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Should CDR Sivir be used more at the pro level?

darkdill·Dec 30, 2014·3 votes·1,805 views

I'm of the opinion that going 40% CDR on Sivir (via items like Lucidity Boots, Essence Reaver, Youmuu's Ghostblade) is a better fit for her than going standard ADC. Sure, an Infinity Edge is mandatory on all ADCs (except Vayne), but since Sivir has such bad AS scaling and does more of her damage with her Q and W (which are CDR-centric), it feels like Sivir would do more good with Lucidity Boots and Essence Reaver than Berserker's and Bloodthirster.

To put it in perspective, 40% CDR on Sivir lets her ult every 48 seconds. That is a TON of mobility for split-pushing, engages/disengages, objective control, etc. Add on how frequently she's able to use Spell Shield and Boomerang Blade, and you can see plenty of neat advantages over your typical auto-attack spamming builds.

But whenever I see Sivir in pro games, nope. They stick to the standard ADC builds when Sivir is out-performed in them by other ADCs (i.e. Lucian, Tristana). Kinda disappointing.

My 2 cents.

20 Comments

TalamareDec 30, 20141 votes

CDR on Sivir? Why?

Why in the world would I want a 200 + 200% AD aoe ability every 5 seconds? or the ability to completely ignore a spell every 6?

TsundayDec 30, 20141 votes

Because scrubs can't dodge single target abilities, they think they need spell shields every 6 seconds. Lol nerds.

TalamareDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

Because scrubs can't dodge single target abilities, they think they need spell shields every 6 seconds. Lol nerds.

Playing Sivir is one of the most difficult things ever

It is literally fighting my instincts honed after thousand games to dodge skill shot... being destroyed by a desire to run INTO skill shots for mana

TsundayDec 30, 20142 votes

Sometimes I see a skillshot and I want mana so I click my E and then I dodge it. Other times I run into the skillshot for mana and don't put on my shield. The best though is when Jinx lays her chompers or Cait places her traps and I walk around it because I don't remember I can spellshield it.

Whatever the case, I never have mana :C

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

Why wouldn't you want a massive team speed boost every 48 seconds?

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

her passive is improved significantly by attack speed and it's easy to dodge the return on her boomerang. attack speed gives you much more efficient damage output.

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

Youmuu's Ghostblade can cover the AS when needed, while also giving Sivir a huge on-demand speed boost combined with her ult. You'd be amazed how quickly it can let you reposition.

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

Youmuu's Ghostblade can cover the AS when needed, while also giving Sivir a huge on-demand speed boost combined with her ult. You'd be amazed how quickly it can let you reposition.

you're missing 25% attack speed from your boots and the ghostblade active only lasts 6 seconds, at which point a shiv would be far better. there's a reason that people generally build BotRK as their lifesteal item when they build youmuu's. it's a nice active, but just not enough for most fights on its own. it's more of an assassin item than an ADC item.

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

Statikk Shiv doesn't give cooldown reduction or armor penetration, both which are really nasty for Sivir's Q. Getting an early Brutalizer on her is scarier than most think.

Also, Statikk Shiv only gives 6% bonus MS constantly while Youmuu's gives 20% for 6 seconds, which is arguably better for when it really matters: team fights.

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

Statikk Shiv doesn't give cooldown reduction or armor penetration, both which are really nasty for Sivir's Q. Getting an early Brutalizer on her is scarier than most think.

Also, Statikk Shiv only gives 6% bonus MS constantly while Youmuu's gives 20% for 6 seconds, which is arguably better for when it really matters: team fights.

brutalizer is a lane winning tool but it doesnt scale as well as shiv. attack speed is better than flat pen and CDR on a marksman once you've finished your last whisper and IE. shiv also provides the magic damage burst which is very underrated.

you can choose not to believe me if you dont want to. i'm just trying to help. CDR may be cute and fun but building her as a standard marksman will get you more damage in the long run.

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

Never said you couldn't get Statikk, but I just don't prefer it since Sivir already has nasty wave-clear from Ricochet and Boomerang Blade. Shiv's proc on her is a little redundant. You could alternatively go Trinity Force (if you can afford it) and get even more speed from the Phage proc effect.

Besides, next patch Inf Edge is losing 5% of its crit chance, while PD is getting an extra 5%. Might make PD better on Sivir now.

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

Never said you couldn't get Statikk, but I just don't prefer it since Sivir already has nasty wave-clear from Ricochet and Boomerang Blade. Shiv's proc on her is a little redundant.

Besides, next patch Inf Edge is losing 5% of its crit chance, while PD is getting an extra 5%. Might make PD better on Sivir now.

It's not the waveclear you take it for, its the 200 magic damage burst. Sivir is really lacking in burst damage so it's extremely useful for her in particular. The AOE also helps with her waveclear early on so that she doesn't have to burn Q to 1 shot minion waves, but that's less important.

I do agree that PD may be a better buy than shiv if they go through with those PBE changes to the items. I don't think they're good changes because it increases RNG on IE vs IE duels but that's for a different thread/discussion I guess.

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

If I really wanted an ADC designed to burst someone down in seconds, I'd take Vayne, not Sivir. Sivir is better at utility and AOE.

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

{quoted}

If I really wanted an ADC designed to burst someone down in seconds, I'd take Vayne, not Sivir. Sivir is better at utility and AOE.

Okay... if you want to play that game then play Varus instead of Sivir? You want utility and AOE and you clearly like long ranged poke casting. Sivirs kit does not synergize with this style nearly as much as other ADs

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

Let me recall a situation where CDR Sivir won me a game recently.

We spot the enemy team going for Baron, so I use On the Hunt to get my team there quickly and ambush them. We ace them (for one death) and then take out Baron (it takes us a little bit; Baron regenerated during the team fight). Immediately afterward, we decide to go for the Nexus kill before the enemy can respawn. En-route to the enemy base, my ultimate comes back up again (48 second cooldown), so I ult again and we get to their Nexus and kill it before all of the enemy team can respawn.

GG

I don't think that whole play would've been possible without 40% CDR on Sivir. Varus would not have made that possible.

Drunk RummateDec 30, 20141 votes

I don't think that whole play would've been possible without 40% CDR on Sivir. Varus would not have made that possible.

Karma or a talisman support could have accomplished the same thing without gimping the damage output of the ADC in the process.

FHMarshyDec 30, 20141 votes

I can see you run into mana problem really often :) Besides, you probably will still need IE or BT for the raw damage.

darkdillDec 30, 20141 votes

My typical build order is Doran's Blade, Brutalizer, Boots of Speed, Infinity Edge, Lucidity Boots + Furor, Youmuu's Ghostblade, Essence Reaver, and then go from there depending on the enemy.

Essence Reaver covers Sivir's mana issues.

VenowolfDec 30, 20141 votes

I'll build on her IE, Essence Reaver, Ghostblade, Stathik, Banshee's Veil and Greaves Boots. In some cases when the enemy team have a lot of armor I change my Last whisper instead of Ghostblade.

HakkuzaJul 26, 20151 votes

Easy, 30% scaling cdr runes then just get 1 item. If essence reaver were better It'd be easier for me to recommend it though

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