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Question: Why was chalice nerfed?

DisasterSola·6/10/2015, 8:45:14 AM·4 votes·769 views

With the regen changes, why was the chalice nerfed at all in its mana regen?

Unique passive: Increases your mana regeneration by 1% per 1% mana missing. UNIQUE - Mana Font: Restores 2% of missing mana every 5 seconds.

the chalice feels like a useless item now, because it no longer sustains mana so well. This is especially apparant vs resourceless champions like zed and yasuop. I mean... tear is a better regen item at this point than a chalice item. and so is morello's book of nerfs. Its probably because the current mana font doesnt actually GIVE you mana regeneration. It gives you 2% of your missing mana every 5 seconds, just like the %health recovery mastery. making its mana regeneration worthless.

Can we buff the chalice items?

Like... Chalice: Unique passive: Increases your mana regeneration by 1% per 3% mana missing. Crucible: Unique passive: Increases your mana regeneration by 1% per 1% mana missing. Grail: UNIQUE - Mana Font: Increases your mana regeneration by 2% of missing mana.

15 Comments

Pew Pew Lasers6/10/2015, 9:15:02 AM3 votes

"Mana Font" rewards you for having mana. Missing 1000 mana essentially gives you +100% mana regen for most champs at 18 who give or take have around 20 mana regen per 5 seconds at level 18. Most champs have around 1000 mana @18 so you might as well say Grail and Crucible are giving you +200% mana regen.

If you look at mage champs they usually have 1400-1600 @18 without mana items so you might as well say +250% mana regen. Having something like item 3040 or item 3027 essentially would cause your regen to explode.

What youre suggesting is a nerf for any champ with less than 1k mana @18. Fortunately none of those champs use mana regen items. For a champ like Bard you're kicking him in the crotch with his pitiful 13 per 5 while having 1200 mana @ 18... 26/5 or 37/5, I think I'll stay with the current Mana Font kthxbai

Knight SoIaire 6/10/2015, 9:07:01 AM2 votes

the reason was to simply make chalice less able to sustain the playstyle of "i get chalice and i dont need to worry about mana"

it was all to preserwe the core identity of mana being a resource that gates the amount of skills you cast which chalice broke and made mages basicaly resourcless

ItsStout6/10/2015, 1:48:21 PM2 votes

Remember when Ziggs could cast Q on CD?

Yeah.

JustMyBassCannon6/10/2015, 8:48:45 PM2 votes

There is a total of 6 champions with >20 MP5 at level 18. Of those 6, Ryze is the only one remotely interested in Chalice.

There is a total of 45 champions with less than 1000 mana at level 18. Of those 45, there are maybe a dozen champions who can use Chalice, or might want Mikael's Crucible for the ally support; none of them are the mages that normally use(d) Chalice/Grail.

So, outside of less than 20 relevant champions, the average level 18 champion has >1000 mana and <20 MP5.

The current Mana Font passive grants 2% of missing mana in MP5. For every 250 mana missing, you gain 5 MP5, or 1 mana per second. Missing 1000 mana means 20 MP5--as much as the average level 18 MP5.

Verdict: This change was meant to nerf the early-game regen effectiveness of Chalice of Harmony. It's still just as effective a mana regen booster, but it has a weaker early-game because it's based on your missing mana, rather than your mana regen statistic.

CrazedPorcupine6/10/2015, 11:43:24 PM1 votes

Grail got hella buffed with it's last set of buffs. it now gives 100% base mana regen, AND the mana font passive, AND it gives WAY more mana restore on kill/assist now. Overall, Grail is HUGE.

I take Grail on Veigar because it means that by level 9, Grail+Passive+ base mana regen means that Veigar never goes below 50% mana.

Linna Excel6/10/2015, 11:43:36 PM1 votes

Riot seems like they tried to nerf mana regen across the board. At this point, I'm actually not that fond of chalice until you get a tear or RoA largely because the passive on it is so weak. When your maxed non-ult spells cost 90-130 per cast an extra 2 mana every 5 seconds for what you are missing is pointless. Also +100% regen when you don't have a great regen to begin with isn't helpful, like in the early game.

To me the biggest issue with mana ATM is ADCs get to do a lot of damage for free and use their AAs to take towers. Also don't get me started about ADCs invading mid and stealing your CS.