How to fix Dark Harvest:

Mr Dander··1 votes·1,278 views

Like this:

Dark Harvest: Landing a damaging spell or basic attack on an enemy champion below 50% health deals 20 - 60 (based on level) (+ 5 per soul) (+ 25% bonus AD) (+ 15% AP) bonus adaptive damage and causes them to drop a Soul Essence. (45s cooldown, resets on takedown). The Soul Essence last for 10 seconds or until picked up by moving close to it.

Note: In this version, the keystone is basically the same as it is currently on the live servers except:

  1. You cannot proc it with damage-over-time, so that champions with damage-over-time doesn't get an unfair advantage.

  2. You cannot poke someone down with it and still get stacks, you now have to actually collect the soul essence by walking up to it, giving it a higher risk.

That's it, pretty simple solution.

14 Comments

mack91122 votes

I mean to reach the old 150 threshold of the old rune you need to farm 26 stacks and on all honesty I have yet to see someone reach that point in a not silly match.

Mr Dander1 votes

Maybe because it can currently only be stacked by damaging a champion bellow 50% health. Now it can also be stacked through strategic farming. Plus, reaching the 150 threshold won't mean anything, since you don't have a limited amount of time to proc it anymore, it instead just goes on cooldown.

mack91121 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Dander,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yfzd3RRt,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-11-26T12:12:57.646+0000)

Maybe because it can currently only be stacked by damaging a champion bellow 50% health. Now it can also be stacked through strategic farming.

But I think the fact you have to interact with an enemy player to get a stack is a big part of its balance as that was the problem with the old dark harvest it allowed for afk farm.

You sugesstion just makes it the old rune.

Mr Dander1 votes

I've seen countless of people asking for a revert, and I've never seen anyone complain about the old version. But either way, this allows for both, you could afk farm to stack it up, or you could interract with champions to stack it up, instead of just basically "removing" a viable jungling keystone for the sake of making it a laning keystone, when it could be both! And also, the entire point of Dark Harvest was that it was a scaling keystone, it's what gave it its unique spot in the Domination tree. Now it's just a generic extra free damage Keystone, and we already have Electrocute for that. And it even deals more damage than Electrocute level 1, that doesn't make any sense! At this point It's just a better version of Electrocute!

mack91121 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Dander,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yfzd3RRt,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2018-11-26T12:24:18.990+0000)

I've seen countless of people asking for a revert, and I've never seen anyone complain about the old version. But either way, this allows for both, you could afk farm to stack it up, or you could interract with champions to stack it up, instead of just basically "removing" a viable jungling keystone for the sake of making it a laning keystone, when it could be both! And also, the entire point of Dark Harvest was that it was a scaling keystone, it's what gave it its unique spot in the Domination tree. Now it's just a generic extra free damage Keystone, and we already have Electrocute for that. And it even deals more damage than Electrocute level 1, that doesn't make any sense! At this point It's just a better version of Electrocute!

I'm sorry but the interaction old dark harvest had with the jungle was very unhealthy for the game and created one shot machines that you could not prevent.

Basic attacks and abilities generate stacks on enemy champions hit, up to one per attack or cast. Applying 3 stacks to a target within a 3 second period causes them to be struck by lightning, dealing them 30 − 180 (based on level) (+ 40% bonus AD) (+ 25% AP) Attack damage cooldown 25 to 20

Damaging a champion below 50% of their maximum health by any mean deals 40 − 80 (based on level) (+ 5 per Soul) (+ 25% bonus AD) (+ 15% AP) bonus Attack damage.png Ability power.png and reaps 1 Soul. This cannot happen again for 45 seconds, resetting to 1.5 seconds on champion

Electrocute has a far higher base scale with at level 18 to match the damage you will require 20 souls with dark harvest but the ad and ap scaling are better with eltrocute and the target does not need to be below 50% to proc as well the cooldown of elctrocute is half the of dark harvest allowing for double the damage within the same time.

They are made for different champs.

Jorencice1 votes

Woo. Dark harvest jungle nasus was my favorite.

Disappear into the jungle and come out 30 minutes later as a one shot machine.

Mr Dander1 votes

So you think this new iteration is healthier? Now everyone can be one-shot machines, they no longer have to farm up the damage, they no longer have to land a basic attack, now they just do more damage every time they deal damage.

And Electrocute's base damage having higher scaling doesn't matter, since Dark Harvest scales with soul stacks, which can be stacked indefinitely. And even if it did matter, it still doesn't make any sense that Electrocute has better scaling than Dark Harvest, when Dark Harvest's literal purpose was to scale!

Plus, when you hit a champion with 3 seperate damaging spells, they are probably going to be bellow 50% health anyways, so they both basically apply their damage at the same time as one another, but at least with electrocute you have to land 3 seperate attacks rather than just damaging a champion in any shape or form as long as they are bellow 50% (even works with ignite), making it a dumb execute keystone, which is something that Riot even tried doing before in the last preseason, but they said it didn't work. But now, one year later, it's all of a sudden fine? Don't they learn anything from the past?

The point is; what Electrocute does, Dark Harvest does better. It deals more damage; making it better for burst (the cooldown doesn't matter, cause you're probably dead after the all-in anyways), it scales better, it's easier to proc; since all you have to do is damage them to proc it; as long as they are under 50% health and it resets on takedowns making it better at killing multiple targets. The damage isn't the problem, nerfing its damage wouldn't fix its issues, it's more the way it is procced, the way it stacks and the way it resets on takedowns.

I am appalled by the direction Riot is taking with this Keystone, or with anything in the game in general, and I just cannot understand how anyone could defend it.

mack91121 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Dander,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yfzd3RRt,comment-id=000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2018-11-26T13:23:54.800+0000)

So you think this new iteration is healthier? Now everyone can be one-shot machines, they no longer have to farm up the damage, they no longer have to land a basic attack, now they just do more damage every time they deal damage.

And Electrocute's base damage having higher scaling doesn't matter, since Dark Harvest scales with soul stacks, which can be stacked indefinitely. And even if it did matter, it still doesn't make any sense that Electrocute has better scaling than Dark Harvest, when Dark Harvest's literal purpose was to scale!

Plus, when you hit a champion with 3 seperate damaging spells, they are probably going to be bellow 50% health anyways, so they both basically apply their damage at the same time as one another, but at least with electrocute you have to land 3 seperate attacks rather than just damaging a champion in any shape or form as long as they are bellow 50% (even works with ignite), making it a dumb execute keystone, which is something that Riot even tried doing before in the last preseason, but they said it didn't work. But now, one year later, it's all of a sudden fine? Don't they learn anything from the past?

The point is; what Electrocute does, Dark Harvest does better. It deals more damage; making it better for burst (the cooldown doesn't matter), it scales better, it's easier to proc; since all you have to do is damage them to proc it; as long as they are under 50% health and it resets on takedowns making it better at killing multiple targets. The damage isn't the problem, nerfing its damage wouldn't fix its issues, it's more the way it is procced, the way it stacks and the way it resets on takedowns.

I am appalled by the direction Riot is taking with this Keystone, or with anything in the game in general, and I just cannot understand how anyone could defend it.

The keystone requires scaling and honestly in the games I have played in plat players have had between 12 to 15 stacks at 25 minutes which is around when the game is closing out so it is nowhere close to the old keystone that saw 150 stacks around 20 minutes which is equal to 26 stacks in the new dark harvest.

Yes the cooldowns do matter as the windows matter for trading in lane .

There are many champions that will not fall below 50% health from being hit 3 times plenty of top laners mid laners junglers and supports.

They are two different keystones intended for different play styles and different champions.

Riot made the keystone healthy and I have yet to play a match of league were that rune created unfair play patterns unlike the old rune that had one shot shaco graves kha kayne as just a few.

Mr Dander1 votes

Fine, you make some good points. But I still don't think the state of Dark Harvest is ideal, also proven by the barrage of complaints by the community. I added a different version of Dark Harvest to the post. Would you atleast agree with those changes?

mack91121 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Dander,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yfzd3RRt,comment-id=00000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2018-11-26T14:11:55.084+0000)

Fine, you make some good points. But I still don't think the state of Dark Harvest is ideal, also proven by the barrage of complaints by the community. I added a different version of Dark Harvest to the post. Would you atleast agree with those changes?

I just feel letting it scale off jungle creeps is a step backwards.

You are allowed your opinion though I could be shit for brains all we know.

Mr Dander1 votes

Taking a step backwards can sometimes means that you're finally able to take a step in the right direction, but I get your point.

Maybe re-adding the farm scaling to Dark Harvest is going a bit too far, but I still think the other changes are valid.

You are allowed your opinions too, and they did make me re-think my own opinions. So, thank you for the feedback.

mack91121 votes

[{quoted}](name=Mr Dander,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Yfzd3RRt,comment-id=0000000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-11-26T14:27:36.466+0000)

Taking a step backwards can sometimes means that you're finally able to take a step in the right direction, but I get your point.

Maybe re-adding the farm scaling to Dark Harvest is going a bit too far, but I still think the other changes are valid.

You are allowed your opinions too, and they did make me re-think my own opinions. So, thank you for the feedback.

Anytime man love to chat

Mr Dander1 votes

And besides; I would rather have an underpowered Dark Harvest than an overpowered Dark Harvest

AR URF1 votes

simply make it so damage over time can't proc it. I don't like teemo proccing it with his e. It's dumb.

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