What to do with Zed.

it does proc BC, so my math is gonna hurt :P

first I'll copy paste from other thread.

Quick MATH below on Talon VS ZED (Assuming zed deals damage if he hits a third shuriken)

The lowest CD AD assassin is Talon at 55 at rank 3. Talon's total damage and ratios is 900 (base)+ AD + 300% BONUS AD + 15% amp possible Zed's ratios are if hit by no shadows abilities 415 + 100% AD (BASE) + 180% BONUS AD + 50% of damage dealt if you ignore his bonus bonus ad passive if not then its 415 + 100% AD (BASE) + 225 BONUS AD + 50% Damage dealt. If hit by three shadows shurikens (MAX number afaik) its 650 + AD (BASE) + 280% BONUS AD + 50% Damage dealt if we don't include his Bonus AD passive else it would be 650 + 100% AD (BASE) + 350% BONUS AD + 50% damage dealt.

if zed had 0 bonus ad and hit someone with his full possible combo he would deal 763 (650 + 113(BASE AD at 18)) + 50% = 1144.5 If talon did he would deal 900 + 108 (BASE AD) =1008*1.15 = 1159.2 Passives for both champions not included

At 300 bonus ad from items zed would do potentially 650 + 488(113 + 300 1.25) + 1050 + 50% = 3282 < base damage would one shot most bruisers or medium tanks At 300 Bonus AD on Talon he would do (900 + 408(108 + 300) + 900) 1.15 = 2539.2

This doesn't include crits or actives from items (if we did zeds would be even higher)

K so Assuming the following Level 18 Enemy at full hp Zed building full damage for his potential(no boots) He has full scalling AD runes + Masteries (Double-edged sword, Brute force, Martial Mastery, Warlord, Devastating Strikes, and Havoc (not going into math on weaving masteries as it gets messy))

Having built x3 (for max damage) (We omit SotO as max stacks breaks alot) he has 113 base AD (conflicting numbers on different sites) 66 B.ADfrom Runes/Masteries 355 B.AD from items so his Bonus AD is 547.3 =(355+66)x1.3(Warlord mastery adds 5% more bonus AD along with his 25% increase assuming non multiplicative)

Total AD is 660.3 AD = 547.3+113

so to optimize damage you would Shadow into ULT then goes the following Shadow Slash (lowest damage ability) 180 + 437.84(.8 B.AD) = 617.84 x 1.05(Havoc and D-E Sword masteries) = 648.73 PD Armour gets shredded by 5% Shuriken first hit 235 + 547.3(1.0 B.AD) = 782.3 x 1.05 = 821.415 PD Shred at 10% Shuriken #2 hits 117.5 + 237.65 (.5 B.AD) = 390.95 x 1.05 = 410.4975 PD Shred at 15% Shuriken #3 hits (I believe a third shuriken does damage if so = to second) 117.5 + 237.65 (.5 B.AD) = 390.95 x 1.05 = 410.4975 PD Shred at 20% BOTRK Active (none shown for base damage purposes) 10% max hp with their armour at 20% shredded Shred reachs 25% a single Auto Attack (Crit for max potential damage) 660.3 x 2.5 = 1650.75 x1.05 = 1733.2875 PD Botrk passive damage (none shown for base damage purposes) Retreat with ult cast 2

Total damage before ult pops 4024.4275 PD

Ult then pops 4024.4275 x .5 (50% of the damage dealt) = 2012.21375 + 660.3(1.0 AD) = 2672.51375 x 1.05 = 2806.1394375 PD

Previous damage + ULT 4024.4275 + 2806.1394375 =

6830.5669375 Physical Damage (Not including BOTRK damages)

Oh right this all happens in 3 seconds btw

EDIT: FIXED ULT and Max damage

will do a vs full armour Rammus in a bit

Well.... here it is...

K Assuming Rammus is building full tank (Frozen Heart, Sunfire Cape, Warmogs, Ninja Tabi, Thornmail, Randuins Omen) Has maximizing armour runes (Scaling Quints and yellows, Flat blues and reds) 62 armour at 18 Full tank Masteries (Enchanted Armour, Veteran scars, Juggernaut, Hardness, Evasive, Legendary Guardian) He would have +5 B.AR +5% B.AR +3% Max HP -4% AoE damage (I'm assuming all Zeds abilities are except ult) +4 AR for each enemy (Assuming just zed for comparison)

Items give the following 100(FH)+100(TM)+70(RO)+45(SFC)+25(NT)= 340 B.AR 450(SFC)+500(RO)+800(WM)= 1750 B.HP

Total stats before BALL CURL 2026(BASE HP)+ 1750(Items) = 3776 x 1.03 = 3889.28 HP max 62(RUNES B.AR) + 9(MASTERIES B.AR) + 340 = 411 B.AR 411 x 1.05 = 431.55 B.AR from items and masteries/runes 431.55 + 96(Base AR) = 527.55 AR without CURL

With CURL (what we will be baing damage off of) 2026(BASE HP)+ 1750(Items) = 3776 x 1.03 = 3889.28 HP max 62(RUNES B.AR) + 9(MASTERIES B.AR) + 340 = 411 + 120 = 531 B.AR 531 x 1.05 = 557.55 B.AR 557.55 + 96 = 653.55

Armour Equation Damage multiplier = 100/(100+AR)

100/753.55(The 653.55 AR + 100) = .1327 multiplier or 86.73% reduced damage

ZED DAMAGE PART WARNING REDICUOUS DECIMALS Zed has 41% AR PEN (LW and MAstery) 10 Flat AR Pen (BC) W into ULT

Shadow Slash Armour Calc 653.55 x .59 (41% pen) = 385.5945 - 10 = 375.5945 100/485.5945 = .20593 648.73 x .20593 = 133.593 x .96 = 128.24928 Armour reduces by 5% 653.55 x .95= 620.8725

Shuriken 1 Armour Calc 620.8725 x .59 = 366.314775 -10 = 356.314775 100/456.314775 = 0.2191469693261631 821.415x0.2191469693261631 = 180.0106078090503 x .96 = 172.8101834966883 Armour reduces to 90% 653.55x .9 = 588.195 Damage done 128.24928 + 172.8101834966883 = 301.0594634966883 or 7.74% max HP

Shuriken 2 Armour Calc 337.03505 100/437.03505 = 0.2288145996528196 410.4975 x 0.2288145996528196 = 93.92782112098332 x .96 = 90.17070827614399 Armour Reduces to 85% 653.55x .85 = 555.5175 Damage done 301.0594634966883 + 90.17070827614399 = 391.2301717728323 or 10.06%

Shuriken 3 Armour Calc 317.755325 100/417.755325 = 0.2393745669190453 410.4975 x 0.2393745669190453 = 98.26266128385078 x .96 = 94.33215483249675 AR reduces to 80% 653.55x .8 = 522.84 Damage done 391.2301717728323 + 94.33215483249675 = 485.562326605329 or 12.48%

BotrK Active Armour Calc 298.4756 100/398.4756 = 0.2509563948206615 3889.28 x .10 = 388.928 x 0.2509563948206615 = 97.60396872481025 AR reduces to 75% 653.55 x .75 = 490.1625 Damage done 485.562326605329 + 97.60396872481025 = 583.1662953301393 or 14.99%

Auto ATTACK Armour Calc 279.195875 100/379.195875 = 0.263715948914265 Add Ninja tabi 0.263715948914265 x .9 = 0.2373443540228385 1733.2875 x 0.2373443540228385 = 411.3860020233607 Damage Botrk passive 3889.28 - 583.1662953301393 = 3306.113704669861 x.08 = 264.4890963735889 x 0.2373443540228385 = 62.77499372487372

Damage done 583.1662953301393 + 411.3860020233607 + 62.77499372487372 = 1057.327291078374 or 27.19% max HP

ULT POPS Armour Calc 279.195875 100/379.195875 = 0.263715948914265 1057.327291078374 x .5 = 528.663645539187 + 660.3 = 1188.963645539187 x 1.05 = 1248.411827816146 x 0.263715948914265 = 329.226109808327

Damage done 329.226109808327 + 1057.327291078374 = 1386.553400886701 or 35.65% Max HP

1386.553400886701 or 35.65% of 3889.28 HP

to a 653 armour Rammus!

Talon also has 2x the cd times for his AoE (RAKE) compared to Zed's Shadow Slash. While yes Talon is more multi target focused he has zero escapes and less damage in the same all enemies in one spot situation. Talon's Rake is also a skill shot cone compared to Shadow Slash which is a 2 part Aoe point click. The manaless part is also very true as talon can get maybe 3 full rotations off before oom with his regen while Zed doesn't have such restrictions. As an example at level 2 Zed for 115 energy and 18s he can deal 352.5 +1.5x bonus AD at 900 range while Talon for 60 of his 300~ mana can deal 260 +1.2x Bonus AD every 10s at 600 range.

Problem a lot of people have with him compared to talon is that Zed gets better clear, Safer laning, better Lane sustain(MANALESS), and has the same or better snowballiness.