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Can Tahm please get... Something?

SkyblazeHydraX3··8 votes·694 views

I have very strong opinions about champions and their capabilities. Tank, CC, Mobility, Damage; in my opinion a champion ideally has only two of these. Tahm has three of these four, and it's incredibly frustrating.

Tahm has massive amounts of tank, some extremely powerful CC, and a deceptively high amount of damage- which is even worse because he gets it for free buy buying tank stats. This makes Tahm extremely frustrating to fight, because how it breaks down is- ignoring the other traditional teamfight priorities- what YOU have to do is eat through two layers of tank, while all HE has to do is land any three hits on you and then eat you, either killing you with its 20-to-32% max health base damage (plus 2-to-6% of his own max health), or drop you in the middle of his team for them to butcher you.

I get it; Tahm is unfortunately rather unremarkable except for precisely what makes him frustrating to fight against, but that's not a good thing. So can Tahm get... something, please? I don't wanna see him gutted, nonviable, and made utterly useless. I have a friend who absolutely ADORES Tahm, and loves to play him. I just.... I want him to feel somewhat fair to fight against, y'know?

Vent post that's probably gonna get downvoted to all hell, but I would like to somehow have some constructive conversation on the matter.

25 Comments

kebslol2 votes

tahmn needs nothing. he's imba already.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

I mean changes (not necessarily nerfs, but rather a redistribution of power) to make him less frustrating.

Slamurai Jack2 votes

Tahm is now like Lee: Frustrating, overloaded, oppressive, and yet still garbage.

SkyblazeHydraX32 votes

I remember Lee being the biggest, most annoying pain in the ass ever. Now? Not so much. Which is weird.

Drehirth1 votes

What could they do at this point? I can understand your hate because some champions are just SUPER annoying (blitzcrank is on my permenant shit list lol, the obligatory level 1 invade is ridiculously annoying), but he's not doing well at all right now overall.

high sustained melee dps beat him easily in fights, ranged kite him to death while he's extremely easy to peel off. He brings lankiness and nice utility with his devour, but his ability to fight anything but low damage tanks or very squishy immobile targets is actually pretty bad now.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

I was playing as Illaoi. Fucking wrecked the enemy Nasus to the point his first item was Frozen Heart and he bought Tabi Boots. Amazingly cathartic because Nasus is on my shitlist (I hate it when champions can build obscenely tanky while still getting huge amounts of damage in general, TBH). Unfortunately the enemy jungler was Wukong, and hoo boy was he laying down the kingly law. I'll admit Wukong might be a little problematic himself (which I hate because when I was starting out I loved to play him), but my biggest problem was Tahm.

I would do what Illaoi does, throw myself into danger to ult the enemy team and try to show them the power of Nagakebouros. But all Tahm had to do was hit me three times, then he could eat me while I was frantically trying to deal my damage and essentially remove me from the fight, then spit me right in the middle of the enemy team. I just really hate it when enemies can innately win a fight because they hit you X number of times (which might be why bruiser/tank Ekko is still frustrating).

I can understand he CAN be kited- which can be difficult with some items like Swiftness and DMP on top of the strong slow/stun of his Q- but how can high melee DPS beat him? He just needs to lick them three times, W, and spit them out for a shit tone of damage. Rinse and repeat with Tough Skin temporarily doubling his health.

I get it. He's unremarkable without his devour and the passive component of his ult. And honestly I like the idea of a champion that can go both solo and support. I just wish they could do something to make him less frustrating to fight while still maintaining his viability. To be honest it kinda frustrates me that a champion like Tahm could be released in such a troublesome state.

Drehirth1 votes

He just doesn't deal enough damage to duelists who can build tanky/have damage and is a juicy catfish stew for the following

Shyvana Fiora MasterYi XinZhao Jax

though it looks like it was tahm support so those aren't as relevant

I used to play tahm a bunch until he became fotm/perma banned a couple of months ago

Ashe Ezreal Kalista Vayne

I pretty much never saw an ashe, but the rest I would hate with an unbelievable passion because they perma kite him

Ah that's just a sad game honestly. looking at your team comp it was actually perfect for fighting tahm, though I usually don't like blaming my team for a loss it was definitely your team lol... here's what went wrong there

  • ashe has no boots -.- (one of my most played adcs and I love going against tahm as her because she does really well against him, especially when he's support because she can keep him in check throughout the game, and do very well in laning phase.) Obviously with her score she did horrible regardless..

  • yi is glass cannon/crit, which doesn't work as well as bruiser/on hit yi for a number of reasons. More importantly he couldn't get sated in a 29 min game? -.-

  • overall your team wasn't together much at all given how low the kill participation of everybody was (lux with a pathetic involvement 10% of your teams kills overall.

  • all high damage champions that still couldn't do anything despite them focusing you? not much you could have done differently unless you were trying to fight when your team wasn't there which I have no way of telling.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

Our team just really didn't have much of any focus or coordination, unfortunately. It's been a while since I played her and I was having quite a bit of fun overall. I've seen Nasus rather frequently and just.... RAAAAAAAAAGE. So absolutely fucking one over was unbelievably cathartic.

Tahm wasn't even the biggest contributor, just the most annoying enemy. Wukong was an absolute beast in that game. On an unrelated note, I really kinda wanna see Wukong get some changes. His passive is just so.... bleh. I don't even notice it most of the time. Still, it should say something when Tahm was the biggest pain in the ass in that match.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

They really should just buff tahm in a way for support tahm players and gut jungle/top tahm.

Drehirth2 votes

jungle tahm is garbage lol

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

It's garbage now,it wasn't a joke before which I'm happy about but he's still being top which caused him to go severly underpowered :/

SkyblazeHydraX32 votes

Something like that I guess? I just want him to be a fair opponent.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Meh after top/jng got support tahm suffering I just want supp tahm to be the only choice at this point.

SkyblazeHydraX32 votes

See, I like the idea of a champion actually being able to go into multiple lanes, if it's done fairly. Sadly for Tahm, it isn't.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Oh yea that's definitely true, I'm just salty my support was heavily nerfed cause of top viability :/

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

Kinda like Lulu, I suppose.

Profirix1 votes

Riot said they want to nerf solo lane Tahm and buff support Tahm, but all I've seen are changes that utterly destroy support Tahm and only mildly hurt solo Tahm. His ultimate is really not that good. It takes eons to actually teleport and he isn't rewarded for bringing someone along. They need to do something to help his support play significantly. Like decrease the cooldown on his ultimate if he takes someone with him, or make it travel faster when someone else is with him...I don't know. I exclusively play him as a support and I find his impact (other than saving a carry from CC) to be very minor.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

I'd say his ultimate got buffed some time ago; it became a LOT faster and that made it a lot more effective. But I agree that Tahm should get some sort of reward for going support rather than taking to a solo lane.

Lovely Pants1 votes

Man, I was really excited for Tahm as a support player before he got abducted by top lane. I don't really mind if he get's rebalanced around top lane, though, but I agree with those that think he needs more substantial changes to his kit to be able to survive there without being complete ass to play or fight.

I've had this thought. What if activating Tahm's shield created a wider bubble around him and all damage done by an enemy inside that bubble ignored the shield and hit his health directly?

I feel like Tahm's weakness should be that if he is unable to keep you at arm's length you can really punish him. This also puts him at greater risk for swallowing an ally, but maybe refocusing him around mid-range fighting would make him more palatable when he's powerful in whatever lane he is in. Don't think he'd need anything more than minor adjustments on his other abilities to mesh with this change. Thoughts?

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

Except Tahm isn't a combatant oriented towards range. His kit emphasizes getting in close to the enemy. His Q especially is a means to accomplish that, while his E is meant to give him survivability in the midst of a brawl.

Personally, I think his Q shouldn't add on a mark of his passive, and his base damages should go down. Maybe his Q could get an increased slow based on the number of stacks, culminating in the stun for max stacks, and maybe his damage could have health scaling by default or something?

Lovely Pants1 votes

I'm not saying range, but mid-range. Or even near range, if that describes it better.

I feel like he shouldn't have extended melee dueling as a major strength, but instead rely on successfully weaving into the fray to execute his combo and then out again to safely sustain back up from his trades and only hard engage past this when he has softened up the enemy enough after a few successful trades. E would still give him protection from ranged burst as he tries to close in on a target or help prevent him from being picked off by parting shots as he disengages from a fight going south.

His kit currently offers little grounds for melee opponents to do anything except stat check him. He might need buffs back to other areas of his kit, but him being more able to die more concretely against melee champions if he misjudges his advantage or has his combo outplayed seems healthier to me.

You seem to be proposing to make him more of an extended dueling champion. I just personally don't see that's where his potential should be aimed. He has some unique interactions within his kit that to me contradict the form of a wall grinding down against you. I think these can be elevated instead by tooling his kit more towards that of a skirmisher.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

Honestly, not entirely sure where you're going with this. But I might just be frazzled because of things going on right now.

Lovely Pants1 votes

My arguments in more distinct points:

-I think Tahm's kit works poorly when he is encouraged to stay in melee range for longer periods of time.

-It feels better for Tahm against both melee and ranged if his threat is highest in short trades. Ranged champions are already in a better position to avoid his Q and kite Tahm.

-It makes it livable for melee champions who can be kited and spat back away by Tahm if he doesn't want to fight them if successfully extending a trade doesn't mean they have to chew through another HP bar.

-This also clarify's the weaknesses of Tahm's support abilities. It adds more reward back to the risk of melee champions getting into the fray to kill his ally if Tahm is way out of position to be supported in his retreat after swallowing.

-More power can be allocated to Tahm's utility which makes him viable as a support and a more deliberately unique pick as a top laner/jungle if he doesn't fall into the same mold as "stick to someone and murder them gradually" as so many tanks and bruisers do.

5050BS1 votes

What I hate is that he can get three stacks and eat you in under 2s

AA > Q > AA > W

This = to 60% of your HPs if not killing you AND CCing you for ~4s He can regen a ton of HPs in 4s making it even harder to kill him.

This is why he is perma banned in my games.

SkyblazeHydraX31 votes

I'm not a big fan of that either, gotta admit.

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