Does anyone feel like Aatrox is the worst handicap in the game at this point?

iainB85··72 votes·12,279 views

I don't see him to often, but when I see him picked on my team I mentally say, "welp gg boys".

Does anyone else feel this way?

I feel like there are a lot of other champions who aren't the greatest picks, but still contribute value to a team. Aatrox kit offers almost nothing but all in, and he's just god awful at all inning anyone at this point. He seriously does nothing but blow up in every fight, it's so sad.

Maybe I just have a really bad track record seeing this guy, but I dread ever seeing him picked on my team, and am ecstatic whenever the enemy team decides to play this poor soul.

http://orig07.deviantart.net/0925/f/2015/002/1/5/aatrox_by_ff00cc-d8cavw6.png

126 Comments

Jacknife33 votes

The problems Aatrox have are, as nicely described as I can think of, numerous. His power is shifted inconsistently in his abilities, and his theme of "drain-tank God of War" is muddied by balance issues. His passive GA is so strong an ability that if they gave him power elsewhere he'd be OP as hell. Even if he's meant to be a drain tank, constantly trading around health in order to survive a fight, the only way he can do this is to AA people, so basically kite him and he becomes useless, unlike all the other drain tanks in this game that can actually benefit from the different sources of healing they have. His skillshots are extremely tough to land and have horrible cooldowns, even though he relies on them incredibly in order to be effective. His Blood Well encourages tankiness but his health costs discourage it, he has the kit of a fighter needing defenses to survive but the ratios of a carry that needs a lot of late game stats to do damage (AD, crit, armor penetration) yet he doesn't scale super well with any of it. On top of it all his kit is just... bland. Q jumps on people, W heals/extra damage every 3rd hit, E damages and slows, R gives a bunch of buffs, and if you die your passive saves you (if it's up). All of this pooled together creates a clusterfuck of ideas with no direction. That is Aatrox.

Durzaka8 votes

I agree. Aatrox really needs a ground up rework, unfortunately.

Dreamspitter3 votes

Eh, seeing as he sits around 50% win rate, if it happens, it wont happen for 3 years.

Messaiga4 votes

I don't think he needs a ground-up rework. Things I could see staying mostly untouched on him are his passive and his Q. After that, they should take a long look at his lore and modify the rest of his kit based upon that. Aatrox is supposed to be an avatar of war who inspires army to fight back from the brink of defeat. He cuts down mortal men by 10 at once. If such is the case, why is the only thing that Aatrox is strong at is dueling?

He should be a lot like Jarvan, a team-centric bruiser who dives into a fight. He would protect his allies or slaughter his foes. He should thrive right in the center of a fight where he can make the most use of his abilities. That's not to say he would be a tank (far from it). Aatrox still has an identity as a DPS fighter with potent healing. What he needs to make use of it is proper durability and sticking power (both which he lacks currently) while still dealing reasonable damage.

Aatrox's current problems? The impact of his attack speed steroids is diminished by the fact that he has two of them (and one is his R, the other is attached to Blood Well). When he's strong he is immensely frustrating because he has no limit to his sustain on W. He'll max E, poke you down in lane with it. If you trade, he'll disengage with E and sustain with his W healing just by CS'ing. What he needs is more interactivity, inherent counter-play, and in turn he gains the tools he needs to thrive. Basically, the whole "heal from auto-attacking" idea is an archaic design that results in binary gameplay. Putting a potentially huge heal onto a reasonable cooldown and adding requirements for it's usage is much healthier.

I've actually theory-crafted an Aatrox rework which could solve a lot of issues with him, which I posted here. Basically it makes him a much stronger team-fighter (and healthier drain-tank) in concept. I left damage and healing numbers out just in the case of poorly thought-out math.

Balmor03 votes

Is it just me or am i missing sth. but i don't get the vibe of Aatrox being a team fighting oriented. He seems way more selfish than that he doesn't care about his "allies" he fights to satisfy his own basic desire of killing others. In he lore i do not see a part where he cooperates with some one. His GA part of his passive needs to go out the door. I have other posts where i explain my reasoning and give other ideas for chancing him

Edit: I like Aatrox more of a solo champ make him that. Don't make him team reliant that will ruin him

Ralanr2 votes

I can imagine him giving a passive buff to others. But that's all.

He's not a team player, but he sounds like he's supposed to have some effect. I'd suggest it works with minions but that might break the game.

TheWoollyMammoth2 votes

I think of it as more of a mental thing. It can be inspiring to find that one godly aatrox that knows how and when to engage. and JUST. DOESN'T. DIE. If your team was losing before it can stop you guys from surrendering and force one last final hurrah to take the nexus. If you are on the enemy team, and you get killed by his dive burst the moment he jumps in. then he out sustains your tanks.... well you know you are screwed. Its not the champs he helps. its us. The summoners. (cause fuck you retcon, I'm old school, back in the days when malz took on kassadin and karthus and won!) Of course. If he's a failure of a war god he is a failure, seeing a 0/35/2 aatrox on your team with 17 cs definitely isnt good for moral.

Sir Hellsing R1 votes

exactly what happens to me i engage then my team help(once a sona was really helpful healing and stunning enemies)got triple with sona getting a kill after a while

Sir Hellsing R1 votes

thats why i get 10/1 with 120 cs by 20-25 min or maybe 10/0

Balmor01 votes

The main thing holding him back is that stupid revive (pardon my language)

Ralanr1 votes

How's that holding him back? Isn't it the same weakness as every champion with a revive/zhonias?

That being, "I'll just wait patiently until I get to kill you again"

Balmor01 votes

Have you tried to kill someone after your revive gets popped you lose ALL you attack speed boost at max lvl it is 55% gone that is a significant lose with means les w procks less dmg and heal if you haven't killed your opponent he 1 runs away 2 kills you

Sir Hellsing R1 votes

yes and i got another 2 kills after they popped my passive when I'm fed

Sir Hellsing R1 votes

if ur relying on his passive revive then that means u just died once and thats earlygmae only and use it for low hp turret dives the turret will focus minions late game ur w heals u back to full

Messaiga3 votes

My understanding is that he doesn't really fight for any purpose other than watching a war rage on. If a battle seems one-sided he shows up, imbues the losing army with strength and the lust to fight, then moves on.

Still, he inspires people (who from their perspective, see Aatrox as an ally) to fight and has the ability to eviscerate several men at once (this screams teamfight to me for some reason). Essentially he isn't selfless in his actions, but the reasoning behind his actions is selfish (could also apply to solo queue. "I really want to help my teammates, but only so I can win and get LP.").

Knight SoIaire 1 votes

well aatrox's theme overall is something that not everyone can get into

he is indeed a war loving demon like person who doesnt just turn the tides of a certain battle ... but he inspires said warriors to fight on with insane warlust and streght

only when he stopps influencing those people they notice that they were commmiting monstrous acts of brutality

There ias also the paert about his movements ...and other perks that are meant to show his love for war he isnt just some random brute swinging a sword ... but a brutal and ellegant warrior in his own twisted war loving sence

owerall aatrox is a champion who's theme i enjoy but his kit ...

Sir Hellsing R1 votes

i like the current aatrox cause he's my main but i think they should change his r like boosting teams something for blank amount of time then the whole team gets slowed/silenced for a certain amount of time its optional if allies want the buff just click a buff icon on aatrox just like him boosting moral of team then they realize what they've done idk why but right now its me goes in kill then allies help perfectly with the lore but sometimes i just 1 vs 3 and win tho i still need his as steroid tho so a true dmg with dps buff would be nice for 5 sec then a dps debuff for half of that duration and rank increase the true dmg,duration,dps,and duration so its always half of the duration and the cd should be like 200 seconds the cd also scales with rank that would make him fit lore has good counter play and not too broken because of the cd and dps,dmg debuff

Narasimha4 votes

He doesn't cooperate in the traditional sense, but he entire lore is about him leading other people to victory. He doesn't do all the fighting himself, he 'inspires' his allies to conquer.

Balmor01 votes

{quoted}

His passive GA is so strong

His GA part isn't strong at all its one of his worse parts.

YumaS2Astral2 votes

{quoted}

His GA part isn't strong at all its one of his worse parts.

Why?

It is one of his best parts. Thanks to his passive "GA" he can make opponents think twice before focusing him during a teamfight.

Also he can make an opponent that would otherwise kill him go away.

He can also make towerdive attempts a failure.

I don't see how his passive GA is one of his worse parts. However, it is surely taking away a lof of his power budget.

ninjaIRL 8 votes

He's crap. He needs a buff to his sticking power. He also needs his special Melee ADC feature that lets him stay in fight, revive passive, buffed to be less predictable. Yasuo has windwall and general epic mobility to keep safe as a Melee ADC. Tryndamere has his ultimate to stay relevant in team fights. Master Yi has his Alpha strike to dodge targets.

Dreamspitter1 votes

[{quoted}](name=ninjaIRL ,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hjaLdNhl,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-09-13T04:03:19.195+0000)

He's crap. He needs a buff to his sticking power. He also needs his special Melee ADC feature that lets him stay in fight, revive passive, buffed to be less predictable. Yasuo has windwall and general epic mobility to keep safe as a Melee ADC. Tryndamere has his ultimate to stay relevant in team fights. Master Yi has his Alpha strike to dodge targets.

He was IN FACT as a "Light Fighter" as the devs called him, originally intended to be a melee carry. He was the first light fighter, and the next too were Yasuo and Rework Fiora.

ninjaIRL 2 votes

I'd say Tryndamere is the first melee ADC/Light fighter in the game. He doesn't get free health, or armor or MR or any defenses like normal bruisers do, XinZhao, Vi, Wukong, Jarvan IV, Irelia. He gets a heal, sure but that doesn't particularly translate to defense. His ultimate is not a defense in a sense that it simply stops him from dying, it doesn't reduce incoming damage. His kit also heavily relies on damage to be relevant in teamfights. He brings no meaningful CC when it's a real teamfight (not a teamfight where half the enemy team are running away) so he's no tank, he's designed to build with crit so he's shoved to be a damage dealer in fights.

53436278DEL17 votes

lmfao as an aatrox main i can agree 100% not even a single aspect of outplay potential all that time i spent mastering him wasted when i could of become a god yasuo or thresh

idoki1 votes

I want to ask you something then: why bother "mastering" a champion that has no true potential? (mastering in quotation marks since his skill cap is lowly unrewarding).

53436278DEL12 votes

{quoted}

I want to ask you something then: why bother "mastering" a champion that has no true potential? (mastering in quotation marks since his skill cap is lowly unrewarding).

he is fun

Towboat4215 votes

Kassadin still has him beat in the lacking usefulness category but yeah i feel you, when i see an aatrox i never know what to expect he is jsut too unreliable at the moment to have an idea of what he is supposed to feel like.

OyddAWqJ5r3 votes

Kassadin still has some uses and I still have him as a flex pick and counterpick.

Try him against Katarina. There is still 0 counterplay for Kat there.

FrickendaChicken5 votes

I am an Aatrox main, and what I can say is, he works around Burst. And a lot of people seem to believe he works around Sustained dmg, and his kit simply doesn't allow that. Most people level up his W first, and work from there, when I've had nothing but MORE success with leveling it last (E, then Q), although his problems are there, without someone like Leona, he falls behind, He basically is greatly Benefited by having a fight buddy to work with him and keep his target cc'd. Also, most people don't build enough dmg on the guy. I would say, however, he needs a quality of life change where if you Auto then Q it keeps on the same target, so you don't end up killing yourself because you Blood Priced a minion, his passive is used mostly to survive teamfights, not fight through them, and help him either equal or win a 1v1/1v2. So all I have to say is, your combo is Q, E, Bork active, Ult, Blood Price hit, and then just try to survive off of lifesteal and health and your W. If your combo didn't kill someone, then you don't have either a team with you, or are behind. His Lore put his Gameplay beautifully. He Inspired the group he was helping. You have to do the same with your group, you work as a team, you can't just go off and do you own thing. __BASICALLY, You need a tank support with initiation, then you can do your initiation and you everything will be beautiful.

Jacknife1 votes

{quoted}

I am an Aatrox main, and what I can say is, he works around Burst. And a lot of people seem to believe he works around Sustained dmg, and his kit simply doesn't allow that. Most people level up his W first, and work from there, when I've had nothing but MORE success with leveling it last (E, then Q), although his problems are there, without someone like Leona, he falls behind, He basically is greatly Benefited by having a fight buddy to work with him and keep his target cc'd. Also, most people don't build enough dmg on the guy. I would say, however, he needs a quality of life change where if you Auto then Q it keeps on the same target, so you don't end up killing yourself because you Blood Priced a minion, his passive is used mostly to survive teamfights, not fight through them, and help him either equal or win a 1v1/1v2. So all I have to say is, your combo is Q, E, Bork active, Ult, Blood Price hit, and then just try to survive off of lifesteal and health and your W. If your combo didn't kill someone, then you don't have either a team with you, or are behind. His Lore put his Gameplay beautifully. He Inspired the group he was helping. You have to do the same with your group, you work as a team, you can't just go off and do you own thing. __BASICALLY, You need a tank support with initiation, then you can do your initiation and you everything will be beautiful.

So he's basically as mordekaiser is now, he needs another player with initiation and cc to cover his weaknesses, which are hugely exploitable without them. That's not bad design at all, kek.

Dreamspitter1 votes

{quoted}

So he's basically as mordekaiser is now, he needs another player with initiation and cc to cover his weaknesses, which are hugely exploitable without them. That's not bad design at all, kek.

So Teamwork required to be good = bad design?

Jacknife2 votes

{quoted}

So Teamwork required to be good = bad design?

Teamwork required to reach your max effectiveness = good design. Teamwork required to do your job at all = bad design.

ninjaIRL 2 votes

Nowhere in his kit does it explore the themes of inspiring allies in combat. Sivir does this better with her ultimate and she's meant to be a mercenary.

His kit doesn't completely reflect his character and that's one of the crappy parts about him.

Kögâ4 votes

The old AD sion fits aatrox's lore better than aatrox does.

Sohleks3 votes

Darius

... he does teamfight sustain better at this point. And a hella lot of burst damages.

Knalxz2 votes

IMO Aatrox is in the area of total balance. He's not OP and he's not underpowered. he can pretty much build anything and has a crazy ability to do whatever he wants in the game. Be a tank, full DPS, split pusher, support and if you're good with him then Melee ADC.

He's just not OP and most people who play him don't understand that he's not that. Playing Aatrox is like having a Sandslash if that explains it.

Lowvyr3 votes

{quoted}

IMO Aatrox is in the area of total balance. He's not OP and he's not underpowered. he can pretty much build anything and has a crazy ability to do whatever he wants in the game. Be a tank, full DPS, split pusher, support and if you're good with him then Melee ADC.

He's just not OP and most people who play him don't understand that he's not that. Playing Aatrox is like having a Sandslash if that explains it.

Full tank - Be useless in a fight, because you don't do enough damage to really make an impact and you have no abilities that a tank would want. Full DPS - Die instantly Splitpush - Honestly your best bet with him, but even then he is heavily outclassed by other champions such as Yi, Tryndamere, Nasus, etc. etc. Support - Just no Melee ADC - Again, die instantly and do nothing.

He has the base stats of a carry, the scalings of a carry, but the kit of a fighter and none of the tools to do either effectively.

I main Aatrox, but I got to say, this guy needs help. Really bad.

Borbland2 votes

Aatrox is the guy that either feeds alot or carries alone.

I saw a devourer + BotrK + Hydra + spirit visage with some tanking, he was a monster:

Tanky with lots of damage and so much sustain you cant imagine. He was going in 1 vs 4, using Hydra and his ult and doing tons of damage to anybody while getting his health back at an incredible speed.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

{quoted}

Aatrox is the guy that either feeds alot or carries alone.

I saw a devourer + BotrK + Hydra + spirit visage with some tanking, he was a monster:

Tanky with lots of damage and so much sustain you cant imagine. He was going in 1 vs 4, using Hydra and his ult and doing tons of damage to anybody while getting his health back at an incredible speed.

Devourer is broken, without it he is trash.

Myrddin3 votes

{quoted}

Devourer is broken, without it he is trash.

he's still trash with it

Shénzhì2 votes

I've made some good plays against some good players. It's fun to play Aatrox but he's so out of place! People make ideas to improve and so have I and we all really want to see him improved!

Thread: [Aatrox: Effects & Animations Update]

The game is out of date and needs heavily updating. Maybe they're working things or are not but it would be most appreciated if we knew their schedule of improving this game. Seems like they just want to add more chaos to chaos making their game unmanageable, which it is already, and that's fucking stupid. If we knew we'd be reassured at the least and would love to contribute.

One thing in particular is the inconsistencies that this game is built upon. Many do not realize and when you do you will see an absolute mess. This inconsistency, I believe is what dilutes the community and segregates 'pro players' from 'real players' creating an atmosphere of intolerance and doubt; an atmosphere of toxicity, and then they recently enforce this behavioral curfew.

#What are they not thinking? http://vignette1.wikia.nocookie.net/saintsrow/images/4/44/FailFish.png/revision/latest?cb=20130820134712

While all that is happening, an updated Aatrox may be another result of failure possibly just like new Ryze (I assume).

DirkTarTar2 votes

Aatrox has some huge glaring flaws, much of it having to do with how his kit doesn't really reflect his lore, and how his abilities are not very synergistic.

With that being said, a good player on Aatrox can do some pretty amazing things ESPECIALLY when the enemy team feels that he is a handicap champion. Aatrox is a niche pick for dive and knock-up comps and he deals a surprising amount of damage in the early part of the game. Despite his early damage, he falls off pretty hard, pretty fast due to polarized itemization requirements.

He honestly only needs a couple of small tweaks to get him into decent shape. One of the big tweaks is that he needs some form of hard CC on top of his R, commonly accepted as a .5 second AoE fear (which honestly just gives him the opportunity to Q + R + AA without getting instagibbed... providing his Q actually lands)

Another tweak is that his Q animation needs to be much smoother, mostly because it doesn't have that great of range, it doesn't have great knockup or damage, and it is extremely predictable and can be countered by SOOOOO many abilities. Just simply making the animation more fluid will give him a decent boost in power because he wouldn't have that stupid "I'M GOING TO JUMP NOW" wind up that you can see a mile off

As for a large adjustment that needs made, his R needs to have a "Massacre" feel that goes in with his Lore, about him leading troops into battle. Something that benefits the TEAM as a whole like added Attack Speed, Life Steal, or Movement Speed, or when he uses his E it explodes in a burst instead of a reverse cone, basically just anything creative that makes his ult advantageous to use in a team fight because right now it is really only used to drop towers (relatively fast with your wet noodle sword) or hit your enemies super fast with your wet noodle sword.

Speaking of the wet noodle sword... When Aatrox drops off it is noticed as him attacking super fast but appearing to do no damage which is called "The Wet Noodle" effect :)

Blade of Justic2 votes

In my honest opinion.

The question shouldn't be if Aatrox is useful in-game.

The question should be why you shouldn't just play Warwick.

Partholonian1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Blade of Justic,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hjaLdNhl,comment-id=0022,timestamp=2015-09-13T20:27:16.650+0000)

In my honest opinion.

The question shouldn't be if Aatrox is useful in-game.

The question should be why you shouldn't just play Warwick.

Because Warwick's gapcloser + hard CC is his ult and must target a unit, and Aatrox's is a regular spell that is also free targeted and can go over walls? Oh and Aatrox also has another CC, which is also on a non-ult CD.

There are plenty of other differences too, but Aatrox definitely has more CC.

FluxBound2 votes

Aatrox at the moment is all on snowballing. He either is fed or useless

Boulderox2 votes

the problem i always find with Aatrox is that he has to build raw damage, while having his q and e the only cc. I still think his q needs a change because 1/10 of you hp for an engage/disengage is crap. ESPECIALLY the fact that it can be inturrupted by knockup or stun, high risk, little reward. Flat health costs are better imho than % like his w states. Secondly, his passive is still lack luster in late game, it just comes up earlier but still you die thanks to your entire team sacrificing you for the good of the team. Thirdly, he has 2 AS steroids passive and ult... which is kinda meh, because this means he can't have damage because he naturally attacks fast and that would be broken.

Personally I love Aatrox as a champ, but he needs ways to SURVIVE fights with people with pure stuns, knockups, dashes slows that are prevalent in the top lane. but changing any little thing makes him too op or not enough to make him relevent. because as is he either builds raw damage and dies in seconds, or builds tanky and can't fight anyone because the lack of damage.

I say give him the Mordekaiser treatment and make him a hybrid ad bot laner, buff up his base ad, change his ratios and abilities to assist duo lanes (COUGH COUGH ULT INSPIRING like his lore ), and change his sustain.

I see him more as a vlad fighter. So off the bat, SCREW the AP scalings, he needs to be AD or AP, and he really seems to dig into the AD side because Aatrox suffers from this because his ult does respectable damage, but it is just meh damage wasted unless you throw ap on him which normally gets shifty eyes all around.

I propose making him with a passive that gives his blood well and ties it to an ability W. so with every hit (skill or AA) builds the bloodwell up, and likeTahmKench, out of combat it eats up the bloodwell for passive health regen. and w empowers the next AA and deals X damage on the next AA and only that one AA, and has 30% armor penetration for that Attack only. does not have a time limit you have to hit within x secs, but is a pure empowered hit guaranteed. Giving Aatrox a way to use his bloodwell 2 different ways, sustain while sacrificing csing or combat, or damage, giving up on the only sustain he would have now minus items. W no longer is what it was.

Q, change it so that upon cast you become invincible .5 sec after cast until landing, knocking up enemies in the center and slowing on the outer edge. making it Actually reliable as an escape or engage, and if not too much to ask, make it reset on kill. because he has 0 mobilty other than it KhazixTristana has it, why not a top laner for once.

E, i think is fairly good in all respects and doesn't need too much change, its a farm tool i always find, and poke for a melee champ.

Ult HOOOO boy does it work decently at times, but in others it's just meh, instantaneous damage upon cast (AP), change to a lower ad value, Range increase fine, AS buff fine, but i would like to see if they can buff it to give him the ability to buff an ally too, jungler/support(if that were to work) through giving allies and only allies some aura that can increase either defenses, or crit chance, or something that ties into his lore inspiring people to fight on against all odds, becoming more than they normally are. Even buffing minions would be an awesome help. buffing minions isn't something that has been done really.

But Aatrox I find always seems gimped in every matchup because he is an all in champ that hurts himself to do damage, and has no survivabilty in large cc comps that are everywhere right now that easily shut him down.

Aych Pii2 votes

Whenever the enemy team picks him he drain-tanks, never dies and hard carries 1v5. But otherwise yes you're right.

DorsalChicken1 votes

funny enough, even though I'm not amazing with aatrox I almost always win with him. seems that most of the time no matter how badly I do with him in lane I can always end the game by backdooring. I can't count the number times I have said "Screw this I'm killin their nexus now" and just done it.

53436278DEL12 votes

{quoted}

funny enough, even though I'm not amazing with aatrox I almost always win with him. seems that most of the time no matter how badly I do with him in lane I can always end the game by backdooring. I can't count the number times I have said "Screw this I'm killin their nexus now" and just done it.

why don't you play him more often then

DorsalChicken2 votes

Because 90% of the time when I top I tank so that our team has something tankier then leona to fight with.

More from Gameplay

More by iainB85