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How to fix high ELO ARAM

Dr Poro··85 votes·5,155 views

When you play ARAM and have 50+ wins more than losses, you will never see a team with less than 3 OP champions because

  1. half the players at this ELO have an account that contains only OP aram champions. They use reroll whenever they get one of the bad free week champs
  2. When they're out of rerolls and stuck with a bad champ/team, they simply dodge and wait 30 minutes or hop to another ARAM account. This also makes waiting for a game a lot longer.

Solution:

  1. Make ARAM actually random by using the entire champion pool, not just the available one.
  2. Punish dodges on aram more severely. If you dodge on an ARAM, disable ARAM for that player for 30 minutes or an hour at for the first time and escalating towards a day or even a week when they keep dodging. They may still play other game modes as they please, as long as they don't dodge in those (but I haven't experienced as much dodges in SR or TT). Have a similar punishment (longer game-type specific restriction) for rotating game modes as I've noticed more dodges in these as well.

86 Comments

AMYS GRAVE21 votes

I've never heard the phrase high ELO ARAM before, but i approve.

Dr Poro15 votes

It's when you queue up for ARAM and the queue takes at least 5 minutes.

AMYS GRAVE3 votes

Yeah, i know those feels. I have ~600 wins and ~550 losses owning all but two champs right now. (Elise and Jayce)

bill845 votes

You are missing out on playing jayce, the second greatest champ in the game (behind Galio of course).

Dr Poro7 votes

Atm Sona es numero uno.

Newerthian1 votes

What makes Jayce great in ARAM?

I took a look at the OP ARAM champs and I can understand why most of them fit that category. So what makes Jayce so great?

bill842 votes

Oh I was just talking about greatest champs in general (according to me), but it's mostly his massive poke although he can also blow people up quickly and then get out before taking much damage himself.

cocacolalips4 votes

https://na.whatismymmr.com/sixdogman

1300 MMR is not really high elo though.

XIII Vanitas6 votes

To be precise, it's not high ELO, it's high MMR.

Silver Singed1 votes

It's not high either... It's fairly low.

XIII Vanitas16 votes

I have 200 wins more than losses and I strongly agree with you.

Let's make ARAM truly random by enabling all champions, doesn't matter if bought or not.

cocacolalips1 votes

That solution isn't good because

  1. that doesn't address the issue, some champions are still significantly better than some others (up to twice the win rate!), and most games will still be stomps.

  2. unlocking the entire pool of champions to everyone has more negative repercussions than positive ones, you will alienate the entire playerbase, more dodges, more afks, more ragequits, more stomps, more unenjoyable games and less money for Riot.

Dr Poro4 votes

ARAM is for people who want to play any champion. If you only want to play a select few, you play in SR or TT. A lot of people want to try out new champions but they can only play the few that are free this week. ARAM would allow to get to know more champions but without being able to spam them. If they like a new champion, they might feel like buying them so they can play them again. I don't think this will cause Riot to lose out on RP purchases. People don't buy many champions for ARAM. The top 20 champs that are worth buying are easily paid with IP.

HaloDragonX7 votes

TLDR; add in ranked ARAM

blkKalameet6 votes

i just say make the whole champ pool available for aram.

new players will be able to test champions out that way and be more likely to by them when they get one they like

Dr Poro5 votes

That's my first point.

PaladinNO3 votes

When they're out of rerolls and stuck with a bad champ/team, they simply dodge and wait 30 minutes or hop to another ARAM account.

I know people can reduce themselves to dodge if they are too useless to handle a random champion (which is the spirit of the game mode), but seriously? What do even people get out of ARAM-only accounts? I've heard of this before, but I still find it hard to believe. Riot, please ban these ARAM dodgers - if they don't want to play, then they're just a waste of server space anyway...

Punish dodges on aram more severely. If you dodge on an ARAM, disable ARAM for that player for 1 day. If they keep dodging, extend it to a week. Have the same punishments for temporary game modes.

http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/seal-of-approval2.gif

Imagine all these kids who will come crying after they've recevied a week ban when U.R.F. is on? I LOVE IT! xD

Dr Poro2 votes

The restriction would be game mode specific. If you dodge aram, you could still play urf.

PaladinNO2 votes

Have the same punishments for temporary game modes.

Yep, just like you said, and which I quoted specifically.

LatetotheRace1 votes

You're not reading it correctly. There would be similar punishments for Random game modes and ARAM but not at the same time. This is pretty obviously stating that there will be a very similar system for both queues while not overlapping in any way.

PaladinNO2 votes

That was what I meant. Was a rush-post, so I didn't take the time to make checks and rechecks to be sure my phrasing was abuntantly clear about it.

Dodge ARAM twice, be banned from ARAM queue - dodge twice in any RGM queue, be banned from that particular game-mode (for 2 weeks).

LatetotheRace1 votes

I think it was pretty obviously implied, I see no real problem with how he wrote it.

PaladinNO3 votes

I didn't imply there was a problem - I just wanted to emphasize the parts I particularly agreed with. :|

Dr Poro1 votes

Okay I just misunderstood you. Perhaps the ban I initially suggested was a bit overkill. Anyways, I think it would be justified if you would get a message: "the next time you dodge, it will be X time penality". You should know in advance that the punishment is severe which will leave less people surprised and will have an even greater impact on the frequency of dodges happening (if X is great enough).

PaladinNO4 votes

As an avid ARAM player myself, I don't find any dodge penalty to be too strong.

I have had something like this in mind:

  • Dodge once, nothing (in case of unexpected events - it does or will happen to us all).
  • Dodge twice (within a set amount of time - like 1 month), a day ban (from that particular queue).
  • Dodge 3 times, a week ban.
  • Dodge 4 times, a month ban.
Tobias Brackner3 votes

Holy shit

Are people concerned about the balance on ARAM????

ARAM??????

IT STANDS FOR ALL RANDOM ALL MID

I Like Things 5 votes

You're 100% right, it does stand for all random, all mid.

The problem is not every account has all the champions unlocked (like mine for example) - and I hold this +50 win to loss ratio in ARAM that the Original Post referenced as its starting point.

That aside, if it to literally be all random, all mid - there's no logical reason why the game mode itself shouldn't draw from the entire champion pool for all participants, regardless of how many champions they personally own.

Dr Poro4 votes

Not necessarily the balance. If everyone does this, you still have an equal chance of winning. However, the current problem is twofold:

  1. Less fun because you keep seeing the same champions over and over.
  2. Less fun because you need to wait 3 times as long because people dodge all the time.
Tobias Brackner1 votes

I don't know how 1. happens due to the R in ARAM

As for 2. then it sounds like the solution should be to punish dodging, huh?

Edge of Daybreak4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tobias Brackner,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZooYvGcm,comment-id=000900020000,timestamp=2016-07-24T01:05:21.140+0000)

I don't know how 1. happens due to the R in ARAM

As for 2. then it sounds like the solution should be to punish dodging, huh?

It's not that it's not random it's that you can heavily influence what champions you get which shouldn't be a thing. Give a guy a 6 sided dice and telling him to roll 1 or 2 and that seems fair. Until you give the other guy a D 100 and tell him to do the same. Originally ARAM was that. Random as hell and you saw tons of diversity. Now with aram accounts flooding the high elo of aram you more or less see the exact same things with little variance. It doesn't need to be fair to function but for the sake of fun it should be. I don't feel like sitting through 7+ dodges because if we don't have 1 or 2 of the broken champions on our team then we instantly know the enemy team is stacked with them so someone dodges just to not have to deal with that. It's easy to tell which accounts are aram only accounts too.

Tobias Brackner1 votes

Sounds like the solution is to make ARAM elo free and then punishing dodgers.

Edge of Daybreak3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tobias Brackner,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZooYvGcm,comment-id=00090002000000000000,timestamp=2016-07-24T01:26:24.473+0000)

Sounds like the solution is to make ARAM elo free and then punishing dodgers.

(holy shit my aram queue just popped after 6 minutes)

MMR free wouldn't solve the problem of aram only accounts and dodging due to aram accounts. Plus to take mmr out would make matches even more stompy. Then other issues like people just not bothering to play if the teams are clearly stacked. just had a 14 minute game cause no one wanted to fight xerath jayce velkoz when we have no way of dealing with that. Most games are like this too.

We fix one problem and we potentially solve 3-4 and it all begins with dealing with aram only accounts.

Tobias Brackner1 votes

Actually it might be better to allow drop-in ARAM

Just throw all semblence of strategy to the wind and allow players to join mid-match.

DarkRitual4 votes

None of your comments/suggestions are helping to solve the main problem being discussed. Are you a politician?

Tobias Brackner1 votes

But it is a solution.

The problem is people dropping out when they don't get their OP pick

So let them tire themselves out and not screw over teams who get a drop by allowing people to drop in midgame.

Also get rid of ELO entirely in ARAM, sometimes you get curb stomps but that'll be important for learning.

La Barbotte2 votes

its not real league of legends, its a minigame, they dont need to fix it its already good that it isnt a rotating gamemode

Dr Poro14 votes

That's the problem with the road Riot seems to be taking. "It's not summoner's rift so we don't care." League of Legends is actually a lot more than just SR. SR isn't the map of perfection created by the holiness itself. A lot of people find SR too big of a map and boring when you lose the game because of something happening at the other side of the map in a stage where you couldn't have left your lane yet. It's a mistake to completely remove dominion. Perhaps it should've been on for a limited time per day like ranked 5v5 but this removal was a big middle finger to a lot of players who enjoyed it.

I would love to see competitive play in some of the "fun modes". URF and Nexus siege in particular would be very nice fast paced games to watch at a high level. They shouldn't be played as often as SR because the meta would become too stale indeed, but having organized 5v5 in other maps than SR would be nice to watch.

League of Legends should expand. Towards more maps and game modes. Not shrink into just one.

balbraaksel2 votes

I strongly disagree with point 2, that's a punishment you want for those few that account hop and wouldn't be logical because then you can say the same for account bans and dodges on other gamemodes, so then an account ban for a week for example should become a month because you can account hop? Completely illogical.

Dr Poro3 votes

In other game modes you'd want more than 30 champions for a finished account. Also, the issue isn't just with those few with multiple accounts. People dodge because they can just wait 30 minutes and try again, playing another game or watch a show in the meanwhile. If the punishment is severe, people won't intentionally break the rules. Going afk from the start should be punished even harder.

balbraaksel2 votes

But with punishments you can't expect Riot to consider account hopping for more severe punishments. Also of course players do something in the time they aren't able to queue up, the punishment is just that you can't play league of 30 minutes, nothing more, it doesn't matter what they do in that time.

Dr Poro4 votes

Just forget about the hoppping. 30 minutes is way too low for dodging queue. You can say that by the fact that you generally have to enter champion select multiple times before finally being able to enter the game. People obviously don't care about the punishment and prefer to screw 9 other players instead.

balbraaksel2 votes

What I'm personally guilty of is close before I go to sleep I queue up and if I don't get a good champion I'll dodge. I sleep during the penalty then anyway. If I dodge it usually is just a penalty of 6 minutes though, I've never had 15 minutes or longer.

I get what you mean but dodging happens on both sides of the team, sometimes you have good champions and the enemy dodges and the other time it's the other way around, balancing out eachother just like trolls in ranked.

I do wanna say that I agree with that in ARAM all champions should be randomly chosen from, I have all champions and about 35 matches won more than lost (over 3k ARAM matches played by the way) but I begin to notice more and more how unbalanced things are, good champions are fairly rare for me to get. I can play a lot of champions decently or even really well though and I know how to itemize correctly so I can manage, but still, if things were truly random I might would win even more often.

Dr Poro2 votes

The occasional dodge is not that big of a deal. My suggestion of 1 day restriction on the first dodge is a probably a bit overkill. It should maybe start with half an hour and go up to 1 day or 3 day restriction if you dodge multiple times in like the last 10 games you've played.

The exact implications is something that Riot will decide as they have better numbers than I have. The core of my thread is that the punishment should be longer since it's abused too much right now.

Scramrail2 votes

Instead of such severe dodge punishments, just design the system to remember what champion the dodger was given in ARAM when they left, and force them to always get that champion until they complete an ARAM with it. GG dodging accomplishes nothing in ARAM now!

3lancer2 votes

Yep playing against people with 2k aram wins isn't very fun.

Psi211 votes

And why the hell would a fresh new level 30 ever want to get all the new champs when we have a broken Dynamic Queue in Ranked and there is an agreement by the entire community that rank is no longer a measure of skill?

You know why Rioters aren't moving forward with this after they said months ago they would need to discuss it? Simply because of the cash they would lose out on from those smurf accounts buying only their favorite and ever changing champs with Riot points.

Or worse because of the state of Dynamic queue get to 30 and play ARAM all day never once buying a new champs because fools like the ones in this post are asking for all the champ for free. And Hey... At least ARAM is fun and challenging compared to Summoner's Rift's slow as-s pace.

Praetor Notorias2 votes

Back when I played a lot of ARAM, I used a lot of skin boosts. It's a small amount of money, like 50 cents or a dollar. From what I've seen in other areas like music and mobile apps, the 99 cent transaction seems to be quite effective at raising money. So the logic here of they don't get their money seems lost and broken to me.

Psi211 votes

[{quoted}](name=Praetor Notorias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZooYvGcm,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2016-07-23T19:49:59.648+0000)

Back when I played a lot of ARAM, I used a lot of skin boosts. It's a small amount of money, like 50 cents or a dollar. From what I've seen in other areas like music and mobile apps, the 99 cent transaction seems to be quite effective at raising money. So the logic here of they don't get their money seems lost and broken to me.

except the RP to buy champions and some of the best champions isn't 99 cents *boogle

worst analogy ever...

Praetor Notorias1 votes

Skin boosts.

Psi211 votes

[{quoted}](name=Praetor Notorias,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZooYvGcm,comment-id=0008000000000001,timestamp=2016-07-26T07:31:29.911+0000)

Skin boosts.

You missed the "phrase can be done on smurf accounts" (Got have me some skins *boggle)

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