new game mode idea: Itemless

Speeedy·May 7, 2018·65 votes·16,292 views

so instead of buying items in the shop, you buy raw stats that add to your base stats with no max. Like the shop is broken down into categories

***Please note all numbers are just for show and should be balanced against the current gold value in the game, sorry I don't know them AP damage - 15 AP for 400 gold; 30 AP for 750 gold AD damage - 15 AD for 500 gold; 30 AD for 950 gold Movement speed (no cap here would be fun) HP Mana Regen HP Regen Crit % AS etc.

possibly would also take the standard map with X3 passive gold generation and make all minions/jg x3 gold value to speed up the game

Thoughts?

41 Comments

SwiftKitten88May 7, 201824 votes

DrMundo ... do i even need to say anything else..

ZT XperimentorMay 7, 201811 votes

Neat idea, but I'd bet it'd fall into the same pitfall urf does; normally viable champions become unusable (which I don't mind), but niche picks become significantly more abusive because of their naturally stronger kits.

FilDaFunkMay 7, 20184 votes

May well be easier to counter them - more control over each stat while there are no item passives to abuse.

ZT XperimentorMay 8, 20181 votes

Granted, but riot has been, willfully ignorant of anything not ranked in recent years; just look at how long it takes to address aram problems.

FilDaFunkMay 8, 20183 votes

Huh? They address ARAM problems? (I play ARAM a lot, btw)

ZT XperimentorMay 10, 20181 votes

Something like once or twice a year sadly, lol. Aram has been my go to till the mid season patch hits, which doesn't look promising anymore.

FilDaFunkMay 10, 20181 votes

Sorry, but can you give an example? The only one I can think of is Dark Harvest (since it was ridiculously powerful). But it's still by far the best choice, so they really should do more.

ZT XperimentorMay 10, 20181 votes

And example of what? The lack of patches affecting aram, or my disappointment of midseason patches?

Meeks011May 8, 20181 votes

[{quoted}](name=ZT Xperimentor,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=h8Alc9QB,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-05-07T17:11:23.362+0000)

Neat idea, but I'd bet it'd fall into the same pitfall urf does; normally viable champions become unusable (which I don't mind), but niche picks become significantly more abusive because of their naturally stronger kits.

Who gives a shit, these gamemodes are for fun.

ZT XperimentorMay 10, 20181 votes

You say that but remember sona and masteryi in urf? That's what I'm drawing attention to for this idea, to take care of problematic picks who generally rely on being counter built.

UnboundHadesMay 7, 201810 votes

holy shit stop saying ad damage ad= attack damage when you say ad damage you are saying attack damage damage also its magic and physical damage ap and ad are the stats so ap damage doesnt make sense either

Yets4240May 8, 20182 votes

Seriously, and there are so many examples of spells that scale with AD but do magic damage, or scale off AP but do physical. And what about AD/AP -> true damage abilities, or those that scale off both? It doesn't make any sense to even say AD = physical damage and AP = magical damage

The Darius KingMay 8, 20182 votes

{quoted}

holy shit stop saying ad damage ad= attack damage when you say ad damage you are saying attack damage damage also its magic and physical damage ap and ad are the stats so ap damage doesnt make sense either

Its honestly not that big of a deal. you can get what he's getting across so this is just nitpicking

Hiraeth OblivionMay 7, 20186 votes

I think Draven likes this idea

SammanmanMay 7, 20184 votes

Or like a 1 lane game where you cant buy anything, thatd honestly be fun

MicbranMay 8, 20183 votes

sounds like shit it would just be “statcheck eachother to death”

nuclearwarpotatoMay 8, 20181 votes

"HA! The only difference in our builds is the I have 15 more ad. Therefore I now outplay you. get destroyed"

Total EclipseMay 7, 20182 votes

Hellllllllllll Yes I would play the hell out of that

Dead flag bluesMay 7, 20182 votes

Quinn MOVE SPEED MOVE SPEED MOVE SPEED

Awesome idea, too bad Rito doesn't give a shit and rather buff adc and makes more skins for Lux and MF

Ariel the CruelMay 7, 20181 votes

Mid-season update:

Crit chance is no longer part of any item. Crit chance is instead replaced by raw AD and/or AS. Crit chance is now an itemless stat that can be increased at a cost of 100+(<Crit chance>*10) per point.

Skeletons GraveMay 7, 20182 votes

Id prefer a game mode that doesnt respawn you if you die 5 times.

Dasdi96May 8, 20183 votes

[{quoted}](name=Skeletons Grave,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=h8Alc9QB,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2018-05-07T23:35:57.011+0000)

Id prefer a game mode that doesnt respawn you if you die 5 times.

A hardcore mode will be interesting. A team wins if they can get each enemy to die 5 times.

shoe6535May 7, 20182 votes

so just normal lol but with no passives

SociopathFriendMay 8, 20182 votes

No grievous wounds then.

ChaosThiefMay 8, 20182 votes

I honestly would play this mode to death just because of how different it would feel. To be honest though, I would also like it if you could buy the item actives/passives separately (like for instance, if you had let's say, 800 gold, you could buy the omnivamp from gunblade.)

Though I would likely go for no items by itself, since allowing passives/actives to be bought would just lead to "who abuses x active/passive the most?" since you could just rush them.

FilDaFunkMay 7, 20181 votes

We could use the standard items for stat values: item 1052 item 3113 item 1001 item 1029 etc Could see some fun specialisation. Some good examples: Hecarim Ryze Kaisa Malphite (Armour) Galio (MR) MissFortune Taric

SpeeedyMay 7, 20181 votes

good point i like it

flibitydooMay 7, 20181 votes

champs without aoe become awful because they lack waveclear. Shen for example needs bami's cinder/sunfire cape to make up for the fact that he can only auto one thing at a time.

supports become awful because they have no gold income and will get outpaced by everyone else (since everyone else will earn gold faster because supports only have passive gold generation while everyone else has passive gold generation in addition to all the extra farm)

no grievous wounds itemization whoopee sounds fun losing to healing

no % armour pen no % health access whoopee sounds fun losing to armour/health stacking

no wards sounds fun losing to gankmania

no zhonyas sounds fun losing to zed

no tenacity/QSS sounds fun losing to cc chains

notice me Sin piMay 7, 20181 votes

it would take a few days for everyone to figure out what's optimal, so it would be fine for the first few days if this were to come true. Game modes are not meant to be balanced after all.

CytheGuyMay 7, 20186 votes

Champs without aoe are then more inclined to fight, making the game go faster.

Supports would be inclined to fight more, possibly with the people without waveclear, to get gold from assists and the occasional kill.

Supports don't get heal boosts so their heals are weaker

Could probably add armor pen/lethality as a buyable stat, %hp damage is getting removed anyways so not a big deal

You could just keep trinkets, they don't add stats anyways

A big part of Zed's burst comes from duskblade, which he wouldn't have access to, and you can now buy armor freely

Buyable tenacity/innate global passive

flibitydooMay 7, 20181 votes

To begin with, 3 of your points are "well, I changed the rules to fix it", so y'know, thanks for ruining the spirit of the new game mode OP was trying to encourage.

your first point about AOE champs I do not understand whatsoever. You think that they'll just piss off the minion wave and all-in? that's not how the game works. You clear the minion waves, and use your minion advantage to win fights. Waveclear is everything and has been for the past 3 season (if not more). If you're playing a champ that can't control a wave then you've lost. Which is the issue here.

Supports are literally some of the least likely to force kills/assists more than any other champion. You can't force a champ to die on a support champion; that's dependent on how much your opponent is willing commit. And regardless, the point was that you aren't going to get any gold income whatsoever beyond the increased passive gold generation that every other champ also has access to in addition to faster farming.

The point about healing was losing to shit like mundo or swain or vladimir (or literally any champ that's cool with lifesteal). No idea how you detract that as "healer supports would be busted". Hell the most upvoted comment on this thread is "mundo..do I need to say anything else".

CytheGuyMay 8, 20184 votes

I don't believe those points were too unreasonable. 2/3 are stats. And the wards... I really don't see the problem. It has zero stat bonuses. If anything, you're the one trying to ruin the game mode by being Mr. The-Glass-Is-Half-Empty.

Ever heard of ganking? Roaming? Sure, the minion wave is gonna push tower and will be a problem, but that's why you wait until the enemy laner is gone. On another note, if you're playing a champ that doesn't have good wave clear, chances are you have good poke or all-in potential. You've suggested that there is a champion who literally just sucks ass and can't do anything.

Coordinated efforts, or people will just not pick supports. Probably something I should have mentioned earlier, but it's true. People might just not pick a support. And again, Ganks? Roaming? There are some support champions/players who like to roam to secure some early kills. In case you didn't know, assists and kills reward gold. I.e. they are a source of income.

That last point, for the champions you mentioned I legitimately have nothing on it. The support thing was because the majority of people who can heal are supports. What I will say however, is that most game modes have a banning phase, and if this game mode would come to fruition these champions would be 100% ban.

Z3SleeperMay 8, 20181 votes

{quoted}

To begin with, 3 of your points are "well, I changed the rules to fix it", so y'know, thanks for ruining the spirit of the new game mode OP was trying to encourage.

OP did say "etc." afterall.

FilDaFunkMay 7, 20183 votes

What makes you think supports will play as support? No utility items, so they'd go for tank or ap.

Can have blanket healing reduction (not affecting passive healing)

% pen could well be a stat.

Wards could easily remain.

Ban Zed.

Tenacity isn't all that good with so many knockups.