The 4 min kayn timer is annoying and feels unnecessary

Hexs Fortune·Jul 16, 2017·2 votes·973 views

It's annoying to have rhaast delayed purely due to my enemy team choosing mostly ranged champs.

Is this intended counterplay? Pick ranged to delay rhaast??

14 Comments

ApocalypsicJul 16, 20171 votes

I think the delay on his form in general is fucking annoying, I'd rather just have Rhaast or just have SA Kayne as seperate champs because before he can transform (which by the way if you get behind can be almost impossible to do in a decent time frame) you're a useless half baked champion.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 16, 20171 votes

It's actually good, especially since Blue Kayn is better against ranged champs due to higher mobility. You're supposed to be picking your form based on what is better for the situation, red is better against a bruiser heavy team and blue is better against a ranged heavy team.

DurzakaJul 16, 20171 votes

But that isnt true at all.

Just because the enemy is ranged heavy does not mean your team needs another assassin. Maybe your Mid and top are both assassin/carry champions and you want Rhaast in order to bring some CC/tankiness to your team.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 16, 20171 votes

Then maybe you shouldn't have picked Kayn, and instead picked a champion that could have more efficiently filled that role.

DurzakaJul 17, 20171 votes

In which case Kayn is 100% a dead weight champion.

Why pick Kayn when you know youre going to need a tank, instead of picking another tank/bruiser?

Why pick kayn when you know youre going to need an assassin, instead of picking another assassin?

His assassin form is trash right now and there is no reason to choose it over Darkin, even if you have to wait the extra 4 minutes.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 17, 20171 votes

so it sounds like you've figured out your problem, red Kayn is not a tank, he is a bruiser. Champions have specific slots to fill in team comps, if you want to fill a certain slot you should be picking the champion best suited for that slot. Kayn is a damage dealer, sure he can get beefy but his job is to deal damage. Pick the champion that fits the role you need if a flexible champion is not what you want.

DurzakaJul 17, 20171 votes

ok?

Literally nothing you just said is relevant at all.

You said Blue kayn is better against Ranged because he is more mobile (which he BARELY is). Which is flat out wrong.

Blue is flat out worse in every aspect, including dealing with ranged champions right now. Thats the problem here.

I was fully aware from the beginning Rhaast is a bruiser, not a tank.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 17, 20171 votes

Blue Kayn is more mobile, his W doesn't lock him in place, his ult has a longer range as well. Everything I said is relevent, you just keep spinning your wheels going nowhere, you're complaining that a champion who is not a tank has a timer on his tanky mode when the conditions are not met.

DurzakaJul 17, 20171 votes

what, no that isnt what im complaining about at all.

The complaint is there is absolutely no incentive on using his assassin form. There is no benefit whatsoever, and no situation where it is better.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 17, 20171 votes

If you go back to your original complaint that is not at all what you said. You complained that you couldn't go rhaast right away against a ranged comp. That's intentional. Then you complained that your team needed a tanky champion with cc, where I stated you should have picked a champ intended to fill that role. Then you tried to imply that I said Kayn has no spot in the game, which isn't true, he does. Blue Kayn does do a lot of damage, I watched him utterly destroy adcs over and over, he must not have damage if he can do that. Red Kayn is for extended fighting, but not for locking up enemies with cc or tanking which is your reason for wanting red kayn in the first place. Ranged comps don't "fight" they poke, they kite, and they burst depending on the champions who make up that comp, which makes red kayn a bad choice into ranged comps. So from there you try to discredit my claim that blue kayn is more mobile, which proves you don't understand blue Kayn's kit. So you're complaining that Kayn is working as intended since you played him in a game against a ranged comp and didn't want to go for the build and form that is more optimally suited to deal with a ranged comp. I think the problem boils down to the fact you don't understand how to play blue kayn and instead of asking for advice on how to build and play it you flat out say there is no purpose for it in the game.

DurzakaJul 17, 20171 votes

But that isnt true at all.

Just because the enemy is ranged heavy does not mean your team needs another assassin. Maybe your Mid and top are both assassin/carry champions and you want Rhaast in order to bring some CC/tankiness to your team.

my original comment.

In no way was i complaining about having to wait.

YOU said that it was good that you get to go for Blue form quicker which is what you want against ranged.

MY comment was that blue form is NOT what you want against ranged because Blue form is strictly inferior to Red form.

I had no complaint about the wait time. Literally zero. I am not the OP on this thread, I am simply someone commenting on it.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 17, 20171 votes

oh, you're right-ish, for some reason I thought you were the OP. Still, wrong on blue form being inferior, I've yet to see a red form Kayn pump out the dmg that blue form Kayn can, and I play red form, (mostly because I play support Kayn).

However you are still pointing out that you wanted red form so you could be tanky and do cc which is not why you play Kayn.

Blade of JusticJul 16, 20171 votes

It'd be nice if attacking melee champs with Kayn for 99% of his gauge and a ranged champ for the last 1% didn't automatically make him go into his Shadow Assassin form.

Chibi BronzlifeJul 17, 20171 votes

it doesn't, you still have to activate a form manually. Hence why the other form has a timer. It's about being efficient with your planning. Kayn is a strategy based champion, if you go in without a strategy you're going to wind up with this situation frequently where you have to wait for the form you want.