Timing your Thornmail purchase correctly, not just "who should I get it against"

darkdill·Jun 12, 2017·3 votes·290 views

Thornmail is more than just getting it against physical-heavy teams or as Rammus; I always run into a conundrum when wanting to get it. If you get it early, you have no HP to back it up, so any magic damage and abilities are going to wreck you. But if you get Thornmail late, your opponents are likely already going to have enough lifesteal and/or MR to make its effect borderline worthless.

This is where the Thornmail trap reputation comes from. There seems to be no optimal time to get it without screwing yourself in some way.

So which timing is going to bite you in the ass LESS?

9 Comments

JhomasTeffersonJun 12, 20173 votes

Thornmail damage should inflict grievous wounds.

SomeStarsJun 14, 20172 votes

if league taught me anything its to get thornmail on ashe [slayer-jinx-wink]

ZielmannJun 12, 20171 votes

It took me far too long looking at your name to realize it wasn't "yasuosmart"

Junglerz FaultJun 12, 20171 votes

No timing will bite you in the ass less. What i'm saying is that there is no difference when you purchase it. Rammus is so weak now, he needs his team to carry him early game. Unfortunately for Rammus, we are in the quick fast games meta. It's a sad day and age for the little fella.

darkdillJun 13, 20171 votes

And in terms of Thornmail itself, purchasing it at any point is garbage, right?

Junglerz FaultJun 13, 20171 votes

Not necessarily. Since rammus is so weak now, I just pray the enemy has an auto attacker that I can abuse. Then I rush thornmail and focus camp said auto attack champion.

darkdillJun 13, 20171 votes

It's the same problem Vladimir had with WotA: the item's very existence warps his balance. WotA was removed because Vlad was the only good user of it, and he got an acceptable rebalance afterwards. I think the same could be done for Rammus: remove Thornmail and Rammus will be allowed a better power budget without the item warping his balance.

Junglerz FaultJun 14, 20171 votes

Or they could just revert his "rework" (nerfs) and we could just call it a day.

DeathBurstJun 14, 20171 votes

Thornmail isn't a trap.

According to league of graphs, in Diamond+, this is Thornmail pickrate on various champs:

Mundo -> 30%, 3rd-4th item.
Gallio -> 8%, last item.
Garen -> 14%, 5th-6th item.
Darius -> 6%, 5th-6th item.
Malphite -> 14%, 4th-5th item.
Maokai (top) -> 7%, last item.

A ton of Bruisers also have it around 3-4% as last item: Irelia, Illaoi, Hecarim, ... It shows up even for AP semi-Tanks like Gragas and Cho, as a niche situational item.

So, you ask for the timing for Thornmail? Late game, which is why you don't see it often. But it's definitely a situational item that has its place in most Tanks/Juggs build for the very late game, and it's a niche reactionary pick for basically all melee champs in a fraction of games. Not a trap, just a narrow purpose item.