@Meddler Isn't autofill completely opposed to what the new champion select was supposed to bring?

L0ve Is Blue·Dec 21, 2016·103 votes·3,763 views

Before the new champ select: You can't be sure you will get your role

After the new champ select: You are ensured to get 2 roles of your choice since people like having their best roles

and now: Fuck it we gon place you in random spot.

You guys at Riot are always talking about how fun is important but does anyone here seriously think playing 40 minute as a champion I don't like in a role I am not good is any fun? I would wait 10, 20 or even 30 minute (I'll have to wait 30 minute anyway because I WILL dodge if I get autofilled to a role I am bad) if that means I'll get my 2 chosen role because ranked is to WIN. I want to climb. I don't mind being placed in silver 5 after having played non stop for a year to get gold but dear lord give me a chance to at least be able to have a positive impact on my games.

97 Comments

ModAcademy KaynDec 21, 201610 votes

Before the new champ select: You can't be sure you will get your role

After the new champ select: You are ensured to get 2 roles of your choice since people like having their best roles

Now: You still have a chance to get your two best roles, but you may once every few games play a role you're not the best at.

Nothing is stopping you from telling the rest of your team "Hey, this isn't my best role, anyone up to trade?" or to adjust your playstyle in lane such as "Hey, I'm not the best at support, so mind if we don't go so aggro?".

Or, and I like this option the best, you could go learn how to support, and support every now and then, since playing Support will give you immunity to Autofill for a few games.

Velzard of KozDec 21, 20163 votes

Nothing is stopping you from telling the rest of your team "Hey, this isn't my best role, anyone up to trade?" or to adjust your playstyle in lane such as "Hey, I'm not the best at support, so mind if we don't go so aggro?".

And we live in ideal world where of course this doesn't work in 1 out of 10 cases. And only once cooperation with my ADC fully worked and they understood my noobness and even that was because the ADC was former Plat that got to my matchmaking because the matchmaking algorithm got drunk. And even they then left game because they got lagspike - but that's irrelevant to the system, just to note that this one is never lucky enough.

Or, and I like this option the best, you could go learn how to support, and support every now and then, since playing Support will give you immunity to Autofill for a few games.

Well since I think I'll have to play Support more frequently I'll get no other choice, but even If you play Support well, you can't carry out of the role that well. If you roam well, ward well, you are everywhere and give kills to all your teammates and become pain in ass without damage, that may be, but the only Support I managed it with so far was Vel'Koz and that's not exactly a fair choice.

Doctor IvelliusDec 21, 20163 votes

I went from Silver I to Plat 5 in 66 games last season. ~70% of those were on Support. I do understand people not wanting to play Support, but to say you can't carry is silly.

I will also note that it's because of people like you--people who don't want to Support--that queuing as Jungle / Support (I do consider myself a Jungle main) meant I played Support 75% of those times. And you know what? It's really not all that different from any other season; I'm essentially a Support main in ranked because I'm willing to play it for the good of the team, even though I play a lot more Jungle in normals.

Autofill being permanently enabled is a good choice and a response to how broken the system was last season for people who were willing to play Support at all, who have always been shoehorned into playing it most of the time.

Linna ExcelDec 21, 20168 votes

This is what happens when there aren't enough supports mains to go around.

VerdadeDec 21, 20166 votes

This is what happens when supports get systematically nerfed. Janna, Sona, Soraka, Kench being prime examples

TheOneTrueBrandDec 21, 20167 votes

They added it to reduce Que times, though ironically it's DRASTICALLY increased Que times.

I had to literally wait an hour to finally play yesterday, simply because of the nonstop dodging because people got a role they hate or cant play thanks to autofill.

Im about to stop playing draft at all, I honestly have a better chance in getting the role I want in blind now.

the Anarchit3chtDec 21, 20165 votes

So the problem isn't with the system, then, is it? Its with people dodging. Simple fix. Impose harsher penalties for dodging. It can even be coded where the penalties are harsher for dodging when you have been auto-filled.

Shuriman CuratorDec 21, 20166 votes

[{quoted}](name=the Anarchit3cht,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=cnGFNk2J,comment-id=00060000,timestamp=2016-12-21T05:38:24.514+0000)

So the problem isn't with the system, then, is it? Its with people dodging. Simple fix. Impose harsher penalties for dodging. It can even be coded where the penalties are harsher for dodging when you have been auto-filled.

The problem is autofill, not people dodging. Did you not read "I had to literally wait an hour to finally play yesterday, simply because of the nonstop dodging because people got a role they hate or cant play thanks to autofill."

If I primarily play top, secondary mid, why do I get thrown into a role i do not like playing? for a faster que time? To be honest I have not noticed any decreases in que times, but either have stayed the same or went up. I would rather wait to get the role I enjoy playing the most.

the Anarchit3chtDec 21, 20163 votes

No, see, that's where you're wrong. They dodged because they couldn't play one game in a role they didn't want. Riot could just as easily go back to pick order where you aren't gauranteed your two roles for 95% of your games. They dodged. If they didn't dodge, and sucked it up and played the damn role they got assigned to them, your queue time would not have been that long.

TheOneTrueBrandDec 21, 20166 votes

They dodged because autofill forced them into a role they did not want.

Let me ask you, how many times a day do you see something akin to "fucking autofill"? I see that every game now, and sometimes im the one saying it.

Why bother allowing you to select 2 roles to play if autofi just ignores that now anyways?

AnagsDec 22, 20161 votes

Okay so lets go back to the old way and people can still dodge because they didn't get their role. They just wouldn't be saying "fucking autofill".

So nothing is different. If they just increase the penalty for dodging games it wouldn't be an issue honestly.

TheOneTrueBrandDec 22, 20161 votes

The thing is back then pick order was the norm, it was accepted that if you were last you were most likely support or something you didn't want, it was a constant every game thing

Then new champ select was released and the norm shifted, instead of people hoping to get a high pick order, people KNEW they were 100% guaranteed one of 2 roles they selected. This was better, people were happy to wait a few extra minutes to be guaranteed to play something they would enjoy.

Then autofill was implemented, and I see the use for it, it would be good in normals, but getting randomly stuck into a role you dont enjoy or are not good at in RANKED, where you have to do your best to rank up, is completely backwards.

Back then people didnt dodge as much because it didnt matter, pick order was always there so you just accepted it. People dodge more due to autofill because of the RNG on it, it RANDOMLY happens and because of that random factor people feel cheated by autofill when it happens.

Hope that explains it well enough for you.

BlakiepugDec 22, 20163 votes

{quoted}

The problem is autofill, not people dodging. Did you not read "I had to literally wait an hour to finally play yesterday, simply because of the nonstop dodging because people got a role they hate or cant play thanks to autofill."

If I primarily play top, secondary mid, why do I get thrown into a role i do not like playing? for a faster que time? To be honest I have not noticed any decreases in que times, but either have stayed the same or went up. I would rather wait to get the role I enjoy playing the most.

Strangely enough, I main support and my queue times have actually gotten longer with autofill enabled. I used to find matches in 5 seconds or less but now it can take up to a full minute or two lol.

TheOneTrueBrandDec 21, 20165 votes

People are dodging BECAUSE of autofill, because they are being forced into a role they didnt want, and you want people to be punished more? That would only increase toxic behavior.

Imagine if you wanted to play baseball, but instead your parents forced you into ballet, then grounded you if you said you didn't want to do that. Anything seem wrong with that?

the Anarchit3chtDec 21, 20161 votes

That's a terrible analogy. Might I remind you, before role select you could get stuck with ANYTHING. This system, where you play like 1/10 games as a role you don't want is much better than the old system where you could go for MULTIPLE games without playing a role you are comfortable with.

TheOneTrueBrandDec 21, 20164 votes

Yes, and then they introduced the new champ select so you could pick your 2 most comfortable roles in ranked.

Then they did a full 180 and added autofill which can put you in any role again.

Autofill would be good for normals alone, but I think its a bad idea for ranked.

Colombo16Dec 21, 20167 votes

Basically gonna copy paste what I said in another thread : Oh get over it, everyone that complains about autofill at gold and lower just does it because it's the popular thing to do now. At that elo range, you'd get at most (and this is probably being extremely generous) autofilled once every 10 games. The autofill feature was meant to fix queue times at high dia+, the lower elos are barely affected by this. In my last 20 games, I've been autofilled maybe once or twice, so if you can't live having your main role 18/20 times, then just grow up.

Tentacle AdvisorDec 21, 20164 votes

Basically. I'm in Silver elo and I agree with this statement completely.

Ben SharpioDec 21, 20166 votes

Its so RNG it feels like. Enemy team can have no autofilled players while mine are. Doesnt feel right

Irelia BotDec 21, 20166 votes

Why did Riot add auto fill?

It is so they did not have to ditch selecting your desired positions all together.

Bottlenecking was the problem and auto fill is the solution to speed up queue times and allow players to get their desired positions more often then they otherwise likely would.

That is not to say it is perfect but Riot decided that making players sometimes have to fill positions every third game at most was better the having everyone wait 10+ minutes for a game to potentially happen due to shortages in some positions.

NineTailedMysticDec 21, 20164 votes

Might as well go all or nothing one way. Back to old champion select, or new champion select without Autofill.

Irelia BotDec 21, 20163 votes

But I like gettign top 10 out of 11 times while having my desired position being top primary and support secondary.

HazyCloud7Dec 21, 20168 votes

It is totally illogical to want to wait 1-2mins less in queue just to play your least favorite role in a game that will last ~20-50 minutes.

We don't need autofill in every single elo at all times in all queues, that's the bottom line.

Irelia BotDec 21, 20164 votes

I guess I am liking being able to put support as backup position again and not gettign it nearly every game.

HazyCloud7Dec 21, 20163 votes

Yep, people who play support secondary are the only beneficiaries of this system outside of really high elo, where queue times would simply be way too high without autofill.

I don't think autofill needs to go completely, I just think its too wide ranging right now.

Irelia BotDec 22, 20162 votes

This system actually allows people to have support as their secondary position and end up playing support less often their their primary.

That was a large part of the problem with the system in season 6. There was a huge shortage of support secondary players in season 6 because the system would bypass their primary position a majority of the time.

HazyCloud7Dec 22, 20163 votes

This system actually allows people to have support as their secondary position and end up playing support less often their their primary.

You are 100% correct, it does. But it comes at a huge expense: everybody else who doesn't play support ends up with a worse overall experience because they are essentially forced into playing a role they either don't like to play or simply can't play well. If you are in say ~Plat 5 as a jungle/top main, you simply aren't going to be able to play every other role at a plat 5 level because not everybody has enough time to practice every single role. it's a worse experience for adcs as well, because their lanes can now be decided by which of the supports was/wasn't autofilled.

Plus the huge increase in dodges more or less invalidates most of the decrease in queue times autofill provides. It's a neutral change for support mains (always get their role anyway), a great benefit for people who play support secondary, but worse for literally everybody else. Should be exclusive to Diamond+ imo & only enabled elsewhere during times of the day where there is very low activity.

Irelia BotDec 22, 20162 votes

No one expects everyone to play godly at all positions which is a reality everyone playing before season 6 knows about and got accustomed too. it is however going to end up as either something like what we have now or removing it all together like it was before season 6.

In season 5 more then half my games were top lane and about a quarter of them were support while about 20% were a mix of mid, jungle and a couple ADC games. I was completly fine with this since I was able to climb my way up to play with this system playing mainly the 2 positions I wanted to play. Currently I am at 10 in top and 1 in support for season 7 which I never would have seen happen in seasons 2 through 5.

This system is not going to make everyone happy especially if they are putting the 2 most popular positions at all times for their positions but it will get them one of their selected positions for at least 2 out of 3 games.

HazyCloud7Dec 22, 20163 votes

I see where you are coming from, I'm just adamant that autofill doesn't have to be integrated everywhere at all times but I suppose we will have to agree to disagree on that matter.

Thanks for sharing your thoughts so politely, nice to have a back forth discussion on this board for once that doesn't divulge into down-voting & personal attacks.

JackMcSnipeyzDec 21, 20166 votes

"I will gladly wait 30 minutes to play a role i want!" No, just shut up, you dont know what the fuck you're talking about.

People are complaining about 10 minutes que times, 30 minutes is 1/3 of a movie.

Autofill is the best solution (so far) to the bottlenecking problem of supports, i'd much rather actually PLAY a quick game in a role im less comfortable with, than wait 30 minutes just to start selecting (and even then some people dodge)

Autofill wasnt invented for no reason cause riot hates you, it was made to decrease que times.

Besides, if you play ranked and wanna actually get better, you should have basic knowledge in every role, thats bare minimum

NidkenDec 21, 20165 votes

Its a trade they had to make to support both queues.

General Esdeath Dec 21, 201614 votes

Then how about we drop the less popular. Also, I've had so many games where people pick support and get a different role and someone gets autofilled to support.

Soraka RulesDec 21, 20163 votes

o 3o;; that happened to me today :D I ended up somehow getting Mid and i queued for support

WolfeurDec 21, 20164 votes

If we drop the less popular, you will see a lot of threads VERY similar to what we got last season…

Gnart Even CloseDec 21, 20164 votes

the fact that that happens shows that there's problems with the algorithms right now. autofill shouldn't be forced if it can be worked around. and people should be able to choose a quick q mode where they get games faster and might autofill or slow q where they're guaranteed one of their roles

Mecha MaIphiteDec 21, 20165 votes

Well it's a step up from people spamming mid, pasting chat logs, and arguing whether to go by pick or call order.

Lux Is Mai WaifuDec 21, 20164 votes

This has been 5 years in the making. This cannot be fixed until Riot finds a way to bring their dumb esports-based balancing in line with what normal players want to do (example: no one wants to play support if they aren't getting paid).

Expect to see more shitbroken items added for supports until they are actually impactful at all levels of play like in DOTA and Overwatch.

Linna ExcelDec 21, 201613 votes

I'm not sure supports will ever be as useful as they are in overwatch partly because overwatch doesn't have to worry about levels, gold, or items.

Lux Is Mai WaifuDec 21, 20163 votes

Riot has been leveling all of those things out for the past few years.

NickssaaDec 21, 20164 votes

Ok, then why not strive to be like do... oh wait. Everything the support role has in dota was removed in league because its "anti-fun", but they somehow made the role less fun to play.

VerdadeDec 21, 20163 votes

Same for HotS, its very entertaining to play supports there.

NickssaaDec 21, 20161 votes

The thing with hots is that similar to Overwatch, the only scaling heroes get is levels, in which everyone levels up simultaneously, so its not a good comparison

VerdadeDec 22, 20162 votes

Supports in HOTS deal like 50% of carry's damage, not 5% like in LOL. Also their skills are much more "powerful". Not damage-wise but more specialized in utility.

Tyrande has Ashe's R+E combined (doesn't stun) as basic ability, Tassadar has 1.5s MS steroid that gives invisibility and invincibility... LOL has only few unique abilities, rest are just "shield, shield with AD, shield with MS, shield with Ar/MR etc.)

duckarpDec 21, 20164 votes

I would wait 10, 20 or even 30 minute

That's you. Majority of the playerbase can't afford that luxury. As you said it yourself, before the champ select you had to know every single role, now you're good with mastering just 2-3, yet people still complain. Autofill is a temporary solution to fight a bigger problem - huge shortage of support players. Once they fix that, they will remove autofill again.

SerBlaiseDec 21, 20164 votes

Your two picks are weighted more heavily as a priority, but you autofill because queue times are gated heavily by the least popular role. Suppose that one top and one mid enter the queue every 15 seconds. one jung and one adc enter the queue every 45 seconds. and one support enters the queue every 2 minutes. Your queue time is always two minutes, right? Wrong. Other tops, mids, and jungs entered the queue BEFORE you. they get the priority on that support. Let's say you enter as a mid around the 1 minute mark between supports entering the queue; you still have one minute left before another support enters the queue. **That means that there are FIVE (60s/15s) mids lined up to take the next FIVE supports. your queue time is now 5*2=10 minutes. **

That is why we need auto fill. It's a mathematical fact.

But wait, you may say, all we need is for rito to make supports more fun, right? Well, idk about you but I'm not switching from my two already-fun roles that I main just because riot makes another role MORE fun (which I agree they should do anyways). The queue times will not change drastically even if the support role is made better; people are already set in their current roles.

And for pete's sake, does no one remember back in the day when we had to actually CALL OUT OUR ROLE and if you weren't fast enough or your connection wasn't quick enough you didn't get the role you want? or maybe you did but 'pick order' overrode you?

L0ve Is BlueDec 21, 20162 votes

What if I don't mind waiting 10 minutes?

OwmyphasemuffinsDec 21, 20164 votes

As a casual player looking to play ranked this year due to more time, the truth is I don't have a whole lot of time to learn, or want to play different roles. I would drag the team down other than my 2 or 3 roles (top, jg, or mid) and I get autofilled as support often. I don't find support, or any other roles fun and I suck but mind you, I am busy as are many other players, 45 minutes is a time commitment I love to make to LOL as I enjoy it a lot, but I don't find those roles fun. Fact of the matter is, I will dodge queues if it means I can get in my 1-3 roles I want to play, or learn. I have no goal to be the best, but I just want to have fun with my limited time.

A game that has MUCH less of player base which is Heroes of the Storm can have 3-4 minute queues for team builder in casual, why can't LoL for learning and playing the roles you want? You're just demotivating, and detracting from the rest of the playerbase. If support is the least played, examine why it is- don't punish people who have limited time...games are to be fun at the end of the day with our time.

The Yetii RiderDec 22, 20164 votes

It's only RNG once every five games or so, and only for people who don't support as primary or secondary. That's vastly different than every game your role is decided by pick order.

Arsenic SulfurDec 21, 20163 votes

Bottlenecking is a bitch and this is the best system we'll get. No autofill=20+ Minute queue times AT BEST while there is still a chance to dodge. Riot can't fix support in a way to make people want to play them without making the role so overpowered that every other role is complete and utter shit.

Trias000Dec 21, 20163 votes

From what I read, they made your primary role more probable, but they had to compensate that with autofill. And that's great for me. Before, I wanted to play mid/support. But that would mean I'd never actually get mid. I don't know how it works now, because I switched to mid/jungle. But I get mid mostly, which I couldn't before. So autofill actually enabled me to play the role I want most of the time (!).