New Shyvana is amazing and strong

Mira Arya Enthe·Nov 23, 2016·10 votes·1,888 views

As a 178k mastery point Shyvana one trick. Thought I would post this to dispell the whiners. The rework was not a nerf. It was a trade-off. And a worthwhile trade-off as well. The nerfs to her kit were to justify making her more reliable and versatile. And to add more team fighting power in. It is great.

Btw that 178k mastery points is in 4 months. I was on break from the introduction of mastery until 4 months ago. My win rate with Shyvana is 62% Season 6, 9/12 in 3v3s and 68% normals.

I consider the rework a complete success. Only further changes should be visual and the tick rate of her W and E being made more rapid like Singed.

63 Comments

LuxychanNov 24, 20164 votes

I keep seeing people say "nerfs" yet the only thing I've seen on this rework that could be considered a nerf was the change to her human form E.

Shyvana is not a tank nor is she designed like one. She is an objective control/lane diver. The change to her passive has made her stronger for dragon control, the change to her ult allows her to engage no problem and makes her build even stronger when it comes to items like Titanic Hydra.

The only thing left that I personally would like to see it her Q being reverted to pre bloodrazor status. Then she is set imo.

Otherwise, I'm happy with the changes. [slayer-jinx-wink]

Mira Arya EntheNov 24, 20163 votes

OuO

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20162 votes

{quoted}

I keep seeing people say "nerfs" yet the only thing I've seen on this rework that could be considered a nerf was the change to her human form E.

Shyvana is not a tank nor is she designed like one. She is an objective control/lane diver. The change to her passive has made her stronger for dragon control, the change to her ult allows her to engage no problem and makes her build even stronger when it comes to items like Titanic Hydra.

The only thing left that I personally would like to see it her Q being reverted to pre bloodrazor status. Then she is set imo.

Otherwise, I'm happy with the changes. [slayer-jinx-wink]

a much weaker passive (you need 3 dragons to match her old human form passive and 7 dragons to match her old dragon form passive... good luck getting 7 dragons)

no flame trail in the dragon form

being bigger she catches more skill shots in the dragon form now

LuxychanNov 24, 20163 votes

The problem with that thought is her passive isn't all about the armor/mr, the % increase against the dragon.. whether it be elemental or elder.. is more of a benefit to your team than the small increase to armor and mr.

As for no flame trail, I'll take the exploding ball and tick damage over it. Watching it being used in game shows me it's a better trade off imo. Shyvana is an engage and chaser, not running away and dealing damage.

JbelsNov 23, 20163 votes

I love that her ult can't be interrupted anymore. I would hate investing my entire engage ability cooldown only to be swatted out of the air like a fly by the smallest CC

DryditchNov 23, 20162 votes

cough Zac cough

RogueWillNov 23, 20162 votes

Zac slingshot is not his entire engage thou. You still have lets bounce and stretching strike. Granted are less reliable that slingshot but still are decent engages

TyrekGoldenspearNov 23, 20163 votes

I was waiting for your comment on the rework before I passed judgement, glad you liked it.

[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

Mira Arya EntheNov 23, 20162 votes

Every Shyvana main I know loves it. It was a beautiful rework.

TyrekGoldenspearNov 23, 20162 votes

Nice. Does the ideal build change? Or are you still confident with the bloodrazer and then tanky damage items?

I haven't gotten to try her out but what's your favorite part of the rework?

Mira Arya EntheNov 24, 20163 votes

Shyvana's ideal build is always debatable because she is so versatile. I rush Titan every game. I find the power spike from it incredible.

Favorite thing is no longer getting stopped by everything when ulting. I've already felt the effects of this a dozen times in 6 games. Her new dragon E is pretty close however. It feels amazing. It works well. It's stronger tyan expected.

Downsides for me. I loved her W trail. Lost a kill last night forgetting it was gone. They didn't fix her W tick rate.

Overall a success imo.

TyrekGoldenspearNov 24, 20162 votes

Well I'm glad you like it.

When I try her out I'll probably like her as well.

On another note since she taught me how to AA reset almost flawlessly I feel confident enough to try to pick up J4 again.

BakedLotionNov 24, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mira Arya Enthe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hNFxdq9b,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-24T00:03:44.101+0000)

Shyvana's ideal build is always debatable because she is so versatile. I rush Titan every game. I find the power spike from it incredible.

Favorite thing is no longer getting stopped by everything when ulting. I've already felt the effects of this a dozen times in 6 games. Her new dragon E is pretty close however. It feels amazing. It works well. It's stronger tyan expected.

Downsides for me. I loved her W trail. Lost a kill last night forgetting it was gone. They didn't fix her W tick rate.

Overall a success imo.

I like triforce+bork+bloodrazor+deadmans+boots+maw/titanic/frozen mallet instakill anyone, can solo baron and herald.

james121234Nov 23, 20162 votes

I mean just cuz you play something alot doesn't actually mean you know what you are doing.. a bronze 5 can have a billion mastery points and say that urgot is good now lol. But I do agree she is a little better yeah not op but shes pretty ight. Also you might want to say your rank when you give stats like "62% win rate" I could have a 100% win rate with shyvanna if I played in bronze to gold xP

ADepressedLeonaNov 24, 20162 votes

http://i.imgur.com/cSvrrBL.jpg This was my last game with Shyv

Build was Bloodrazor, Titanic, Thornmail, Frozen Mallet, Tabis and Visage.

I got pretty fed (13-7-17) But I was nearly full tank and did not at all expect to get top damage, let alone deal almost 10k more damage than the enemy Jinx. Honestly I think a lot of that damage comes from her new dragon form E, if you land that in a team fight and keep people on top of it that thing ends up doing a huge amount of damage

EDIT: Sorry that the image is tiny, idk how to blow it up without clicking on it lol

RisenDarkKnightNov 24, 20162 votes

Seemed weaker to me, though I haven't gotten to play many games of the new one yet.

The E not passing through enemies in human form seemed harsh in particular, and the extra squishiness when you haven't killed dragons hurts until you get a few items.

The changes to ult probably make the rework a buff, but TBH very few people at my elo every actually interrupted my ult anyway. (I'm only gold IV).

ZelorxonNov 24, 20162 votes

Yeah, hilarious how the "shyvana main" has supposedly direct contacts with meddler, plays in silver (inb4 hurr durr you're silverino too lmao xd), takes exh on shyvana and most of the other posters in this thread play together with said person, totally not an awful bunch of shills, a coincidence, despite shyvana being cucked into the ground and this can be perceived by anyone that has eyes to see. What wouldn't you do for your cheap dollar at the end of the day, uh riot.

Also undertale is utter shit.

-edit- Also explain me this: -Shyvana is considered a sub-par pick that isn't suitable for carry especially in high elo where people actually punish mistakes -Some dedicated mains (actual mains) find a way to make her work adapting her to their personal playstyle -Still something other players are not used to and thus the pick isn't considered viable -Gets nerfed, like, HARD nerfed -Now she's good. ~~(no she isn't, and people will see this eventually)~~

Raiku KawisaNov 24, 20164 votes

{quoted}

Yeah, hilarious how the "shyvana main" has supposedly direct contacts with meddler, plays in silver (inb4 hurr durr you're silverino too lmao xd), takes exh on shyvana and most of the other posters in this thread play together with said person, totally not an awful bunch of shills, a coincidence, despite shyvana being cucked into the ground and this can be perceived by anyone that has eyes to see. What wouldn't you do for your cheap dollar at the end of the day, uh riot.

Also undertale is utter shit.

-edit- Also explain me this: -Shyvana is considered a sub-par pick that isn't suitable for carry especially in high elo where people actually punish mistakes -Some dedicated mains (actual mains) find a way to make her work adapting her to their personal playstyle -Still something other players are not used to and thus the pick isn't considered viable -Gets nerfed, like, HARD nerfed -Now she's good. ~~(no she isn't, and people will see this eventually)~~

On a post talking about the first Preseason patch (6.22) Mira was saying there were no Shyvana changes. Meddler replied to that comment saying that patch 6.23 or 6.24 there would be Shyvana changes (happened to be 6.23).

Why the hell does Rank shaming still exist? Yes, she is not a Diamond/Master/Challenger player, but she does have a large amount of experience on Shyvana which is far more relevant than her rank.

Taking Exhaust on Shyvana is a very good spell. Shyvana has no reliable CC and Exhaust gives her a powerful slow to allow her ganks to have impact. Not going to say its the end-all be-all spell for Shyvana, but certainly not something to use to belittle Mira about.

Yes I do play with Mira, happens when people enjoy playing the same champion.

Shyvana has not been strong, not since the days of Sated Devourer. But she was not ~~nerfed~~ 'cucked' into the ground. Her passive was nerfed massively yet it still has a way to scale. Unreliable, but still there. In exchange, her ult now being unstoppable was a much needed buff. The rest of the changes are quality of life shift that personally i find to be an improvement.

You are correct, Shyvana is not going to be able to carry in most high-tier games. These changes were not designed to make her the next LCS pick-or-ban. They were designed to make her simply better to play.

What do i need to explain on the person build? Yes? Shyvana is very adaptable in her build paths. I like an aggressive damage focused diver. Mira plays a heavy tank juggernaut Shyvana. Both of us have success.

Yes, Shyvana is not going to be a champion that you can pick up and instantly carry a game. You are not going to win throwing yourself at gank after gank, you need to learn how to take advantage of other facets to win.

I disagree. Overall I think 6.23 was a slight buff. The changes don't really change anything. Shyvana is less tanky, but her main source of mobility is now reliable.

Shyvana is not 'good' she is not a meta pick unless something like Cinderhulk or Sated Devour come out again, but at the same time she is a very strong duelist. She is very strong in the hands of someone who knows how to use her.

TyrekGoldenspearNov 24, 20163 votes

You sir deserve a cookie for replying civilly and with linked facts.

Raiku KawisaNov 24, 20162 votes

{quoted}

You sir deserve a cookie for replying civilly and with linked facts.

Yay! Cookie! noms cookie

Mira Arya EntheNov 24, 20162 votes

Uhm dude... Valkrin(challenger 1) LOD(Master) and SpikeThePike(wrote her most extensive and regularly updated guide) all siggest exhaust unless you are high rank on her. Even then they all use it sometimes.

Never said I had a direct line to Meddler? He talks on the boards and reddit. I talked to him. He replied.

Silver 2 is above average. Which is fine by me. Rank calling is what LS(Korean pro coach and shout caster) compares to a turd with corn in it mocking a normal turd for not having the specks of corn.

Shyvana has a great win rate with dedicated players and high tier junglers. Her average win rate is low because people pick her up assuming she is easy because mechanically she is. But she has one of the higher learning curves in League. So they lose and say she is weak.

These changes were good. She MAY need more changes. Give it a few patches.

ProfirixNov 25, 20161 votes

Valk was saying the other day he didn't think she was viable in anything other than the lowest elo.

WoonStruckNov 24, 20162 votes

How do you feel about E constantly marking people in its AoE now?

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20162 votes

imo they literally ruined her with this update and made a meme gimmicky champion because some guy on riot has a mediocre sense of humor and thinks it's funny to put an interaction with dragons on her passive

generally, if you love some champion, you better hope it will never be updated or remade

Raiku KawisaNov 24, 20162 votes

[{quoted}](name=bad arcade kitty,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hNFxdq9b,comment-id=000f,timestamp=2016-11-24T02:52:15.637+0000)

imo they literally ruined her with this update and made a meme gimmicky champion because some guy on riot has a mediocre sense of humor and thinks it's funny to put an interaction with dragons on her passive

generally, if you love some champion, you better hope it will never be updated or remade

Her old passive wasn't much to begin with. Yes, it was better than the current one, but they felt the need to cut power on her kit somewhere. If that is the only reason you think she got ruined then you need to take another look at the champ.

Just Blame JennyNov 24, 20162 votes

I feel her passive may be slightly, and I do mean slightly undertuned, but I played Shyvana on occasion before the rework, and have been playing her a fair amount post rework. She feels like she's in a decent spot to me now. One thing that I feel is being overlooked here is that BotRK was just buffed and it is an excellent item on her.

As for mastery, which seems to be a point of contention, I've been running stormraider's surge on her. Stop thinking of her as a tank. She's not a tank. She's more of a bruiser. Stormraider's is great for helping her stick to targets.

bad arcade kittyNov 23, 20161 votes

being bigger hurts her tankiness even more, because she eats everything

Mira Arya EntheNov 23, 20163 votes

Her tankiness late game was actually too strong prior to the rework according to Riot.

bad arcade kittyNov 23, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mira Arya Enthe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hNFxdq9b,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2016-11-23T23:54:39.803+0000)

Her tankiness late game was actually too strong prior to the rework according to Riot.

that's why her winrate was around 48% the last patch i guess

they also didn't bother to fix her main problem that she has no mastery to go with any more, she can't take coc like other tanks even with the new uninterruptible ult, so what do they want her to be played with? thunderlords?

Mira Arya EntheNov 24, 20165 votes

Since you think she is a tank. I cannot discuss this topic further. When you can tell me what solid lockdown and massive tanking steroids she has, I will care about CoC. Meanwhile like all other people in her catagory(which is Juggernaut bordering on Diver), I will be tanking tough DPS masteries. Valkrin uses Thunder, I use Undying, SpikeThePike uses Stormraiders, Raiku uses Stormraiders. Before the change to AD Shy used Fervor.

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mira Arya Enthe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hNFxdq9b,comment-id=0006000000000000,timestamp=2016-11-24T00:22:27.053+0000)

Since you think she is a tank. I cannot discuss this topic further. When you can tell me what solid lockdown and massive tanking steroids she has, I will care about CoC. Meanwhile like all other people in her catagory(which is Juggernaut bordering on Diver), I will be tanking tough DPS masteries. Valkrin uses Thunder, I use Undying, SpikeThePike uses Stormraiders, Raiku uses Stormraiders. Before the change to AD Shy used Fervor.

that "juggernaut", "diver" etc crap which they change nearly every month isn't even funny

she is among those champions who are supposed to take massive damage and any nerf to that part of her kit hurts her a lot

LuxychanNov 24, 20165 votes

She has no natural shield in her kit, has no CC outside of her ultimate, no way to control of hinder the enemy team beyond "Look at me I'm a dragon!".. so please, tell me how she can be catagorized the same as say Nautilus Thresh Leona Taric or even Chogath DrMundo Galio Maokai

TyrekGoldenspearNov 24, 20166 votes

They changed it once recently, like six months ago here. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3A5uuBw7-champion-subclass-list

Kindly refrain from exaggerating.

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20161 votes

{quoted}

They changed it once recently, like six months ago here. http://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/3A5uuBw7-champion-subclass-list

Kindly refrain from exaggerating.

and changed it before that too

i refuse to remember all their crap which they invent again and again, some "controllers", "vanguards" etc

LuxychanNov 24, 20165 votes

Just going to point out that at the very top, it says Tanks. Even if there are subclasses, Shyvana isn't listed under Tanks.

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Just going to point out that at the very top, it says Tanks. Even if there are subclasses, Shyvana isn't listed under Tanks.

i have already said i give a jack shit of their champion designations

think this way, you have a team of ashe soraka lux and teemo, you are the jungler and have to choose to pick either kindred or shyvana, whom will you pick and why?

G4LLOWSC4L1BR4TRNov 24, 20164 votes

Amumu, Zac, or Nautilus? Shyvana's tankier than Kindred, but she's not a tank. To use old terminology, she's a bruiser. She hurts, she's hard ish to kill, and she has no crowd control, thus making her a bruiser, fighter, diver, juggernaut, or whatever you want to call her, but not a tank.

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20161 votes

{quoted}

Amumu, Zac, or Nautilus? Shyvana's tankier than Kindred, but she's not a tank. To use old terminology, she's a bruiser. She hurts, she's hard ish to kill, and she has no crowd control, thus making her a bruiser, fighter, diver, juggernaut, or whatever you want to call her, but not a tank.

suppose you don't play those. btw to say that shyv is tankier than kindred is a p. large underestimation, she is drastically tankier than kindred... with her old passive ofc

anyway, i guess you see how riot hurting her tankiness indirectly (coc which she can't use reliably makes her worse than the tanky junglers that can, that's why she is a trash tier jungler currently) and directly (with the new much weaker passive and also the size increase) hurts her intended role as a damage soak and a frontline champion

G4LLOWSC4L1BR4TRNov 24, 20164 votes

If your only junglers are Kindred and Shyvana, that's on you. She's supposed to be durable, yes, but she's not supposed to be as durable as Nautilus or Zac. If she was, she'd be insanely overpowered. Do I think the nerfs to her resistance were a bit much? Perhaps, but a number of mains seem to disagree, and because I only play her recreationally (I'm not even a jungler really, I support 95% of the time) I'm inclined to believe them.

bad arcade kittyNov 24, 20161 votes

{quoted}

If your only junglers are Kindred and Shyvana, that's on you. She's supposed to be durable, yes, but she's not supposed to be as durable as Nautilus or Zac. If she was, she'd be insanely overpowered. Do I think the nerfs to her resistance were a bit much? Perhaps, but a number of mains seem to disagree, and because I only play her recreationally (I'm not even a jungler really, I support 95% of the time) I'm inclined to believe them.

if we begin to choose among tanky junglers, shyvana has no chance to be on the team at all

in what situation is she better to pick than say hecarim?

G4LLOWSC4L1BR4TRNov 24, 20163 votes

I dunno much about how Hecarim plays, I'm a support main as I said. She's good if you've got someone else that's an engage tank on your team and need someone with potential to splitpush, because she's got some godly dueling potential.

LuxychanNov 24, 20166 votes

Surprise surprise, Shyvana isn't listed as a tank. Thank you good person for the information! If I had cookies I'd give them to you!! [slayer-pantheon-thumbs]

TyrekGoldenspearNov 24, 20163 votes

I'll be happy with internet cookies. ^^

RalanrNov 24, 20162 votes

https://www.askideas.com/media/41/Funny-Cookie-Meme-Give-That-Man-A-Cookie-Picture.jpg

ZelorxonNov 24, 20161 votes

Yeah, that's exactly the reason why they should fire at once the whole balancing team. But i guess popularity=money > gameplay.

Lord DesertNov 24, 20161 votes

Can you quickly test something for me? i dont have shyv and im not sure if she gets passiv stacks for killing elder drake. Could you check that for me? The Patchnotes didnt make it clear for me. Thx in advise

Mira Arya EntheNov 24, 20161 votes

Will in 4 hours. On lunch. XP

Lord DesertNov 24, 20161 votes

enjoy your meal, and see you in 4 hours, but i dont think that i will be still awake,cause in 4 hours its at 5 am for me xD

G4LLOWSC4L1BR4TRNov 24, 20163 votes

I believe a rioter confirmed that she gets stacks from elder.

Lord DesertNov 25, 20161 votes

thx for the info!