The Future of Kindred

The Yetii Rider··2 votes·4,134 views
http://i3.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/original/001/039/426/fbe.jpg

Kindred is a champion that has been...a headache, for many, since her release. When she first came out, she was a strong counterjungler who was incentivized to delve deep into enemy territory very early in the game. Her healing, kiting, and the promise of marks were her tools, and she cut down many melees who dared to enter her territory.

Fast forward a bit and we see the results of a kit that has three auto target effects and one point and click slow: it's annoying. Kindred suffers from a general lack of counterplay. When you're fighting her, she doesn't offer much in the way of interaction. You can't dodge her spells, you can't burst her down, you can't escape her and you can't out DPS her, usually. Even if you do, she has a button that causes death to delay, so that she can catch up in the DPS war before both of you become mortal again.

In her current iteration, I don't think Kindred will ever be let out of the doghouse again. She is very unfun to play against. However, Riot designed the entire patience system around her so I doubt they are going to turn their backs on her completely. I think we may be able to salvage her kit if we work on it somehow.

A few ideas to introduce counterplay and make Kindred less of a stat-check duelist:

A) Kindred's W causes Wolf to appear and become targetable. He attacks the enemy, but the enemy gains a small burst of health for killing him (similar to a neutral monster) and while Wolf is dead Kindred cannot use her E. Otherwise functions the same with the zone and the Q CD.

B) Kindred's R is completely replaced, and instead reduces the damage those inside can take by a large percentage for the duration. It starts out very high and rapidly degenerates to 0. This would allow Kindred to use it as a shield against burst damage (Starting percent could be 70/80/90% based on rank) which rewards mechanical skill, and allows enemies to play around it and kill her afterwards.

C) Kindred's Q fires three arrows in various directions, similar to Twisted Fate's Wild Card. This may hurt her ability to clear a bit but she's ranged so a weak clear should be her primary weakness (same with Graves, we'll get there eventually). As long as her abilities aren't all brainless autolock she can actually have decent numbers to back them up.

So, what do you all think? I have a poll, but the poll descriptions are too short so here are the options:

POLL

A - Top Lane has already been overrun by ranged champs. Keep her in the trash can!

B - I dislike Kindred in general, but I still don't think any champion should be unplayable. Maybe a small nerf to her somewhere and we can buff her in exchange?

C - Mastery 7 Kindred Main since Preseason 1, her last nerfs were bullshit!

D - I don't play Kindred but League needs every furry girl to be viable so we can have more hentai.

E - Kindred is a them, not a her! Respect the unstated preferred pronouns of fictional metaphysical representations of abstract concepts!

F - Ayyy let me get a sauce on that pic OP!

4 Comments

DuskDaUmbreon2 votes

Wait. You're calling for a nerf. To Kindred!? They're strong!? Why has nobody told my win rate that, yet? I should be gold III with them, not bronze IV! It shouldn't feel like a constant uphill battle the entire game, until you hopefully become able to damage tanks worth a crap, and not be deleted instantly by everyone, including fucking Soraka!

Seriously. I don't think anyone besides the intermediate bots I play against ever feel like Kindred's too strong. Sure, they've got a ton of potential power. But for having to invade to actually be useful, they lack the clear speed needed early-on. Hell, I'm a goddamn mastery 6 on them, and I can only barely walk away from raptors with a mere sliver of my health. Compared to the other infinite stack champions (Nasus, Veigar, Cho'Gath, and Thresh), they just feel...weak. Like auto attacking with full-support Soraka. Tanks, melee champions, hell, even half of the "supports" are able to instakill them. It just feels…pathetic. Their ult is nice, being an AoE Trynd ult, but it's just damned hard to use. Like, if you fuck up with Bard's ult, which is rather similar, you're punished with just freezing an ally where you didn't want to, or with an enemy surviving a burn/poison. With Kindred, you're punished with a ton of health for the enemy team, and not near enough health for you to survive with.

Their health is on-par with Nidalee and Katarina…After Kindred have bought Black Cleaver. That'd be fine, if they were able to thrash enemies as fast as those two can. But, oftentimes, outside of the very early game, they just can't. They feel VERY feast-or-famine, because you're always too squishy to risk going into the enemy's jungle, unless you're curb stomping. In which case, there's no point, because only epic monsters mark after 8 hunts. Trying to get a hunt in late-game is near impossible, because you just get bursted to nothing so damned fast. Like, old Katarina level burst, but by anyone that does damage. Hell, running into a support is often a death-sentence for them, because they get CCed and worn down.

I can agree they could use some more interactivity. I, personally, would make their Q more on-par with, say, Vayne's, since they're in the same boat (CC obliterates them, abysmal health, they either instakill their target or are instakilled, and their passives (Vayne's E is just a rankable passive) are meant to fuck tanks over), but that'd kinda kill their clear even more. Their W definitely could use a change, because Wolf feels less like he's bearing down on the target, and more like he's a fast minion that forgot to shave. I typically just send him out, then forget he exists. The W just becomes solely for the purpose of either a) giving me a chance to actually kill a jungle monster without dying, or b) just cutting my Q's cooldown. Their E makes no sense in their kit, it's their finishing tool (since their base AD always ends up being abysmal), but it's made in a way that encourages it to be used in the beginning, because you need to land that small-ass slow to actually be able to auto them more than twice, because their Q's dash length is outclassed by everyone in the game, including even Rift Scuttler. As I said, their ult is a really nice concept, but all but useless, because you get hit, ult, and are left with enough HP to still be killed by anything, and the people you were just trying to kill are now healed to insanity. It's only really good for saving your team from ignite or Zed's ult. Maybe Lux's ult, but you'll be killed by her just pressing E. It's way too punishing for messing up with it, and just not rewarding enough for even a good use of it. The most you'll get is a "ty" from someone you saved from the last tick of ignite. That's something even Kayle does better.

Hell, I'm only good with them anymore against a team that's just too stupid to beat Kindred. Which covers the grand spectrum of those who are level 20 and below.

In all honesty, they're probably gonna need to have happen what Aatrox had happen. They're just too potentially strong, but they're actually too weak, and would have to be balanced perfectly to not be either busted or useless. I mean, at least giving them a way to contribute to a fight while they're inevitably behind would be nice. Some CC, beyond a 2 second, pathetically weak slow that has a short range, would be nice. Or some utility of some kind, or…something. I really just don't know..

I kinda rambled on for a bit. Sorry.

Also, Ima agree with those last two. So Ima need dat sauce. :3

The Yetii Rider2 votes

I didn't say she was strong. I said she's currently in the doghouse and won't be let out again. She's been nerfed to the ground until Riot can figure out what to do with her, like Evelynn and Urgot. Nowhere in my entire post did I even use the word 'strong'.

She was a horribly overpowered champion from her release until her pile of nerfs last season, because her base stats and heal were centered largely around inexperienced players surviving the jungle with her. This led to pro players taking 0 damage in the jungle with her and invading with full health, easily killing their competition without reprisal.

One thing that's pretty concerning is that the damage and health of jungle monsters is largely tuned to make them threats to melee champions. So how would a ranged champion ever be able to jungle as a main role? They would need some sort of crazy gimmick (like Nidalee's old ability to snare hunted monsters for 2 freaking seconds or Kindred's current monster AS debuff) or really high base stats (Graves's armor, Kindred's old armor) which is unhealthy on a champion that has range when it comes time to actually fight.

DuskDaUmbreon1 votes

Oh. I thought you were saying they were OP…okay. Nvm, then. So, basically I made a long-ass comment in the thought that we were in disagreement…Ah well. Well, I just hope they get a minor rework soon. But I'm pretty sure they could use at least a minor buff to their base stats. Something to let them actually survive when they aren't curb stomping. The recent buff was nice, but…well…shrug

The Yetii Rider2 votes

Like I said in the OP, any change that improves Kindred's clearing will need to be compensated by reducing the stat-stick nature of her kit. She definitely needs more interaction so that her opponents aren't as frustrated when they die to her.

More from Gameplay

More by The Yetii Rider