually have more room before they actually want to fight. Very short trades are their counter, compared to now where they just hit a minion and keep it ready to proc forever, then jump you and there is absolutely nothing that you could have done about it.

I call it, it will be problematic anyway when it hit live.

Z3Sleeper2 votes

I just hate how much it screws Yorick over. Need it to proc on Ghouls otherwise Yorick has to auto 4 times to make use of it. And Yorick ain't exactly a melee scrapper.

Abibyama II1 votes

I prefer grasp anyways

Śhunpo2 votes

Mages just got a whole lot more unhealthy.

Daddy ReTaric1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Seth L9,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ihYcUuRw,comment-id=0010,timestamp=2019-02-16T04:42:54.484+0000)

Mages just got a whole lot more unhealthy.

Agreed.

DragonShea2 votes

remove the heal and it's all good.

SweedishGunner1 votes

This is going to be crazy on Sylas.

Razelth1 votes

It'll be great when I use my entire kit to proc conqueror and then not have any other ability to be able to utilize the rune for what its worth :D. Btw Kayn Q has a 3 second cooldown with 40% cdr. Current conqueror will be easier to proc with that combo you're suggesting lol. I don't know what the hell EE is supposed to mean. Enter wall then exit? Lovely post.

Daddy ReTaric1 votes

{quoted}

It'll be great when I use my entire kit to proc conqueror and then not have any other ability to be able to utilize the rune for what its worth :D. Btw Kayn Q has a 3 second cooldown with 40% cdr. Current conqueror will be easier to proc with that combo you're suggesting lol. I don't know what the hell EE is supposed to mean. Enter wall then exit? Lovely post.

Meant W. Typo from my part. I swear people will complain if this runes goes live..just you see.

Razelth1 votes

People complain about everything, regardless of how significant the change is. That statement means nothing at all.

Kaìju1 votes

The thing about mages is that it only has a 3 second duration. What mages are you worried about?

Because aside from Karthus, Swain, and maybe a small handful of others it will run off before they can stack it full and start leaching health.

Mimr1 votes

{quoted}

The thing about mages is that it only has a 3 second duration. What mages are you worried about?

Because aside from Karthus, Swain, and maybe a small handful of others it will run off before they can stack it full and start leaching health.

As Swain Phase Rush is mandatory anyway to keep opponents in range of your R for any relevant amount of time. But new Conqueror would certainly have been nice on him if he didn't have the aforementioned mobility issues.

AlexisTheDragon1 votes

{quoted}

As Swain Phase Rush is mandatory anyway to keep opponents in range of your R for any relevant amount of time. But new Conqueror would certainly have been nice on him if he didn't have the aforementioned mobility issues.

He's got everything issues lol.

Champs garbage.

Predatorator1 votes

as far as i know, darius bleed ticks don't proc it, and it should work this way for most dots. Also most mages will still go sorcery, since it gives more ap

Daddy Ants1 votes

Ashe can apply all 5 stacks with Q.

Anchorit Wracaj1 votes

CONQUEROR ADDAPTIVE FORCE NEEDS TO GO OUT. ITS OKAY FOR HEALING/TRUE DMG. BUT GET OUT THE ADDAPTIVE FORCE BONUS.THAT WILL BE THE MAIN PROBLEM,REMOVE IT

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