True or false?
I've seen people say that mastery is indicative of skill, and I don't really agree with that. I think that no matter how bad you are at a champ, there will eventually be some game where people just run in to you (or your carry if you're a support) constantly and feed. I certainly don't think I'm skilled, yet I have multiple M6 and M7 badges.
FOR JUSTICE22 votescan 100% say you can just get lucky a couple of games, and get a couple of S ranks. or just play the champ in an unconventional role
13/6/13 toplane annie with 179 CS in a game that lasted 40:06 lane opponent was maokai
EZPZ s rank
RainbowIcee2 votesVery true, i got my M7 evelynn playing her mid. Given i woop ass with old eve but the amount of people that abuse eve to bully newcomers makes it too difficult to get an S with the old eve in the jungle.
Arakadia5 votesI got Mastery 6 and 7 playing him in everything but support. Its so much easier if you can just do okay in an off meta role.
Jbels16 votesWell, if you're willing or able to drop almost 8000 blue essence on it....
xelaker8 votesthe trick to the new system is to master the cheapest champs since they flood you with cheap champ shards haha
0DESTROYERZ03 votesthis man knows whats up*[slayer-pantheon-thumbs]*
Ahri Body Pillow11 votes"You will eventually get better at a champion if you play them consistently." ???
Worst Kench NA12 votes[{quoted}](name=Ahri Body Pillow,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dpLMJlWl,comment-id=0010,timestamp=2017-12-05T00:46:25.325+0000)
"You will eventually get better at a champion if you play them consistently." ???
Yeah, and there's also people like me that have been in bronze for years and haven't improved. I'm just saying that it doesn't take skill to get M6/M7.
Spank the Fox7 votesI don’t recall Mastery ever being much about skill in the first place. It was to show how well you know that champion/shiny banner to show your main(s). Correlation usually dictates you will be also decent on that champion the more you play them, as shown by higher winrates (think 57-60%) with 125+ games on those champs.
It doesn’t mean I still won’t feed my ass off if I’m having a bad game.
DarkSoul19945 votesMastery has nothing to do with skill - it's why I fucking loath the mastery system so much. Riot should have called it 'Champion Enthusiast System' or something.
Playing 1 million Mastery Points worth of a champion and still being bronze/silver is actually more of a testament to how bad you are at said champion.
Elkington4 votesI've been playing Trundle since S2 and I've never gotten above S- on him. However, I've gotten S+ many times on other champs I've barely even played 100 games with.
It seems much easier to get S ranks on carries and assassins in general.
Shinjusuke2 votesTo be honest, in my experience, it's just easier to get S ranks by just having good CS.
Like, I've had games as a jungler where I'm something atrocious like 12/0 with multiple dragons under my belt and a baron, but my CS wasn't high because I'm too busy ganking and whatnot to AFK farm the jungle, and so I don't get an S rank.
Meanwhile, I've had games as ADCs where I left like 5/5/5 or sometimes even negative KDAs, but my farm was super high so I got an S.
It seems to be heavily waited toward CS, imo.
Kneesocks1 votesNot to mention if you're 0/0/30 with nami you'll get an A- , but if you play her top and get 15/10/5 score you'll get S+
YHWH Adonai1 votes[{quoted}](name=Dirty Fox,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dpLMJlWl,comment-id=000f00000003,timestamp=2017-12-06T14:08:34.346+0000)
Not to mention if you're 0/0/30 with nami you'll get an A- , but if you play her top and get 15/10/5 score you'll get S+
From my experience it's not that simple. What also counts are stats of the team. For example, if you are Nami and your stats are 0/0/30 but stats of the team are 80/20/148, then you will get low notes, but if states of team are 40/20/70 then you will get S on Nami. There are probably also other factors of the game, like ward points or cc points. I think it's possible to find out how algorithm more or less works if you could analyze enough stats for some champs.
Dolivera3 votesJust want to throw out that being in Bronze doesn't make someone bad at a champion. Being in Bronze is indicative of skill at playing League of Legends, not skill at playing Yasuo or Blitzcrank or whatever other champion.
pro rusher 22 votesBeing bronze means you are bad at the game. Having high lvl mastery doesn't mean anythink.
FutureCreator2 votesThis game has other aspects outside of landing skillshots and knowing how to use a champion's abilities. It's mostly about making the right descisions, which is what usually keeps most players in the lower divisions.
Sun Wu Ryuumoku1 votesmechanic (micro) is enough to get out of bronze.
FutureCreator2 votesI don't think that's the only thing you need, you'd have to get the basics of map rotations at least IMO. Otherwise you wouldn't see people with 1 million+ mastery points on a champion in bronze.
Sun Wu Ryuumoku2 votesmechanic was enough to get out of silvers for my first year. Im not a genius. i get ur point. But i think even their mecanic aren't good enough.
the most important thing to improve at very low elo, is to focus on one side of the game. i think to climb at low elo u should start by crush ur lane (so ur mechanic is what help to do it).
pro rusher 21 votesAnd if these players are bronze that means they are bad :/ Did you understand what i was trying to say ?
Dolivera1 votesDid you read what I wrote at all? Nothing you just said responded to anything I said.
pro rusher 21 votesxD i see that now, but i didn't see that when i was typing it
Flemman3 votesmastery don't mean anything imo.
As you say, spam a champ a lot a you will eventually get those token (especially on those popular champ like yas/thresh/....) but on the other hand, if the mode you enjoy the most is 3v3 and you spam your champ there, you don't deserve those token because "subpar player" logic by riot.
till they fix this disparity, the system will remain with it's flaw
Blood Mefist3 votesI say that M5, 6, and 7 are very LIGHTLY indicative of skill. The way I see it, Mastery increases the likelihood that someone has an idea of what they are doing. While it is true that they can be achieved with time, that time is indicative of them having some large degree of experience at the very least. I don't expect a Mastery 7 to get fed and do well every game, but I expect them to know the ins and outs of their champ enough that I can rely on them in most situations.
ForeverLaxx3 votesThe only reason people think it's an indicator of "skill" is because it's a numeric display that can be directly compared to someone else. In other words, it's the reason most games don't display MMR/ELO in the interface and you have to use third-party websites to estimate it. I'd even go so far as to say it's not necessarily indicative of champion knowledge/matchups either since you can basically bang your head on the wall enough times with them and still get S ranks depending on the opposing team.
But then I only play ARAM so I'll never be getting Mastery 7 on anything despite having played this game since Season 1.
I am Pacman3 votesMastery is indicative of play time. It indicates you have at least competent knowledge on how to play that champion because in order to get M7 you need to have played quite a few games on them (hopefully) learning them and their matchups in the process.
His Kitten1 votesI played a lot of supports prety much exclusively in aram/ rotating game modes to gain mastery levels, which for example has me getting Lulu on m7 with 6 games of actually playing her on the rift, which also resulted in me having heron mastery 7 by 30k mastery points, same with Zyra and karma and etc. Maybe it‘s just the support role that makes it easier to aquire an S rank, but that does seem to be lacking, since I do not think I can play Lulu by any means, I can press R and E tho, seems to be enough for riot I guess.
ChuShoe3 votesI'd rather you use your m5 champion in ranked than have you use the one you just got.
Catastrop2 votesVery true, my M7 on Liss was the most underwhelming thing ever because the last S was obtained was after I got matched against a team with two newbies.
SomeStars2 votesplaying a champion well does not mean playing the game well you can know every mechanic of lee sin and play him like a god but still suck with your overall skill like controlling objectives and game knowledge
for instance i'm a mastery 150k katarina player
im also silver 5 zero lp
[katarina-love]
Sukishoo2 votesYeah, the mastery really means nothing. It doesn't fully show your skill... getting 6/7 is fairly easy if you just keep playing the champ. I got one of my M7s out of totally random luck honestly. The game for some strange reason placed me in a match where people were literally level 15-20 players and I was like "WTF RIto, I'm Level 30 and I'm Gold, yet placed with unranked low levels?!" Made no sense, but I was able to use that to get an M7 lel.
notice me Sin pi2 votesi got mastery 6 orianna + 2 m7 tokens by only playing her as support back when yas was OP due to warlords, and when yas was OP due to ult bug. And rn i dont think im anywhere good at orianna.
Skorch2 votesI think it does show skill. I mean yeah luck can happen, but if you play a REALLY long time, but finally get all the Ss you need. That doesnt mean you are bad, like luck can be a factor in getting it early, being unlucky can also mean you are getting it late.
For instance after 50 game 4 people are mastery 5 on... I know hes a meme but lets just go with 
as he IS a good example when talking about skill.
Person A: Is really good at the champ and gets ALL the Ss he needs to get mastery 7 in 10 games.
Person B: He got lucky and had a 
, and 
in his game every single game and also got mastery 7 in 10 games.
Person C: He was terribly unlucky. He warded well always had good farm, played the map right, and his scores were pretty damn good... BUT he got between B+s and A+s in every single win he did. FINALLY he coordinated with his friends for a Yasuo comp and after 200 games got mastery 7.
Person D: Spent 200 games feeding but got 5 really lucky games.
All of them are now Mastery 7.
If there is an argument to make about Mastery = Skill, its this: By mastery 7 even if you are bronze, and you got them through mostly luck after a lot of games. At the VERY least, you know your champion very well. You might not be the MOST skilled and might not have good CS or Macro play, but you know the champion.
Shinjusuke2 votesIt's always bothered me that the "Mastery" system isn't a display of actual Mastery, but a display of "I've played enough games on this champion to hit m5, and then had at least 5 games where I got an S out of who-knows-how-many".
I personally believe it should be based on your average performance level.
Like, if you're consistently ranked S when you play the champ, M7. If you're consistently S-, M6. If you're consistently A+, M5.
And so on.
I'd be far more invested in the Mastery system if it made me say
"Shit, my lane opponent is Mastery 7. Well I'm screwed."
I want it to actually tell me something about the people I'm playing with. At the moment all it tells me is "they play this champion a lot" and that has no inherent value to me, since I know plenty of people who "play a champion a lot" and frankly just plain suck at that champion.
Starcraft243ver3 votesThis system already exists, it's called your ranked soloQ MMR.
Shinjusuke1 votesonly as a global skill indicator of your ability as a whole, and even then it's only an indicator of "how good are you at carrying your team".
What I want is for the Mastery system to be an indicator of a player's skill level with a specific champion, because that's useful information. The current Mastery system provides no useful information, as there's no way to know whether the person has M7 just because they play the character a lot, versus playing them well.
I know a guy who's played League for upwards of 5 years now. Up until 1 year ago, he never played PvP. Not a single game. He would only play against the AI. He's one of the worst players I've known, but he's got M7 on Lux, because he plays almost exclusively Lux, and you only need to get lucky and snowball a handful of times to get M7, no matter how many games it takes.
Starcraft243ver1 votesYes but that's totaly not the goal of masteries. If you want to compare two players, you compare their soloQ ranks over ~ 100-200 games.
The goal of masteries is to allow anyone to get the mastery 7 if they put enough time and effort in it. It's a farming mecanic that gives you a reward named in a way that might let you think it rewards your skill.
If mastery 7 meant you are top 1% with a given champion, you would frustrate 99% of your player base who could never get this mastery 7. And the funniest part would be that the 1% wouldnt care that much about masteries, because when you reach a high ELO it's because you understood long ago that the secret for climbing is not aiming for a rank, it's aiming to improve constantly.
Shinjusuke1 votesYou missing the entire point.
Masteries don't HAVE a goal. They don't mean anything, because they provide zero useful information.
Cosmetic fluff is fine, but claiming "it's not the point of a system that purely exists because Riot wanted a way for players to display their skill level with a champion" is just outright false. Masteries have always, since day 1, been claimed by Riot to be a display of skill with the champion.
They just don't.
You're welcome to do the research yourself, it's not that hard to find. I'm just saying it should be reworked to do the thing Riot claimed they were supposed to do, rather than just being totally pointless.
Starcraft243ver1 votesYou're cute.
Riot wanted a way for player to feel like they are skillfull in some pretty rare way, but they also wanted that a large part of the player base could use this feature, to avoid having another feature for the top 10%.
Riot's communication is actually irrevelant when it comes to find out what they really wanted to do with these mastery grades. You can't seriously think they would say "yeah, masteries ? They're kinda useless, but it's a good way for_ noobs_ [sic] to show off".
Shinjusuke1 votesNo, I'm informed.
<Removed by Moderation>
Think whatever you want, the benefit of being actually right is I don't feel the need to prove it to jerks like you.
Starcraft243ver1 votesI'm still looking for where I did insult you.
Yet you called me jerk.
The benefit of being actually right is precisely that I can prove my point. The downside of being wrong for you is you need to insult and make things up to keep pushing your point.
Wandering Bardo2 votesYes, and that is just supposed to be like that.
Why?
Players have different skill levels. Just like in NBL, Soccer or Baseball. There is the little soccer team of your high school and there are the world's masters. In between is a range, and within that range there are different tiers. Just like in LoL.
So, if some guy is Bronze V - and he wins at Bronze V games, it is a personal achievment. He is better than equally skilled players. If he is a Bronze 5 Ashe Mastery 7, then this is totally supposed to be like that. I am Silver I, I will eventually get Bard Mastery 7 while I am still Silver. Basically "super average". Why would I not have the right to have Mastery 7 within my range? I am a Mastery 7 Bard main then, in Silver. If the matchmaking (would) work(s), I will face other Silvers, or close to that, and thus we are equal. If the other (also Silver +-) guy will meet me, a M7 Bard, then this is very justified. I had a M7 Vayne as enemy, she was good, but still very silver-ish, tumbled into her death twice by being over-cocky. A Diamon M7 Vayne would not have done that, but again, we are in Silver range.
It's like denying the trophy to the winner team of a High School soccer tournament - just because they are not playing at the FIFA World Cup. Sounds stupid, right?
So, yeah, I think the Mastery 7 means you were good with your champion and played him a lot. So far, the guys with the badge were easily better - what makes sense. If you played 47 games with a character and collected several S, you somehow either contributed to the team (supports, wards) or were personally good with it (e.g. high CS). All that means you pulled your weight. More than a guy with 6 games on said champ.
If you keep this "I am Bronze, so I deserve no mastery 7", well, then you should go in a corner and cry, because you are surely neither are the best at school, won't be the best driver, won't earn the most money, will not be the best at cooking,.... But still your family will still like your cooking skills and consider them as good, even you are not owning a gourmet restaurant..
No. So why would a good Bronze 5 player not get his Mastery when fighting and winning over other Bronze 5? That's what the League system is for in every serious sport.
Greetings, Wandering Bardo
It Hertz When IP2 votesM7 doesn't mean shit other than "I play this champ a lot" or "I play this champion in a really odd role"
Gora T1 votes"I play this champion in a really odd role"
that's how I got my mastery 6 /almost 7 with Ashe and m7 with Velkoz support , not really odd role but non meta. I'm a shitty mid laner and Adc
It Hertz When IP1 votesI used to be a support main, so I tried nearly every interesting champion release in that role.
FYI release Illaoi was GODLIKE as support, before the E nerfs. Pulling enemy spirits made for an incredibly oppressive lane, and her ult was enough to make nearly every enemy jungler say "fuck that" when their bot requested a gank. Vel'koz was an amazing poke mage support before Dark Horse made Brand Support popular.
Gora T1 votesI did tried illaoi as supp when she got released , but I'm better with ranged supports, I think vel'koz still is a good supp , but it kinda depends also what adc you have . I never got why did they highlight brand support, since his kit make it kinda obvious that he can be used in the role
YHWH Adonai2 votesI had Yasuo M7 in my team during the game. I thought that if he has so high mastery maybe he will be a good Yasuo player. He went AFK after about 5 min of the game.
Starcraft243ver2 votesAt least he didnt feed.
YHWH Adonai1 votesAt least he didnt feed.
Yes. He didn't. He died twice before he left though. I guess it's kind of player who plays very agressivly and if he kills from the beginning then he plays the game, but if he dies he leaves the game.