Warmog's and %-bonus HP

ProfDrDeath·Jan 7, 2015·15 votes·1,412 views

What if Warmog's had the following recipe and effects:

: + + + 1000 = 3200 gold total 640 to 800 HP (EDIT: 800-1000 HP after passive) Unique passive: 1% of max HP regenerated every 5 seconds. Increased to 3% every 5 seconds out of combat. Unique passive: +25% bonus HP

Thoughts for this idea:

A 3000+ gold tanky item that effectively adds a multiplicator for tankiness.
Current anti-HP-stack options are strong enough to accomodate for a little more health in the game. Especially since it has the same price point as the most expensive of those (3200 gold).
Low-ish stat-to-gold on its own work against the old 'Mog's problem of being overwhelming on its own.

Worries:

Would it make manaless bruisers to strong? If yes, how could an item be set up to circumvent that?

24 Comments

Laughing FishJan 7, 20156 votes

I think it is a good idea. With armor/magic penetration as strong as it is now, more HP is needed for tanks to remain "tanky". The main problem I see, however, is for high damage bruisers such as Darius could become *too *hard to kill. Also, I personally dislike required items for a position (such as Last Whisper for ADC), and thusI think the regeneration and the +% health passive should be on separate items. This would leave more room for customization and build order, instead of simply rushing warmog's every game.

KrizalidJan 7, 20151 votes

[deleted]

Laughing FishJan 7, 20151 votes

lol, Which of you posted first?

KrizalidJan 7, 20152 votes

Wait, what? I didn't post that at all. What's wrong with the forums? o.o I was actually sitting in the skins/champions section.

ProfDrDeathJan 7, 20152 votes

Weird.

Laughing FishJan 7, 20151 votes

Strange.

ProfDrDeathJan 7, 20152 votes

Me.

And this is not one of my smurfs.

ProfDrDeathJan 7, 20151 votes

True.

However, with its huge cost and lowish cost-effectiveness when not already having at least some extra bonus HP, I'd intend it actually NOT to be a viable rush item - quite the contrary, in fact. In doubt, you could lower the flat HP given by Warmog's to 720 (giving 900 HP total) or even 640 (giving its current 800 HP in total).

Laughing FishJan 7, 20151 votes

A very valid point. I think lowering the flat amount to 640 would certainly make the item more well rounded.

GrimspeakeJan 7, 20154 votes

25% sounds like an awful lot... definately have to be a unique passive

edit: well im sorry if people disagree with me, i just thought it would be abused quite a bit if the passive wasnt unique... cuz 25% can be a lot if all of the sudden u stack a lot of hp items. looking back on it then it would be horrible going against anyone with a botrk, im sorry i was wrong. at least i think?

item 3083 item 3143 item 3068 item 3075 item 3065 item 3153

sustain champs...

...already going back up with votes...

ProfDrDeathJan 7, 20157 votes

Old Ancient Golem was 25%, too. And a unique passive, indeed.

Point is here, you pay 700 gold for the passive, with only getting 200 HP back (initially). You'd need 1048 bonus health before the passive for it to become gold-efficient - meaning, at least one other biggish HP item.

VisigothJan 8, 20152 votes

{quoted}

25% sounds like an awful lot... definately have to be a unique passive

mid season 4 they changed the tank jungler item (Spirit of the Ancient Golem) to have that passive and it wasn't op. Efficient? Yes. Broken? Not even close

RebonackJan 8, 20153 votes

We need a +25% Bonus HP item.

Badly.

But I don't think Warmog's is a good fit. It already has its regen passive. Better to stick it on a new item instead.

exiledFromBadmenJan 8, 20151 votes

What about Juggernaut?

Leti the YetiJan 8, 20151 votes

fking genius! now I might actually keep my trailblazers instead of never upgrading to juggernaut and sell the useless crap late game

at the same time, this item wont be available for non jungle tanks so that would suck heeey, might as well have 2 % health items, just make the passive unique

exiledFromBadmenJan 8, 20151 votes

What about Spirit Visage(By removing its passive)? So it can be a replacement for Warmog's

SecretAgentHulkJan 7, 20151 votes

Gold-wise it'd be 1000g extra for:

-160 HP (I like the 640 stat), which is worth -427g
Regen passive, which is worth 247g (if current Warmog's is 100% gold-efficient)
+25% bonus HP, which ends up being worth 1180g (1000+427-247). This requires 1130 bonus HP (beyond Warmog's 640) to be gold-efficient.

So I think I'd be OK with this change, or at least with it being tested. You'd have to stack a lot of health (beyond e.g. Randuin's/Spirit Visage) to make it worth. It would definitely make me think twice about buying it (which is good, as it is one of my go-to tank item just because of the sustain) and encourage more strategy in building tanks.

(Mundo loves it, obviously.)

TheI3igDaddyJan 8, 20151 votes

I'm all for this. It's an item completely based around health. No resists, just health. I'd be for the cost increase if these changes went though.

Lajinn5Jan 8, 20151 votes

It would be nice to have a god tank item, carries have their ridiculous penetration items that render tanks null and void, in addition to Rabadons/Infinity Edge. What do tanks have? Absolutely nothing, I fully support bringing back +25% bonus HP and putting it on Warmogs, maybe make tanks slightly more difficult to kill in league of penetration

Ale non è maleJan 8, 20151 votes

Warmog need to get back to his origins. 1000 HP, 1,5% of max Hp regenerated every 5 seconds. Nothing less, nothing more. There are just champs that for working have to stack max HP. Reduce starting health forces these champs to build extra items to get health, basically throwing them out of the meta because you delay a lot their power curve by forcing them to spend a lot of gold in further items to get results

ThryaleJan 8, 20151 votes

you must not have been playing this game for long.

Original warmogs had scaling hp per unit killed (like 3 hp or so) and 10 times that amount for killing champs up to a cap of around 1.3k hp or so. It also gave flat hp regen/5 as well as more hp regen/5 for each unit killed up to a cap of around 40-60 ish

Force of Nature is the item that originally had % max hp regen

ProfDrDeathJan 8, 20151 votes

Original 'Mog's:

3k gold

Belt + Ruby + Regrowth Pendant 920 HP 30 Hp5

~~Unique~~ Passive: Gain 4.5 HP + 0.15 Hp5 per CS, 10x for kills/assists, max 450 HP and 15 Hp5

Yes, it gave 1370 HP fully stacked. And was stackable

ThryaleJan 8, 20151 votes

Well... I was close... XD

Thx for the exact numbers mate. :D

doubleguacJan 8, 20151 votes

Warmogs is already a relatively cost-efficient item. The problem with it is that health stacking is a horrible idea right now. BotRK + LW absolutely tears through champions who prioritize health over other stats. That's not even mentioning liandries, or the plethora of champions who have on-demand access to % health damage.

Buffing warmogs is a band-aid fix to a larger problem. The problem isn't with warmogs itself--it's with health stacking being too easily countered.

I really hope they solve this problem soon, because champions like Voli and Mundo are getting screwed over.