Imagine a Jinx with ravenous Hydra, and Hurricane on top of infinity edge and phantom dancer

Irelia Bot·Feb 12, 2017·6 votes·689 views

And the AoE of hydra worked on ranged autos.

If you can justify hydra being melee only you can justify making other items melee only due to abuse cases.

17 Comments

CancerBasedGodFeb 12, 20173 votes

Hydra can't be justified mainly because of how broken it would be with hurricane... And that's not even close to in the same league as pen.

Also your argument is just terrible Fotm outrage...

Irelia BotFeb 12, 20173 votes

{quoted}

Hydra can't be justified mainly because of how broken it would be with hurricane... And that's not even close to in the same league as pen.

Also your argument is just terrible Fotm outrage...

So you admit there are cases where making an item effect melee only is a really good idea.

reaperteaserFeb 12, 20172 votes

and cases where making an item ranged only is a good idea, owever lethality/penetration isnt a serious case of abuse like hydra/hurricane could have been

Irelia BotFeb 12, 20172 votes

I am not even naming any items but you seem to be trying to defend an item.

Is it proving to be too good at something?

GibberwattFeb 12, 20172 votes

reamer isn't trying to defend a specific item. He is simply trying to tell you that an entire stat shouldn't be limited to melee/ranged. That's like saying only ranged people can purchase crit - Imagine how sad yasuo's everywhere would be

WittIe GuppyFeb 12, 20171 votes

no more double crit chance? i honestly think a lot of the community would rejoice and celebrate in the streets at such great news.

reaperteaserFeb 12, 20172 votes

there are some balancing issues, dont get me wrong. im just saying that lethality was designed with both ranged and melee in mind. riot is getting closer to their goal, its currently much better than the flat penetration it used to be, thats certain.

edit: also, you were the first to name specific items in the original post...

CancerBasedGodFeb 12, 20171 votes

It's clearly implied... You're not fucking clever, and you didn't out smart anyone.

CancerBasedGodFeb 12, 20171 votes

No I do not agree with your bs argument. This is just a false equivalency.

Irelia BotFeb 12, 20173 votes

So you are saying Hydra's AoE should be on ranged?

Double standards are interesting.

CancerBasedGodFeb 12, 20171 votes

Nope. What I'm saying is you're bad at this. Failed "gotchya" questions every post, no real argument besides whining that hydra isn't available on ranged... Which is not really an argument at all. Lethality is not hydra. They're not the same god damn thing. What you're saying here is more like suggesting ranged characters can't build AD, and why? Why shouldn't they be allowed simple flat stats like everyone else? Because you're butt hurt and mad you're in bronze.

ParoeFeb 12, 20171 votes

{quoted}

Nope. What I'm saying is you're bad at this. Failed "gotchya" questions every post, no real argument besides whining that hydra isn't available on ranged... Which is not really an argument at all. Lethality is not hydra. They're not the same god damn thing. What you're saying here is more like suggesting ranged characters can't build AD, and why? Why shouldn't they be allowed simple flat stats like everyone else? Because you're butt hurt and mad you're in bronze.

... The argument here is that lethality is a powerful thing which is intended for melee champions so that they could effectively deal with squishies. Marksman can much more easily utilize lethality however because of their raw synergy with attack speed and their very safe ranges.

Imagine ANY marksman with hydra. They would be able to clear waves with a single basic attack without a shiv crit... The simple fact of the matter is that ranged vs melee is a very real disparity; range is bar none the most powerful safety tool in the game, and AD ranged champions have the strongest itemization and pool of items to pick from... they litterally have a roster of items catered to them, and synergy with just about every item intended for melee champions as well.

Theres also the fact lethality is an early game stat that scales to the late game pretty well, and marksman are supposed to be almost exclusively lategame champions.

ValyrianBladeFeb 12, 20172 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=aGKW6TsU,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2017-02-12T07:31:48.706+0000)

So you admit there are cases where making an item effect melee only is a really good idea.

Hydra and Hurricane are basically equivalent items that were separated between melee and ranged.

Hydra was better for melee because the active would allow extra burst immediately around yourself - it's really rather pointless for ranged. Likewise hurricane was better for ranged because the splash is centered on what you hit, rather than where you are.

They're melee only ranged only because their stacking would be pretty nuts (probably more-so on melees because of the aforementioned argument, hydra really wouldn't help ranged as having aoe damage around yourself isn't helping when no one is there).

They could make hydra and hurricane share the same unique name and they wouldn't need to be melee only and ranged only.

The only benefit Ravenous offers over hurricane is lifesteal. Basically it would give ADCs lifesteal instead of crit on their aoe item. Which would benefit SOME adcs but overall wouldn't be oppressive. It would moreso just promote boring gameplay. It's the same reason they change Bloodthirster so that ADCs rushed IE instead. Not because it was necessarily broken (albeit strong), but because it promoted boring gameplay as that much lifesteal that early in a ranged lane basically means you can't get kills 2v2.

WittIe GuppyFeb 12, 20171 votes

im lost... what is this argument?

Irelia BotFeb 12, 20172 votes

The argument is that there are times when making an item melee or ranged only is within reason.