Is it that much to ask for Varus and Aatrox to be improved? Regardless how it's done...

BLIGHTBRINGER··19 votes·9,672 views

At this point I don't care what needs to be changed/removed/nerfed/buffed...

  • Let's start with Aatrox Aatrox , he is apparently supposed to be a "juggernaut" despite him having no HP scalling on his abilities, so he's forced to build full damage, him building full damage means he needs to do his combos fast otherwise he's going to die but his Q Animations are so slow that he just gets blown up before he can do anything.

  • Aatrox Main's have been calling out and asking for changes or just a revert at this point because of how unplayable he is.

  • Varus Varus follows a similar situation as Aatrox in terms of having a really slow combo based kit, he needs to basic attack enemies 3 times then use an ability, and do the same thing once more for his other ability while other champions can do a better job; faster, safer and more reliably. At this point he just feels like an Execution and R CC Bot.

  • I think he needs a small gameplay update/rework at the very best, because of how unreliable he can be most of the time and also be so punishing for just using abilities; for example Q Slows him during the channel and reduces total damage to 85% even if you just hit one target but if you hit 5 targets the total damage is reduced to 33%, and his E almost acts as a Self-Root.

Aatrox AATROX (Tier 4 Fighter based on OP.GG)

###TOP STATS Winrate: 47.3% Pickrate: 3.45% Banrate: 4.88%

###MID STATS Winrate: 48.35% Pickrate: 1.46% Banrate: 4.88%

###JNG STATS Winrate: 42.62% Pickrate: 0.78% Banrate: 4.88%

Varus VARUS (Tier 5 Marksman based on OP.GG)

###ADC STATS Winrate: 47.88% Pickrate: 2.42% Banrate: 0.21%

26 Comments

Hayaishi29 votes

Their destiny is to stay gutted until they are reworked. Poor Aatrox, gets reworked because he is unhealthy and then Riot guts the rework even harder that his pre rework version.

Zeromatsu1 votes

This is intended I suppose. Anyone with a little bit thought can see how kits like Aatrox can't work.

They did the same with Akali Galio IreliaRengar Mordekaiser Malzahar and probably some others.

Kayle will be next.

karolmo1 votes

Galio and Irelia still see top-tier play tho...

Vlada Cut1 votes

{quoted}

This is intended I suppose. Anyone with a little bit thought can see how kits like Aatrox can't work.

They did the same with Akali Galio IreliaRengar Mordekaiser Malzahar and probably some others.

Kayle will be next.

NOPE. Kayle has justified weak pre-lvl 6 early. At least they hotfixed her W and E castings tho. I DON'T CARE ABIUT THE NERFES THOSE TWO DELAYS WERE HER REAL WEAKNESS.

Hayaishi21 votes

{quoted}

This is intended I suppose. Anyone with a little bit thought can see how kits like Aatrox can't work.

They did the same with Akali Galio IreliaRengar Mordekaiser Malzahar and probably some others.

Kayle will be next.

Well if it is supposed to be like this then Riot is a garbage company.

The only ones that suffer from Aatrox being garbage tier are his mains. Pro players will just move on but the hardcore Aatrox players are the ones paying the price for Riot's lack of foresight

omnicron0071 votes

{quoted}

Their destiny is to stay gutted until they are reworked. Poor Aatrox, gets reworked because he is unhealthy and then Riot guts the rework even harder that his pre rework version.

Unfortunately Aatrox was the victim of Riot experimentation. His rework makes no sense given his original iteration. Why not just create a new champion with his reworked kit? He should have stayed as a mid game diver that uses auto attacks.

KidnapperMorde1 votes

{quoted}

Their destiny is to stay gutted until they are reworked. Poor Aatrox, gets reworked because he is unhealthy and then Riot~~ guts the rework even harder that his pre rework version.~~

Makes the rework just as unhealthy

feintfiend3 votes

Aatrox is an absolute mess atm. Riot told us to wait a month for buffs than pulled back on them last second LMAO. Balance team only cares about what sells, that's why Riven will be left untouched at least until her new skin comes out.

ModAcademy Kayn2 votes

When you say "HP Scaling on abilities" do you mean like, %percent health or current health damage, or do you mean "More HP, more damage on ability"? Cause like, I'm pretty sure no juggernaut has that kind of scaling on their abilities. Maybe Skarner, but he's a mess.

Moody P4 votes

Most juggernauts have health scaling through defense like missing HP healing or shields

Aatrox isn't really incentivised to buy health at all

Warlord Rhinark1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Moody P,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c1QrYGg2,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-03-20T02:45:09.569+0000)

Most juggernauts have health scaling through defense like missing HP healing or shields

Aatrox isn't really incentivised to buy health at all

They could give his E passive healing or his Blood Well a scaling.

His E passive healing currently only goes from 20 - 30%, and his Blood Well only goes from 15 - 50%, but they could add something like "+1% per 100 Bonus Health" to both of them.

That way, he can either choose to go AD to cause massive amounts of damage, or go Tank to become a giant meatshield.

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Academy Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c1QrYGg2,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-03-20T01:43:25.409+0000)

When you say "HP Scaling on abilities" do you mean like, %percent health or current health damage, or do you mean "More HP, more damage on ability"? Cause like, I'm pretty sure no juggernaut has that kind of scaling on their abilities. Maybe Skarner, but he's a mess.

My bad I meant that he has no abilities aside from his Passive that scales with Health.

His Healing for instance should scale with his % Max HP and when he uses his E for the next few seconds it should heal him for increased % Missing Health.

I don't know, this is sort of what I had in mind when I said "HP scalling on Abilities".

Daddy Ants1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Academy Kayn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c1QrYGg2,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-03-20T01:43:25.409+0000)

When you say "HP Scaling on abilities" do you mean like, %percent health or current health damage, or do you mean "More HP, more damage on ability"? Cause like, I'm pretty sure no juggernaut has that kind of scaling on their abilities. Maybe Skarner, but he's a mess.

That opens up a Tank Aatrox build if he has % max hp healing.

Please no.

pogcorn2 votes

A D C A S T E R S A R E E A S I E R T O B A L A N C E

DarkTree11 votes

bUt ThE pRo PlAyErS

actual answer: aatrox will be p/b in pro play if he is good and will still be pretty popular if he's playable and riot needs the lcs$bigbux so y'know

i have no idea what the issue with varus is. he's an immobile adc with alright-but-not-the-best damage, pretty bad self-peel (his only real peel is the root on his ult, and his e's slow is a meme) and is generally really squishy, which isn't top tier in this meta. i think they're just planning to VGU him later down the line but i can't be entirely sure. he's just in the trashcan for now, maybe they're keeping him there because he's somewhat oppressive in aram/arurf? who can tell

Hayaishi21 votes

{quoted}

bUt ThE pRo PlAyErS

actual answer: aatrox will be p/b in pro play if he is good and will still be pretty popular if he's playable and riot needs the lcs$bigbux so y'know

i have no idea what the issue with varus is. he's an immobile adc with alright-but-not-the-best damage, pretty bad self-peel (his only real peel is the root on his ult, and his e's slow is a meme) and is generally really squishy, which isn't top tier in this meta. i think they're just planning to VGU him later down the line but i can't be entirely sure. he's just in the trashcan for now, maybe they're keeping him there because he's somewhat oppressive in aram/arurf? who can tell

Because Varus has been a very relevant pick in the LCS during the past two seasons i think, so they are tired of seeing him there, so i guess their issue is that he is an excellent pick in a highly coordinated environment.

BLIGHTBRINGER1 votes

{quoted}

bUt ThE pRo PlAyErS

actual answer: aatrox will be p/b in pro play if he is good and will still be pretty popular if he's playable and riot needs the lcs$bigbux so y'know

i have no idea what the issue with varus is. he's an immobile adc with alright-but-not-the-best damage, pretty bad self-peel (his only real peel is the root on his ult, and his e's slow is a meme) and is generally really squishy, which isn't top tier in this meta. i think they're just planning to VGU him later down the line but i can't be entirely sure. he's just in the trashcan for now, maybe they're keeping him there because he's somewhat oppressive in aram/arurf? who can tell

For Varus, I never understood... Why create him around the idea of being an AD Caster and also give him things like the Blight Effect, Unreliable Debuffs (Grievous Wounds), CC?

I never really wanted him to be an AD Caster because his Q is his weakest ability without the W Active and here's why...

Explain this to me..

Why is Varus punished for hitting one champion with his Q? (If he hits one Champion he will only deal 85% of the total damage). Now this damage reducement only makes sense if he hits multiple enemies (and if he hits 5 targets the last hit target will only take 33% of the total damage) but if you only hit one champion your damage will never actually be the one that you're suppose to deal.

Not only this but he also Slows himself by 20% meaning enemies can run out of range or dodge his Arrow due to it's relatively Slow Animation.

Similar abilities have less punishment; Sivir Q (has no damage reducement for multiple units being hit), Caitlyn Q (any other units hit after the first one will only take 66% of the total damage).

Saianna1 votes

Varus, at first, wasn't designed to be yet another ADC. It's something players wanted. He used to be more about poke and combo killing. Like old nidalee.

Aatrox rework is the work of Riot Jag, the man that's about to cripple teemo with rework. So yea.. I doubt he cares about our opinions.

OtakuBurrito1 votes

Don't remind me. Riot hates my Darkin boys so much...

[sg-soraka]

Who could hate a face this cute

http://www.lol-wallpapers.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Aatrox-Rework-by-Abakura-HD-Wallpaper-Background-Fan-Art-Artwork-League-of-Legends-lol.jpg

Z3Sleeper2 votes

Woah dats pretty cute.

BLIGHTBRINGER2 votes

{quoted}

Don't remind me. Riot hates my Darkin boys so much...

[sg-soraka]

Who could hate a face this cute

http://www.lol-wallpapers.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/06/Aatrox-Rework-by-Abakura-HD-Wallpaper-Background-Fan-Art-Artwork-League-of-Legends-lol.jpg

Beautiful <3

Z3Sleeper1 votes

For Varus, you don't exactly need to get 3 stacks between every ability. It's more that it's an option.

For instance, they could increase the stacks to infinite and I'm sure noone would complain that "it's impossible to infinitely stack basic attacks on enemies before I cast an ability".

Varus is actually a really cool design for that reason, he has options that you can make use of on any build but only partially if you don't invest in it.

AD/Crit Varus just likes to full charge Q and E people and basic attack whenever possible. AS/AP Varus likes to go for max stacks before using abilities at all (other than ult) and typically just uses quick cast Q to proc his stacked W.

Why he's underperfoming though? I have no clue. It's most likely a numbers issue, as it always is with ADC (ADC with highest numbers = meta since they're so homogenized). Rarely is this not the case.

Abibyama II1 votes

Within two months Varus will be meta

SaTkE1 votes

It was mentioned in similar thread before that Aatrox's main problem comes from having only 1 dmg dealing ability while being a melee AD caster. If you don't hit your Q you are useless. What I find annoying is that they removed his second dash, even though his Q is slow and was made with two dashes in mind. Now it is almost impossible to hit his full combo unless the enemy is stupid, busy fighting someone else or CC'd already.

PS. Did his W get nerfed? I noticed in recent games that a lot of top laners I played against were able to leave its zone by running opposite of me (the longest way) without any boots when I hit them with Rank 1 W.

Vlada Cut1 votes

As an Aatrox Main I agree. Revert the nerfs and give us Charged Dashes back. Or, Have his E on a 2 second CD at max 5 Rank 40% CDR, causenright now with those stats it's 3 Secknds which is longer than his Q recast time(meaning you can't Q1 E Q2 E anymore)

joywhodidthisjoy1 votes

Some champions are hard to balance Akali - She's either op or garbage Azir - Nobody wants to see him op again! Irelia - She's getting there, but in low elo she's still garbage Yasuo - No changing my mind he's op and a pain in the ass as a veigar main. Ezreal - This mans is weird because from iron-gold he's garbage but plat-challenger I've heard he's good Aatrox - yeaaaaaah they akali'd him

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