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I have very mixed feelings about CertainlyT

Sooko··39 votes·4,400 views

Okay, so... first of all, I think his ideas are insane and amazing to keep the game fresh But to fit that in a champion it requires it to be very overloaded

The mechanics you add are amazing and very stylish But compared to older champions it is completely overpowered

Your champions are badass and have very defined roles But their weaknesses are hard to define (aside from Darius)

You created Thresh Lantern (imo one of the most creative mechanics ever put in the game) But it was insanely OP at the beginning (still is, but now is an acceptable level of OP, due to nerfs on the other parts of his kit)

You allow a lot of wombo-combos with your newer champions (Yasuo, Zyra, Kalista) But I am sick of Yasuo combos, more essentially Wukong+Malph+Yasuo, due to how easily they change games

The skillcap of most of your champions is a new level of high But so is the reward

Your concepts are unmatchable (Shadow Ninja, wind samurai, plant queen, spear hurling spirit that lives to grant revenge to others, soul drinker that was once a prison guard...) But they are very hard to include in a single balanced champion, which brings us multiple passives and insane kits

Your uniqueness is kind of your signature Which is followed by the brokenness as well

I'm not sure whether I should love you or hate you right now :/ But I still think your champions deserve to come to life, assuming Riot is willing to buff the older ones to let them keep up...

90 Comments

Tilomentry33 votes

I kind of think of him as a scientist during war time. He does experiments and research to push the boundaries of human knowledge but disregards the state of the world and in the end, the knowledge he uncovers will only do irreparable damage to the world.

I respect that he is always looking to add new mechanics and play styles to the game but I feel like he completely ignores the state of the game and is doing more harm than good.

MemeticMachine4 votes

You can almost say... he's a mad scientist! maybe of a chemical nature? He's Singed the WHOLE TIME!

vscAloha7 votes

He will eventually create the Nuclear Bomb of League of Legends.

Sooko9 votes

I kind of think of him as a scientist during war time. He does experiments and research to push the boundaries of human knowledge but disregards the state of the world and in the end, the knowledge he uncovers will only do irreparable damage to the world.

This is the most beautiful thing I've read in Boards so far.

Junkο1 votes

I respect that he is always looking to add new mechanics and play styles to the game but I feel like he completely ignores the state of the game and is doing more harm than good.

So did the creators of Azir, Gnar and Lee Sin, and Rek'Sai

Drukyul25 votes

This is why CertainlyT should be on the rework team. He'd bring fresh, new ideas, but be forcibly constrained from deviating TOO much from the champ as it is, and it'd be obvious when a tweak he makes is too strong when compared to the old champion (as opposed to having nothing to compare to with new champs).

Axxlon7 votes

This is why CertainlyT should be on the rework team. He'd bring fresh, new ideas, but be forcibly constrained from deviating TOO much from the champ as it is, and it'd be obvious when a tweak he makes is too strong when compared to the old champion (as opposed to having nothing to compare to with new champs).

That's actually a very good idea.

Direwolfiez8 votes

At the very least he needs someone to sit next to him and give him legitimate feedback about the champ; really doesn't seem like anyone challenges his ideas, at least from the outside looking in.

BastionKross1 votes

This.

Can you imagine Sion Soraka Sona Cassiopeia if CerT reworked them? I bet they would be in better shape than they are currently.

And don't get me started on what he would do to Taric. There would be gems everywhere. And it would be outrageous.

I don't think most people would mind CerT reworking their favorite champion. What Ashe main wouldn't want her to have a kit as loaded as Kalista?

CreationFlaw11 votes

Why? You'd rather just have a game filled with super simplistic point and click champions like Annie, blitzcrank, and Ryze for 125 champions? Doesn't seem enjoyable.

Raja Chachki7 votes

Why? You'd rather just have a game filled with super simplistic point and click champions like Annie, blitzcrank, and Ryze for 125 champions? Doesn't seem enjoyable.

"point and click" "blitzcrank" your argument became invalid the second u said Blitz was point and click.....tell me which abilities are point and click on Blitz?

Jeddy0172 votes

Why?You'd rather just have a game filled with overloaded,difficult to master champions like Zed,Kalista & Yasuo for 125 champions? Doesn't seem enjoyable.

I believe it would be nice if we had a balance of simple champs & complex champs.

CreationFlaw1 votes

Why?You'd rather just have a game filled with overloaded,difficult to master champions like Zed,Kalista & Yasuo for 125 champions? Doesn't seem enjoyable.

I believe it would be nice if we had a balance of simple champs & complex champs.

I don't exactly find Yasuo difficult to master, same with Kalista, Zed sure, but them no.

Direwolfiez2 votes

All you have to do to play Kalista is learn how to use her passive right, and you just don't get caught. Not exactly challenging, but I still see people jumping directly into teamfights as her. Makes me laugh while I'm murdering their face.

Jeddy0171 votes

Ok,then replace Yas & Kal with Kat & Yi,they are some very difficult to master champs..............................-_-

Point is:Not every champ needs to be complex & not champ needs to be simple.DONE.

Crowley7232 votes

Ok,then replace Yas & Kal with Kat & Yi,they are some very difficult to master champs..............................-_-

Point is:Not every champ needs to be complex & not champ needs to be simple.DONE.

Since when areMasterYi andKatarina very difficult to master?summoner 3 Yi = q r e aa aa aa aa they are dead Kat = q e w r they are dead. Thats so hard to master.......

Jeddy0172 votes

...........................-_-...............................................'sigh' ...........................................facepalm..............

One word:Sarcasm

I'm done.

SIayton2 votes

Why?You'd rather just have a game filled with overloaded,difficult to master champions like Zed,Kalista & Yasuo for 125 champions? Doesn't seem enjoyable.

I believe it would be nice if we had a balance of simple champs & complex champs.

Actually I would much prefer a game full of "difficult" and fun champions. Game should reward mastery, not reward overpowered simple champions like Ryze or Annie.

Direwolfiez1 votes

overpowered Annie

lol

Junkο2 votes

Have you ever played Annie mid? You literally go mid lane, cs with Q till level 6 then 100-0 the enemy laner everytime ult comes off cd.

Direwolfiez1 votes

I've actually had people predict my Flash + Tibbers and Flash out of it, and there was a very small window of time for that to happen. Also, unless you get an early kill, you can't snowball and pretty much have to farm and roam most of mid game to make up for it. Granted, her ganks are terrifying, but she's not OP. She relies on snowballing early to become a major threat, so you have to keep her down as long as possible to keep that from happening. If you're trying to gank her, make sure her ult is down, then bait her into blowing her stun by going aggro, tanking the damage and getting your jungler to jump on her. If she doesn't blow her stun, she will get away unless you either stun or suppress her.

Kobila20001 votes

I've had Annies I'd wreck HARD on mid lane, they would just burst me to Netherlands the moment they got ult. I don't know how you can say she relies on snowballing, I have not yet seen an Annie, fed or not, that did not do a crapton of damage. Why do you think she was so popular as a support? Because she doesn't have to get fed to 100-0 people.

And yeah, "bait her" when she doesn't have an ult. How exactly do you expect her to not have an ult unless she used it to delete you? You think she'll farm minions with it if she gets bored? This is akin to saying "make sure she's not in lane to successfully take her turret ".

I am not saying she's op because she has horrible range that is very easy to abuse. But she is certainly not weak or easy to shut down.

Direwolfiez1 votes

Never claimed that she was weak, since we all know that's a load of bull. If you can get a 3-man gank that's spread out far enough that she can't AoE stun you with W or R, it doesn't matter if she's fed or not, she's gonna die. Separate her from her team, get your tank to eat the stun, then jump on her.

Believe me, if you shut an Annie down and keep her from getting kills/assists, it really hurts her power levels, and then they're going to have to rely on their front line to set up kills for them in order to get the ball rolling. I know how oppressive laning against Annie is, but that's my best advice. I don't see many support Annies anymore, so I don't know much about countering that.

Kobila20001 votes

I don't have particular problems playing against her, but no matter how far behind she is, she remains a threat due to her high damage. I've had Annies that had several deaths and were outcs-ed hard, they'd still manage to burst me down if I was unprepared.

Also, asking for a 3-man gank? What kind of advice is that? Who wouldn't die to that?

Talamare7 votes

I'm not sure whether I should love you or hate you right now :/ But I still think your champions deserve to come to life, assuming Riot is willing to buff the older ones to let them keep up...

Nothing, NOTHING would be worse than having every champion designed by CertainlyT

His designs are overly complicated for literally no reason.

The most well designed champions are the ones that are simplest. In general his designs are toxic, leading to only being interesting to play but terrible to play against, and not to mention his champions are almost constantly in the top bans list.

Honestly, he should leave LoL and join DOTA or something instead

A Slime Appears13 votes

So Ryze's design is amazing? Kat's design is amazing? Akali's? I mean, they are facerollingly simple, right? So they must be amazingly designed. Give those men/women some medals.

DaCush2 votes

Exactly, thank you for that post. Was about to say the same thing. He obviously didn't think through what he was saying before he posted it. Not to mention if you make champs as simple as the ones you listed, there's rarely ever a skill curve. It just flatlines after you play 2-3 games and makes the game extremely stale. The most well designed champs are def not the most basic ones because all they are about is their ball of stats and who scales better rather than their gameplay and who can perform and use the kit better. One is more about skill while the other is more about stats. And no, I'm not saying that champs with a skill curve can't be op.

Pvt Yong Tai3 votes

If EVERY champion was designed by CertainlyT, I would have 0 problems whatsoever.

The problem is that there are other parts of the game that are being rendered useless or antiquated with CertainlyT's far-out ideas. If those old champions never existed (i.e. my beloved Annie, Warwick, Caitlyn, etc.) then there would be balance within the game. Every champion would be just as crazy as the next, so what's the harm? It'd be like DotA 2.

But they're not. My Annie suffers from terrible mobility requiring a flash to do anything alone, and barely does more damage than the next mage anyway. My Warwick, as much as he's uber broken right now, has to rely almost completely on a shaky single target suppression that can be completely countered by a single skill-breaker CC or QSS. Meanwhile these new champs get every big and fancy bell and whistle, with low cooldown dashes and CC, high burst, %HP damage, survivability, and high team synergy abilities, with relatively little regard to a particular strength and weakness. But of course, it's partially my fault for wanting to play the champs I fell in love with at the beginning of my League career. I need to suck it up and play those new champions to get with the program. /slightsarcasm

Feathermane2 votes

So you stick with champions you like. Problem solved.

manbearswine4 votes

So you stick with champions you like. Problem solved.

That's insanely stupid,every time I pick one of those(though to be fair,both warwick and annie are horrible examples,think more of lux/brand/ashe) I end up getting facerolled by immense mobility,because guess what,skillshots were never intended to be balanced around 70 dashes,so I end up playing soraka/janna/lulu(mid/top)/amumu 90% of the time out of fear of getting hard countered by mobility.

He is absolutely right,the issue with CeraintlyT champs are how they counter so hard old,already struggling releases.

Junkο1 votes

I play Veigar a l lot and i have 0 problems about a champion with tons of mobility trying to kill me.

manbearswine1 votes

I play Veigar a l lot and i have 0 problems about a champion with tons of mobility trying to kill me.

Well it's not that simple,as most of veigars abilities are targeted or meant to be chained into his semi-targeted cc,so he doesn't necessarily have so much issues in the 1v1 matchup,or at least not something which is practicular against mobility.

just actually read my post previous post.

Tabs5 votes

He would be perfect if he designed ALL of leagues champions. The reason they seem (are) so overloaded is because they are, in comparison to older champions. If everything is OP nothing is OP.

Tilomentry15 votes

That's actually really bad logic to go by and one Riot has (historically) tried to avoid.

If everything is OP, then it devalues a person's skill to react to certain situations because once caught you're dead (because everything is OP). Removing reactionary skills from the game, removes depth and ultimately makes the game less interesting

DaCush5 votes

coughdotacough

Axxlon4 votes

That's actually really bad logic to go by and one Riot has (historically) tried to avoid.

If everything is OP, then it devalues a person's skill to react to certain situations because once caught you're dead (because everything is OP). Removing reactionary skills from the game, removes depth and ultimately makes the game less interesting

This couldn't be more correct.

The5lacker5 votes

I would love CertainT if he didn't have a fetish for senseless complexity.

CreationFlaw4 votes

Yeah, that's kind of DOTA 2 logic, is it not? I just want things to be a bit more balanced, I still want counters and outplays and stuff, but I don't want a Yasuo or Zed being able to go top lane and dominate half of the bruisers there. That isn't fun. All of his designs are really safe besides Yasuo, and Yasuo still gets easy to hit cc on a low cooldown and a anti poke shield.

manbearswine10 votes

Yeah, that's kind of DOTA 2 logic, is it not? I just want things to be a bit more balanced, I still want counters and outplays and stuff,

Thing is Dota is still more balanced than lol,and by no means is this Dota logic,Dota is designed around unique heroes with clear strengths(simillar to certaintlyT champs) and weaknesses(not certaintlyT related at all),more importantly dota heroes aren't created with the intent of consolidating the meta and making champions who are already in a bad spot in an even worse spot(classic cerataintlyT design).

darius/zyra are different,they feel like regular champions for the most part,darius even a bit too binary.

Thresh is retarded,everything you could ever want(and more) thrown into his kit,no identifiable strengths,definitely no weaknesses,a mess all around,and lantern pushing the mobility meta further,as most supports can't make vi travel half of the map when she ganks a lane.

Zed/Yasuo/Kalista each pushing mobility creep(It's important to note mobility creep is a form of power creep,just specifically power creeping through mobility) a step further,each obliterates old skillshot reliant or immobile champions(who are already in a bad spot),forcing picks of champions with either immense mobility or reliability(as in point-click abilities in most cases).

Releasing unique and even heavy kitwise champions is fine,just don't make them excabrate existing problems(yasuo/zed/kalista),nor make them so generalistic there is no reason to pick anything over them(thresh and to a lesser extent zed).

Pvt Yong Tai3 votes

I don't know why you were getting downvoted. I feel you are saying about the same thing as Moberrybusiness, and I agree with both of you. I liked Dota 2. I liked how each Hero felt extremely powerful in their own right, but each had very clear weaknesses as well. For example, Legion Commander can become ridiculously and brokenly powerful because she can permanently stack damage, but to do so, she has to consistently kill enemies, but that's a bit difficult considering how she doesn't have any real active damage abilities.

I would really like it if Riot would re-evaluate their design philosophies, but just an acknowledgement towards the many of us who are complaining about this constant power creep issue would be nice. The fact that no one from the design team has said a word about it lately irks me.

Gray Fanchon1 votes

I don't get this logic regarding Thresh. He has everything you want in his kit, but no identifiable strengths...?

He has a lot of CC and disengage. He's a jailer, he uses chains. He moves stuff around, which is actually incredibly potent in League. But, he doesn't have a ton of damage output and he lacks the stats or abilities to initiate well. And for that matter he lacks any kind of sustain. He's good, a very good all-around support who is an excellent playmaker, but it's not like there's no reason to pick anyone else in the role.

manbearswine2 votes

I don't get this logic regarding Thresh. He has everything you want in his kit, but no identifiable strengths...?

An identifiable strength is something a champion is particularly good at,say for janna it's peel/disengage,Thresh is great at everything,thus has no identifiable strengths.

He has a lot of CC and disengage. He's a jailer, he uses chains. He moves stuff around, which is actually incredibly potent in League. But, he doesn't have a ton of damage output

he has as much damage output as most supports,and more than most in lane.(there are some champions who are played in soloq as supports and deal notably more damage,but as far as top tier supports go,he has as much damage as most)

and he lacks the stats or abilities to initiate well.

please tell me that you are joking,death sentence is called death sentence for a reason,thresh is definitely a top tier initiator as far as supports go.

And for that matter he lacks any kind of sustain.

he has a shield...that sort of falls under that category,aside from that he tends to build locket/face of the mountain,but overall sustain isn't a defining strength for supports at the moment,peeling is,and thresh is a great peeler.

He's good, a very good all-around support who is an excellent playmaker, but it's not like there's no reason to pick anyone else in the role.

arguably the most contested support 2 world championships in a row,so... but really,if you can play thresh,you should pick thresh,aside from the occasional support which gets out of line(annie in late s3/early s4,soraka right now) thresh has alternated from the strongest support to the second strongest support since his release,Riot is very unwilling to even attempt to properly balance him,because like most other things which are too generalistic,either they overshadow everything,or they are overshadowed themselves(this is why being too generalistic is bad design(*)).

*-It doesn't have to be,it can be simply something which does mediocerly and acts as a safe pick,but will generally be overshadowed by overpowered or niche picks(depending on comp),supposedly due to flashy plays riot refuses to let thresh fall into mediocrity,where too generalistic champions(like taric) belong,so instead he is spending most of his time being overpowered and overshadowing all other (support) picks.

Kobila20001 votes

No offense, but if you can't see why such a broken champion keeps getting abused by pros since his release...

2pudge1cup2 votes

Dota characters have considerably stronger abilities than what people are used to here, but they don't have a bunch of stats/passives on top of it. So CertainlyT-esque champs are not dota ones.

Junkο1 votes

Yasuo

easy to hit CC

lolol

Ale non è male4 votes

The problem with Certainly T champs is not the mechanics it brings, but is the balance he don't give to its champs and no one fix thereafter

2x crit chance on passive and the too long armor pen duration on yasuo ult is what screw yasuo, and these are not related to the mechancis CertainlyT inserted in the game(flow shield , windwall), but to a problem of balance when these things are added to CertainlyT mechanic The same can be said for Kalista. The problem aren't necessarily the new mechanics, the possible problem is W passive damage being so high(and this is an "old" mechanic, give damage on target health), and that's a balance problem more than design problem

Brotha1 votes

I just want Jayce Hammer Q to be a non-target specific attack. Like Aatrox's knock up. All I ask in this age of high mobility champions. It's ridiculous that even if I dodge a Lee Sin Q then E+R away he can still catch up to me and force me into a fight I clearly am trying to escape from. That or increase his base movement speed to 345.

Edit: Lee can do that merely by abusing his base stats and running. He doesn't need to ward hop to close the gap.

LSA4 votes

I just want Jayce Hammer Q to be a non-target specific attack. Like Aatrox's knock up. All I ask in this age of high mobility champions. It's ridiculous that even if I dodge a Lee Sin Q then E+R away he can still catch up to me and force me into a fight I clearly am trying to escape from. That or increase his base movement speed to 345.

Edit: Lee can do that merely by abusing his base stats and running. He doesn't need to ward hop to close the gap.

Uh, fuck that? Jayce doesn't need buffs. He doesn't need to be relevant ever again. I don't want to see Jayce come back into competitive play or solo q. He's just another obnoxious poke/all in/disengage champ that this game does not need right now.

Crowley7231 votes

Its not buffing him its making it harder to land not a single target nuke lock on

LSA1 votes

Its not buffing him its making it harder to land not a single target nuke lock on

Are you stupid lol, letting Jayce use his Q untargeted would be a huge buff. That's like saying if Kat or Talon could use their e's without a target. Shit, better yet, lets give Mordekaiser an untargeted damaging gap closer since you want to give that to a champ who already has a lot of damage in his kit, plus utility Mordekaiser doesn't have.

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