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Swain or is it AP?

Bultz··1 votes·833 views

Okay so recently i was playing a game in the rift against a Swain. i was winning my lane pretty early, I hadn't lost a game in many many games. i had a higher cs, he was running to turret and getting no cs or anything. So the game went on and I reached level 6 and eventually he did as well. i beat him back and he was near dead, but before i could go in for the kill he ran and went back to base. he came back and had only purchased one item. i was like okay thats fine. I have pure magic resist runes.

With almost no life he comes up to me at my turret as i waited for minions. He throws a stun at me and it hits. then he fires his laser and it did so much damage that all he did was ignite and got a kill off of me. without any effort skill or anything. After that our tank went mid to just hold it, i came back and just as Nautilus was about to leave swain, without having any more items did what he did to me and killed a pretty feed tank without effort. He had one item which is common after returning to base. and this went on for the remainder of the match. His laser is unblockable. Its not attached to him so attacking him won't stop it. All he has to do is stun you, laser, and if he ults he can heal too. Like why not just give him a one hit gun and get it over with.

No matter how much magic resist i had it was never enough. or that my runes were pure resist runes. or anything. i got destroyed so easily.

I feel that ap champs are way too overkill with how much damage they can do. One all they do is stand and fire. so for them to have that much damage is ridiculous. you have items that have 120 ability points. Thats crazy. the highest ad is like 85. and for those who ad, their mostly close range. so going against a Swain or malzahar is just stupid unless you are feed. They can stun, they can be far away, and they can do massive damage. I think it is all too much.

You don't see a Yasuo or almost all ads do any type of damage till late game. I don't include long range ad's in this since they have range and all they need is speed, but for a yasuo type champ i think it too much, or for that matter any champ.

Either Swain needs a huge nerf, or ap items do, cause that's ridiculous to me that he had barely any cs and just shut me down without trying. Tell me what you guys thinks.

10 Comments

RIP Tahm Kench2 votes

So some math:

If we assume a high ap amount for level 6 of 100 (50 from runes + 50 from items (most of swain's early gold goes to mana regen)) Maxing Q:

165+90 + 80+70 + 75+80 = 530 magic damage * 8% = 572 magic damage

Maxing W:

75+90 + 160+70 + 75+80 = 550 magic damage * 8% = 574 magic damage

Maxing E:

75+90 + 80+70 + 155+80 = 500 magic damage * 14% = 570 magic damage

Something's not adding up here. There's no way to fudge these numbers to make them do 1000 damage, can you try it?

BeatzBoyFTW2 votes

He probably just stood directly in his face and gets himself free hit while not moving/dodging at all.

BIG ANIME THIGHS2 votes

The more likely candidate is that swain came back with catalyst and fought on his level 6 power spike, thus killing OP.

I will agree that Swain's level 6 power spike is frustrating, but that is just how the game works.

Stiv12341 votes

Maxing W does the most damage? My whole life was a lie...

Luner Hunter1 votes

Lets look at how AD scales vs AP though:

AD is ALWAYS a 1:1 ratio on basic attacks

AP is anywhere from a 1:0.1-1.4(only cuz of ekko's op ult ratios) but most of the time they are around 1:0.5-0.8 PER SPELL THAT HAS CD's AND MANA COSTS

Basically AD's scale infinitely better than AP's do. You have a 1.0 atk speed? got 200+ AD? AND ABILITIES? You've already out scaled your AP counterpart. Now AP Mages do have good burst but then they have to wait at the least 8 seconds late game (without some sort of refund mechanic) to rattle off spells again where as the more Atk Spd you build the more you get to apply your dmg 1 atk per sec up to 2.5 atks per second.... I fail to see your issue with how Mages scale o_o

DisasterSola1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Luner Hunter,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afEbZ89V,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-06-13T09:23:56.352+0000)

Lets look at how AD scales vs AP though:

AD is ALWAYS a 1:1 ratio on basic attacks

AP is anywhere from a 1:0.1-1.4(only cuz of ekko's op ult ratios) but most of the time they are around 1:0.5-0.8 PER SPELL THAT HAS CD's AND MANA COSTS

Basically AD's scale infinitely better than AP's do. You have a 1.0 atk speed? got 200+ AD? AND ABILITIES? You've already out scaled your AP counterpart. Now AP Mages do have good burst but then they have to wait at the least 8 seconds late game (without some sort of refund mechanic) to rattle off spells again where as the more Atk Spd you build the more you get to apply your dmg 1 atk per sec up to 2.5 atks per second.... I fail to see your issue with how Mages scale o_o

I did the math for AD vs AP by the way. At full build, a 100% crit chancebuild (Shiv, trinity, PD, IE, IE, boots) will have above 1.5 asp and something like 350AD. the overall damage in ten seconds is the same, but mages have downtime AND counterplay. ADs just have to point and click.

Luner Hunter1 votes

that'd be my point... he's crying that "ap mages op" but they have more counterplay than AD ANYTHING

ExiledTyrant1 votes

It's not actually AP vs magic resistance here. It's the fact that certain champions have one or multiple power spikes through the game that set them on a tier all their own during the match. For instance Mordekaiser hits a power spike at 3, 5, and 6 with him leveling out between 11, and 16 onwards where he shines late game. I find Swain to be similar. They are made to crush at these levels and it comes down to an opponent outplaying the person or playing it safe if they can't fight back. Reducing an opponents damage by 3-5 early game isn't going to have a large impact if they come with good base damage like Swain has especially if your champion isn't meant to be built tank.

MLDzXnRRR1 votes

Swain is weak to kiting... don't go 1v1 him with melee - you will need the removed Executioner's Calling and high burst and sustained dmg to kill Swain.

Hinro Honato1 votes

you have items that have 120 ability points. Thats crazy. the highest ad is like 85. AD Also has something ap doesn't. The ability to crit. Two items and you can far out dps 90% of the ap people. ad also starts with flat stats while you must get ap runes/masteries/items to have any.

Melee vs ranged always sucks but ap vs ad isn't as clear cut as three items have 120 ap on them so ap wins. You can crit far more often than I can use skills on an ap champion.

Don't people say master yi is broken because crits let him outdamage most champions in the game?

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