So Force Pulse

Greymoore·Sep 17, 2016·9 votes·4,310 views

Whats the point in the charge system built into the force pulse of .You dont gain any benefits from the charges aside from simply being able to cast the ability.

30 Comments

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20168 votes

It's mainly a way of giving Kass increased access to his E in busy team fights versus in solo situations.

As a secondary benefit it also has some soft impact on which enemies Kass is a good choice against, though overall other factors are more important in determining which lanes are good/bad match ups for him.

AnonagonSep 17, 20168 votes

But that doesn't matter because it already has a standard cooldown anyway. You could have it do something different that makes more use out of the same idea, like an extremely low cooldown version (1 or 2 seconds) to give Kassadin some insane teamfight AoE Or have spell casts not be required to cast it, but instead simply reduce the cooldown, (then increase the cooldown to compensate of course) One of those would make it so Force Pulse feels like Kassadin benefits from the stack mechanic, rather than it being a power gate.

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20163 votes

Yeah, it's a power gate. We could make a number of changes that would make it feel better, be more effective when used well. The issue there is that we don't have room to buff Kassadin. His core thing is his repeated blink, that has to sap a lot of power from the rest of his kit in compensation.

AnonagonSep 17, 20162 votes

yeah, I don't really play kassadin so I couldnt tell you if he actually needed buffs

though I do think if you are really clever about it you could change it in a way that is both power neutral and feels better for the kassadin player. You could make it feel like its a benefit to the player, while still being effectively a power gate

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20169 votes

Kass is probably slightly closer to needing nerfs than buffs at present. Historically he's been a really hard champ to get into a somewhat balanced position though, so this is actually quite a good spot for him. That means both that we're cautious about making unnecessary changes to him and that there are other champs that need the work more. Changes that gate power as needed, and feel good to the player are possible, though often challenging designs. Adding a hard to balance champion to that mix increases the difficulty further. Still potentially doable, but at risk of being a lot of time that could be much better spent elsewhere is all.

DecritSep 17, 20164 votes

had enough of 2 years+ of Kass with 90%+ ban rate huh? :D

LankPantsSep 17, 20162 votes

had enough of 2 years+ of Kass with 90%+ ban rate huh? :D

Everyone has.

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20163 votes

TLDR: Yes

SlashStrikerSep 17, 20161 votes

you can reduce kassadin overall damage while reducing the cooldown on his E at the same time for similar DPS so you could shift his power more on his E and R to make it feel right

VanjieSep 17, 20161 votes

He's not in a bad spot. Charge system sounds nice.

Btw Meddler:http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/skin-champion-concepts/Ftn9y0mb-meddler-no-communication-regarding-karma you don't have to respond but it would be nice if any Red Name did

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20163 votes

I can't really offer anything new on Karma that wasn't covered in the post below a couple of months back, my apologies.

http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/b3tcEoFZ-while-karma-might-be-healthy-and-even-strong-especially-in-this-meta

adidasSep 17, 20162 votes

{quoted}

Kass is probably slightly closer to needing nerfs than buffs at present. Historically he's been a really hard champ to get into a somewhat balanced position though, so this is actually quite a good spot for him. That means both that we're cautious about making unnecessary changes to him and that there are other champs that need the work more. Changes that gate power as needed, and feel good to the player are possible, though often challenging designs. Adding a hard to balance champion to that mix increases the difficulty further. Still potentially doable, but at risk of being a lot of time that could be much better spent elsewhere is all.

I feel like i have no damage with kassadin outside of lane.

Then again im pretty sure you guys made it so he has to land his 400 / 800 riftwalks to kill someone right?

Ive probably been playing him wrong hah.

Teridax68Sep 17, 20161 votes

Considering how difficult it's been to balance Kassadin and make him feel great across his entire kit, would you consider doing some updates to his gameplay farther down the line? Right now, I imagine there are many more champions that could probably benefit more from that same work, but it does feel like Kass can't really be great at everything he's meant to do right now (he can't really have a lot of front-loaded burst if he can blink anywhere on demand, for example).

Chromatic EagleSep 17, 20161 votes

Just out of curiosity, him being such a hard champ to balance, is that grounds for a VGU?

RiotMeddlerSep 17, 20163 votes

It's the sort of thing that contributes to a champ's odds of getting a VGU yeah. Kass isn't on our list for next year at the very least though.

DessemSep 17, 20161 votes

But that doesn't matter because it already has a standard cooldown anyway.

It actually sort of does. During laning phase, I can't throw out E willy-nilly to clear waves or punish an enemy with Q+E when they wander in range, because my E is gated behind two requirements rather than just one (CD). It takes a little power from Kassadin, which makes his laning phase a little weaker without affecting his teamfighting.

For example, Kassadin vs Azir means you'll have E up a LOT, while you'll get to use it less against Varus.

Side-note: Kassadin's E also functions as a sort of radar. If you stand close enough, you can actually detect the jungler being near Raptors by way of checking your E counter go up despite no abilities being used in lane. It's also a good warning for Shaco. :D

ReZisT LustSep 17, 20161 votes

Push i just auto kass with my zap stick soldiers are my [slayer-pantheon-thumbs] people too imma be a real leader and go full ad Ra-merica

MunchCrunchLunchSep 17, 20162 votes

Meddler. here is a thing. kassasdin. has one of the lowest. scalings. in the game. but also. kassadin. has one of the lowest base damages in the game. why is his E gated like this? when his whole combo has way weaker than that of leblanc fizz and such.

Hello I am BirdSep 17, 20161 votes

Because he has a lot of blinks that doesn't let him have much power elsewhere

SlashStrikerSep 17, 20162 votes

What do you mean by benefit since its has 6 seconds cooldown??? The only thing I see it is as being restriction, but not benefit. Other champions has much lower cooldowns than kass and being able to cast their abilities way more often than him

I understand if the ability has 2 seconds cooldown but its has 6 seconds cooldown and high mana cost at the same time

LXIISep 17, 20161 votes

You missed the "versus in solo situations" part. In solo situations it's actually gated because there aren't as many casts going off, so even though there is a 6 second cooldown, it may not be available after 6 seconds. However in a teamfight he would be able to use it pretty much on cooldown.

SlashStrikerSep 17, 20163 votes

compared to who? Cassiopeia Cass? Q E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E E ......

or maybe Yasuo Yasuo? E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q E Q ......

yeah these characters have tons of gates in them

LXIISep 17, 20161 votes

???

Not compared to anyone but himself. It's a gate on his own power in solo situations vs teamfights.

Don't even know why you're dragging other champs into this. lol

SlashStrikerSep 17, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=CB Thea Queen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=iL5EIZIw,comment-id=00020002000000000000,timestamp=2016-09-17T10:46:40.670+0000)

???

Not compared to anyone but himself. It's a gate on his own power in solo situations vs teamfights.

Don't even know why you're dragging other champs into this. lol

you really think kassadin is stronger than cassiopeia right now who is able to spam E?

Kassadin has 6 seconds cooldown on his E. What gate of power are you talking about exactly?

LXIISep 17, 20162 votes

You are STILL doing it.

Nobody is comparing Kassadin to anyone. LITERALLY NOBODY.

I'll say it slow. It. is. a. gate. on. his. own. power. Not Cassiopeia's power, not Yasuo's power, his own power.

Yes, he has a 6 second cooldown on his E, it also has the charge mechanic WHICH IS THE GATE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT.

SlashStrikerSep 17, 20162 votes

you got no idea the real meaning of power

well i am comparing him to others so yeah there is somebody

And basically the ability relies on other's spellcasts as well on himself. The ability depends on that and putting a stupid cooldown like that defeats this exact purpose

You may reduce the cooldown down to 2 seconds while reducing the overall damage to shift the power and keep the balance and ability concept

also lets not forget the more you cast abilities the less mana you will have