Boards›Gameplay

Thhe new Forbidden Idol might be a problem

Linna Excel··3 votes·873 views

Okay, riot is remaking forbidden idol to be more support friendly. It is giving supports +15% shields and heals for supports. Also as of now, However these aren't unique effects on the finished items. So is riot going to be happy if an abuse case scenario comes up?

I'm talking about Soraka + item 3504item 3504item 3504item 3504

Q: (11 + 12) * 1.6 = 36 hp per second on her and maybe an ally W: (200 + 144) * 1.6 = 550 HP R: (350 + 132) * 1.6 = 771 HP per teammate (minimum) 1,156 (max).. we are talking potentially 5780 hp healed in one ult.

So in comparison, how much AP would she need without those items to get those kind of healing numbers?

Q: (36 - 11) / .05 = 500 AP W: (550 - 200) / .6 = 583 AP R: (771 - 350) / .55 = 765 AP

That is a lot of AP equivalence you can get from 4 items. Sure 9600 is crazy gold, but it's pretty obvious you are getting a lot of raw numbers from the new forbidden idol items. In contrast, even the AP boost from a rabadon's and another completed rod item is only going to get you 280 AP or so and that would cost just over 8000 gold. Now imagine if one of your allies got a item 3065 on top of all that healing. We are talking a 670+ heal on a tank on a 1.2 second CD. That's a bit much.

6 Comments

Abyssphere1 votes

Past a certain point AP becomes more valuable for heal amping than these effects, and this is particularly true for Soraka because her AP scaling is bonkers. If you want insane Soraka healing you are better off spending the gold on something with more AP after Censer + Crucible.

Linna Excel1 votes

Except however how bonkers her healing scaling is, the 240 AP and +60% healing from 4 ardent censors is going to be easier to get and more bang for the gold spent. There's also the base healing which the item multiplies.

Take her W. How much would it cost to get the 583 AP to break even between pure AP and the 4 multipliers? I'm thinking you'll need a deathcap and at least 300 AP from other items/runes/masteries. You are now talking about an expensive build for a mid-laner, much less a support.

Oleandervine1 votes

It's a huge problem because they will now balance heals and shields around this item. This means that healers like Nami, Sona, and Soraka will have dirt poor heals and be forced to build Mikael or Ardent, thus consuming yet another item slot with a mandatory item in order to remain relevant. So after the gold income item, the sightstone, and the boots, this comes up to item #4.

So unless you really are keen on giving up the Frost Queen/Talisman active in lieu of the Eye Stone, you really only have 2 item slots to work with. This is severely limiting, especially since it will force healing champs to build essentially the exact same way. Also, Warmog Soraka will pretty much die, because she can't build up enough HP with only a Sightstone and 2 item slots, one of which must be the Warmog itself.

This change to the Idol line, on paper, seems like a good support driven change. But in practice, it ends up creating core problems like Deathfire's Touch, where Syndra and other high burst mages were pretty much garbage without building the item. Champions in this game should first and foremost be designed and balanced independently of items. Items add little boosts to alter how you play your champ, and if certain champs become to problematic with items, the item needs to change, not the champion. Soraka is already on the chopping block for preemptive nerfs because of this item, and for me, that is not ok.

Angry Monster1 votes

passive is unique

Linna Excel2 votes

According to surrender@20, it isn't on the items it builds into.

Crossette1 votes

The 15% should stack multiplicatively, it shouldn't stack the percents.

15%+7.75%+3.325%+1.65% or something like that

So it would be around 127.725%, not 160%

Even if the passives stacked it wouldn't be overly effective

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Linna Excel

A skin line idea for supports
Concepts & Creations102 comments
284
votes
I feel bad for RiotRepertoir
Gameplay364 comments
214
votes
@Ghostcrawler, can you do the playerbase a favor?
Gameplay197 comments
213
votes
Riot, can you please stop changing lores like this
Story, Art, & Sound40 comments
168
votes
Riot, I don't think diamond players like your reworks
Gameplay159 comments
154
votes
So riot forgot about one of the main problems of supporting you have to deal with
Gameplay124 comments
85
votes