To people saying Shyvana needs a rework...

Mira Arya Enthe··10 votes·1,242 views

Shyvana isn't a tank. There is the first problem most people have. She is a fighter and THREAT tank. She has no CC, she fills a role just like Garen or Mundo as a consistent source of threat that is tanky. Also the current Bloodrazor isn't good enough to warrant buying it on her unless you really know what you are doing, or are carrying really hard and can afford to go less tanky on her. You have great consistent damage however, so get a Cinderhulk, it and Titanic Hydra even stack well together as both benefit from HP.

I have heavy success on her, and lots of kill potential. Smite item > Titan > Cinderhulk > Deadmans > Banshees > BotrK/Warmogs/Zz'Rot.

If they reworked her into a tank. I'd be mad.

If they reworked her into an assassin or other high damage, squishy fighter, I'd probably quit League.

People who say she has no identity don't play her. She is basically Garen in the jungle. She deals consistent fighter damage, with the ability to leap, become tankier and deal consistent AoE damage. She is a threat tank, that makes herself worth targeting, but doesn't die easily. There are several of these in the game: Nasus, Garen, Mundo, Udyr, Illoai, Morde, Olaf, Renekton, Swain, Yorick and Volibear all serve similar roles in a team fight. They aren't true tanks. Nor do they do the most damage. They are a consistent threat who makes themselves worth targeting, but hard to kill. Shyvana also has amazing counter jungle potential, amazing clear times and great split pushing power as she can outduel many champions in the game. She has a home in the game and it is fairly solid.

Don't push Riot into a rework on a champion who is solid. And have it destroyed and turned into something it isn't.

'Threat Tanks' in LoL: DrMundo Garen Illaoi Mordekaiser Volibear Trundle Yorick Udyr Singed Renekton Olaf Teemo Shyvana Swain

http://champion.gg/champion/Shyvana She currently has the highest enemy jungle farm in the game and second highest allied jungle farm. She doesn't die much per match. She has great gold earned, damage dealt and damage taken. Due to being a heavy farmer and soloing dragon she falls off a bit in assists and kills. Her win rate is less than 1% under 50. She only needs some minor buffs in some areas. One thing that makes her unique other than her ult, lack of resources in a kit with so many DPS buffs and a speedrun. Is that she is one of the few junglers who it is regular to solo dragon one when you feel it is safe. Early, and all through the game.

EDIT: I can, however, agree that her in game model could use some love.

24 Comments

UltraGigaNiga3 votes

I think she needs a rework cuz she ugly af

EDIT: in game

Mira Arya Enthe2 votes

{quoted}

I think she needs a rework cuz she ugly af

EDIT: in game

That is a visual update. I agree with you there. Not a rework, her kit is fine. Maybe minor tweaks or some buffs to fix her win rate. No rework.

Linna Excel5 votes

I think Ezreal likes her current model.

Lintu Puck1 votes

I see "Leg Day" has gotten around. XD

Lord Boltrix3 votes

We have a name for them.

We call them 'juggernauts.'

Fear them, for they do not fear you.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Lord Boltrix,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=g8eXNEMc,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-08-19T23:25:41.022+0000)

We have a name for them.

We call them 'juggernauts.'

Fear them, for they do not fear you.

Thank you. Somebody who knows what lay betweem tank and fighter.

Ralanr1 votes

It's rare, but sometimes you find them.

Linna Excel2 votes

Eh...

Even though I don't play Shyv as a tank, a bunch of people do. I think that's part of the problem. She does well enough full tank that people will do it, even if she's technically a juggernaut.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Linna Excel,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=g8eXNEMc,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2016-08-19T23:17:36.227+0000)

Eh...

Even though I don't play Shyv as a tank, a bunch of people do. I think that's part of the problem. She does well enough full tank that people will do it, even if she's technically a juggernaut.

That is the problem. She isn't a tank. Look at all the primary "Tanks" in the game. You NEED reliable hard CC. If they play her as anything other than a bruiser and AoE threat tank. They are fooling themselves. Sej is a Tank. Shy isn't.

But Cinderhulk is still far far better on her than Razor. 50% AS and 4% max HP damage isn't worth a full item slot or the gold to buy it.

DraygenBiscuit3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mira Arya Enthe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=g8eXNEMc,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2016-08-19T23:21:09.886+0000)

That is the problem. She isn't a tank. Look at all the primary "Tanks" in the game. You NEED reliable hard CC. If they play her as anything other than a bruiser and AoE threat tank. They are fooling themselves. Sej is a Tank. Shy isn't.

But Cinderhulk is still far far better on her than Razor. 50% AS and 4% max HP damage isn't worth a full item slot or the gold to buy it.

Umm why is it a problem to play shyv tank? I mean there are no set rules, I feel that people should build whatever they want.... However if you are referring to people complaining shes bad because shes not tanky, then I see your point. I play Shyv tank sometimes, when my team needs another tank but most of the time I go AD.. But there are times when tank is best.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

{quoted}

Umm why is it a problem to play shyv tank? I mean there are no set rules, I feel that people should build whatever they want.... However if you are referring to people complaining shes bad because shes not tanky, then I see your point. I play Shyv tank sometimes, when my team needs another tank but most of the time I go AD.. But there are times when tank is best.

You can build her tanky. She isn't a tank. Period. She has no lockdown. She is a juggernaut like Garen. She is not a tank like Nautilus.

Linna Excel1 votes

I would not buy cinderhulk on Shyvana.

Adriqnohee2 votes

I also agree that she doesn't need a remake, but she does need an update and some number checking.

Lady Hammerlock2 votes

what she needs is her twin bites to be buffed back and reverting the W change on her geez

GULAG 4 U2 votes

She's more of a juggernaut honestly.

Great Muta1 votes

Your winrate is 50%. It's not a massive success.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Great Muta,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=g8eXNEMc,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-08-19T22:47:31.044+0000)

Your winrate is 50%. It's not a massive success.

I am speaking of this season, with this build, in this jungle meta. Not my overall win rate with the champion.

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-history/NA1/48865711?champion=102

The point of this post wasn't even my win rate. It was that people think she has no place in the game. When she fills one tons of other champions do, and she does it well.

Considering her current win rate is 49.29% anything over that means I do better than the community average on her for Plat+

Shyvana's focus should be on farm, dragons, split push and teamfight AoE damage. Not on KDA. And that win rate has certainly gone up since I switched from Bloodrazor to Cinderhulk, as the match history shows.

TheHurricaneGamr1 votes

Teemo is not a threat tank, he's AP.

DunkinNoobs1 votes

Shyvana isn't even a threat tank. Shyvana is a carry.

Shyvana item 1416 item 3078 item 3748 item 3111 item 3143 item 3091

Forhonor3211 votes

I understand you don't want a rework for her because you feel she's solid but here are my issues. 1: Yes Shyvana is suppose to be like Garen and Mundo but you said it yourself, she has no CC and Garen and Mundo they do. Garen, remember has a silence and Mundo has the ability to constantly slow enemies if he lands his cleavers. Shyvana, on the other hand, pretty much can be said to have no CC due to her knock back on her ult just being really clunky in terms of the hit box and knockback. These champions that you describe as threat tanks fit more into the roles of Juggernauts, champions that basically deal damage like a fighter but can soak up a bit of damage like a tank. However, again, most of these champions that you listed have some form of CC over her when you say that she's suppose to fill in one of their roles 2: While you do point out the good stuff of her counter jungling, pushing, etc, I just don't believe that she's a solid champion. Literally every other jungler in the game I feel has more early ganking potential then Shyvana has at this moment. Even Yi, who literally has no CC whatsoever, I feel has more early ganking potential then Shyv just due to his damage potential. She basically has no form of early CC pre 6 and even when she does hit 6, it only feels like she can pull of some decent ganks because like I said her ult is fairly clunky due to hit box and knockback.

To put it short, IMO she still needs to have a rework, and if Riot does do this I'm fairly certain they're not just going to do a full rework into a complete tank or fighter. She already feels like a juggernaut at the moment and so they're going to expand on that. At most she'll still be the same but they'll probably add some new abilities to her and hopefully some form of early CC to help with more early ganks.

Phenova2 votes

I can't agree more with you, the fact that she doesn't have a reliable CC and ultimate make her a bit clunky to play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvhmIX9s2Pc

But imo the only thing that needs a rework it's her ultimate (rework or fix in fact). Her ultimate is sooooo bug and weird to use that most of the time i don't even use it (except for escape or as a gap closer).

I would like to see a reliable cc and hitbox on her ultimate and not a weird push back that works/hit once every 3 games (i'm exaggerating a bit). Maybe a cc like viktor's E after improved? something that drags target hit on her?

Or instead of a cc on her ultimate, remove the push back, add more damage (maybe) and instead put a slow on her E?

Also, and this point is really important to me, make her ultimate no cc-able. IT'S A DRAGON!!! even a bit of wind can stop her ulti.... Please RIOT, shyvana isn't suppose to be a fearsome dragon in ulti? Make her unable to b cc during the flying time! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzQV4UQpduQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRnH1dUbHDY&feature=youtu.be

I'm just suggesting some ideas.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

{quoted}

I can't agree more with you, the fact that she doesn't have a reliable CC and ultimate make her a bit clunky to play.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvhmIX9s2Pc

But imo the only thing that needs a rework it's her ultimate (rework or fix in fact). Her ultimate is sooooo bug and weird to use that most of the time i don't even use it (except for escape or as a gap closer).

I would like to see a reliable cc and hitbox on her ultimate and not a weird push back that works/hit once every 3 games (i'm exaggerating a bit). Maybe a cc like viktor's E after improved? something that drags target hit on her?

Or instead of a cc on her ultimate, remove the push back, add more damage (maybe) and instead put a slow on her E?

Also, and this point is really important to me, make her ultimate no cc-able. IT'S A DRAGON!!! even a bit of wind can stop her ulti.... Please RIOT, shyvana isn't suppose to be a fearsome dragon in ulti? Make her unable to b cc during the flying time! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wzQV4UQpduQ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VRnH1dUbHDY&feature=youtu.be

I'm just suggesting some ideas.

Some good ideas too! I wouldn't mind, if to bring her win rates up they added some reliable CC to her ult or her E. They could make it so if she lands directly on an enemy with her ult they are stunned for .5/1/1.5 seconds. Or they could add a 30/35/40/45/50% slow on her E that lasts for 2 seconds to give her early ganking potential. Those would be simple fixes.

But honestly. Here is what I would do. A Very, very mild rework that buffs her kit a little but makes it take a bit more skill to play effectively.

Passive: Same

Q: Same

W: Same

E: Enemies hit by her E are slowed for 2 second by 30%, basic attacks against marked targets slow them by 15% for .5 seconds.

R: Still carries enemies with her as she ults them. Enemies Shyvana lands directly on top of take 10% increased damage from her for 2 seconds and are stunned for .5/1/1.5 seconds.

Mira Arya Enthe1 votes

{quoted}

I understand you don't want a rework for her because you feel she's solid but here are my issues. 1: Yes Shyvana is suppose to be like Garen and Mundo but you said it yourself, she has no CC and Garen and Mundo they do. Garen, remember has a silence and Mundo has the ability to constantly slow enemies if he lands his cleavers. Shyvana, on the other hand, pretty much can be said to have no CC due to her knock back on her ult just being really clunky in terms of the hit box and knockback. These champions that you describe as threat tanks fit more into the roles of Juggernauts, champions that basically deal damage like a fighter but can soak up a bit of damage like a tank. However, again, most of these champions that you listed have some form of CC over her when you say that she's suppose to fill in one of their roles 2: While you do point out the good stuff of her counter jungling, pushing, etc, I just don't believe that she's a solid champion. Literally every other jungler in the game I feel has more early ganking potential then Shyvana has at this moment. Even Yi, who literally has no CC whatsoever, I feel has more early ganking potential then Shyv just due to his damage potential. She basically has no form of early CC pre 6 and even when she does hit 6, it only feels like she can pull of some decent ganks because like I said her ult is fairly clunky due to hit box and knockback.

To put it short, IMO she still needs to have a rework, and if Riot does do this I'm fairly certain they're not just going to do a full rework into a complete tank or fighter. She already feels like a juggernaut at the moment and so they're going to expand on that. At most she'll still be the same but they'll probably add some new abilities to her and hopefully some form of early CC to help with more early ganks.

Adding a slow to her E or some form of CC to her R would be fine.

By Rework, I mean like Fiora, Quinn, Morde or Ashe. Something that entirely reshapes the character's role in the game.

Akhmnra3

ok bronze nub

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