Once past the learnign curve Illaoi is actaully way to strong.

Irelia Bot··7 votes·1,842 views

77.35% win rate for the current 15 to 50 games played window.

http://champion.gg/champion/Illaoi

It will likely be along those lines when she has been out long enough to actually have people with 100+ games on her.

And if we are assuming that only .44% is in this 15 to 50 range that means that we have a sample of 183.2 games which are in the 15 to 50 range from the 41641 game pool.

77.35% win rate or 141.7 games won out of 183.2 games played for 15 to 50 games played with the champ in plat and higher. Please tell me how this is too small of a sample to show a champ consistently being to strong once people learn how to play her.

And for reference Irelia is at a 56.48% for 125+ games Diana is 55.62 is 125+ games Leblanc (who many say is among the harder champs to play to her full potential) is 55.24% at 125+ games

none of them are above a 51% at 15 to 50 games played range.

You can say Illaoi is weak but in reality she is proving to have far too much power once someone gets past the learning curve.

This might fall a little but likely will stay well above 65% in her current state.

33 Comments

Niyumi2 votes

You also happen to forget that Illaoi is still really new, and not many people play her. Give the data some time to settle down, and you'll see that she's not as strong as you think. In fact, op.gg has her at a 44% win rate. She is VERY easy to play against if you have half a brain, and she's really not that strong at all if you don't dive her tentacles.

Irelia Bot3 votes

44% win rate overall but in the 15 to 50 game range it is 77.35%.

And if you read the title I said once past the learning curve she is way to strong.

Niyumi3 votes

Again, she is only strong if you play exactly like she wants you to. If you don't stand in tentacles and dodge her abilities, she's actually really pathetic. But if you dive her and just eat all the tentacle slaps, you'll die pretty quickly. That's how all juggernauts are -- they're not play makers, they just capitalize on your mistakes or misplays -- even the likes of Darius and Garen.

Tanks are different than juggernauts, and have some playmaking potential, and shouldn't be confused with juggernauts.

I actually wrote a big post on how to beat Illaoi (It's not the 100% perfect guide to literally everything involving Illaoi, but it gives general tips and advice on how to not feed her.) Here's a link.

Poske1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YelAmxRb,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-12-07T04:16:37.833+0000)

44% win rate overall but in the 15 to 50 game range it is 77.35%.

And if you read the title I said once past the learning curve she is way to strong.

Doubt illaoi has high learning curve

First game Illaoi had 100 k dmg dealt against champions while going full tank

had like 25 kills or so

But then again I was advised how to build against Mastery 5 enemy illaoi ... she would wreck me if she werent easy to gank...

Give it some more time People have no idea what to do against her ...

Irelia Bot2 votes

I didn't think much of her the first few days but the more time goes on the more I am seeing her dominating everything.

Keti2 votes

Hint: ranged top laners make her cry

Salron3 votes

Fuck me for picking a melee champ right?

Keti1 votes

First pick a melee champ that's versatile enough to deal with her. Something mobile like renek should do fine. I've also stomped the matchup with shyvana by stacking armor and beating her with the stat stick, I'm sure other champs can do similar. If you see her on the board you can pretty confidently lock in a ranged top laner, her non top lane roles suck. My pick of choice is kindred who pretty much gets fed for free.

Señor Karthus2 votes

Give it time. People don't know how to play against her. Ranged Champs destroy her. Nasus counters her hard (he just gets free stacks from the tentacles). You just need to not keep fighting where he lands her ulti or if she has many tentacles around. She has barely no cc and just a small gap closer. No mobility. She has many weaknesses. She is just annoying to play against. I would give some more time.

BluePolarizer1 votes

no he doesn't.

Nasus can have 1000 stacks but still won't have anywhere near the game impact that Illaoi has simply because he has to melee people while Illaoi doesn't.

Señor Karthus2 votes

Now lets not talk out of our asses. Nasus with 1000 stacks will vaporize Illaoi and almost any enemy with two Q in 2 seconds without even needing to build damage as Illaoi does. He can be full tank and completely resist anything that Illaoi can launch at him while still deal the whole extent of his Q damage.

BluePolarizer1 votes

Do the math. Nasus with 1000 stack Q is essentially doing 1300 damage per Q before armor on a 2.4 second CD. He has no arpen besides his E with -50 armor reduction.

Illaoi with item 3071 item 3742 item 3143 item 3065 item 3075 item 3047 has 350 armor and 4000 HP, or 18000 effective physical HP. With armor reduction from E (reducing her effective physical HP to 16000) she can tank Nasus for 12 Qs or a whopping 30 seconds.

Of course, she can't do much to Nasus. But thanks to her AOE, she doesn't need to; she can kill the rest of his team with AOE while shredding his armor with Cleaver.

Also, fun fact: if she only hits 2 champs with her ult, her burst at 18 deals total AD x2 + 180x2 + 95 + 350 + 370% total AD + 50% bonus AD in an AOE. This is a total of 1972 damage in an AOE that's also shredding 30% of enemy team armor.

TheWoollyMammoth2 votes

Sion Would You have a moment to ride the train of death? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gnj3F7-DcQY https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mb7LvUnx_8s (i know you said ALMOST but i couldnt help it) nasus and his 1000 stacks make Sion his thornmail+titanic and 9k hp laugh) In fact. he messes with tentacle woman a fair bit as well.

3TWarrior1 votes

doesn't it only add 95 damage at that point except the active?

if the cone is factored in though, that's a lot

TheWoollyMammoth1 votes

The real killer is the active on this baby. deals 40+10% max of your hp to ALL targets hit. Turrets included. so thats about 1k damage building full tank. And you can trigger this AFTER you die as well. Perhaps nasus could kill you. but its all about timing out the wither for while you still live. then you smash his face in with passive form. Also, if you get him in his wave you can hit a minion to hit him with the cone.

If its turrets you are after. Well.... I get a good chuckle from playing Sion top with nasus jg. Sion to do the tanking. nasus to do the spanking. Who needs minions?

Salt Miner 49 Er1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YelAmxRb,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-12-07T04:11:04.628+0000)

77.35% win rate for the current 15 to 50 games played window.

http://champion.gg/champion/Illaoi

It will likely be along those lines when she has been out long enough to actually have people with 100+ games on her.

And for reference Irelia is at a 56.48% for 125+ games Diana is 55.62 is 125+ games Leblanc (who many say is among the harder champs to play to her full potential) is 55.24% at 125+ games

none of them are above a 51% at 15 to 50 games played range.

You can say she is weak but in reality she is proving to have far too much power once someone gets past the learning curve.

This might fall a little but likely will stay well above 65% in her current state.

Except she won't because she's literally based all around getting the tentacles and forcing you to fight her where she wants you too.

She's like a less effective Gangplank.

Irelia Bot2 votes

If it was a simple 65% or something like that I would say give it time but 77% is basically like a free win.

And the more time goes on the more I am seeing Illaoi flat out win lane by a land slide.

Salt Miner 49 Er1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Irelia Bot,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YelAmxRb,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2015-12-07T04:15:04.878+0000)

If it was a simple 65% or something like that I would say give it time but 77% is basically like a free win.

And the more time goes on the more I am seeing Illaoi flat out win lane by a land slide.

Except I've never lost a lane to Illaoi because she's hilariously easy to beat in lane.

Irelia Bot3 votes

All I see is people losing to her really hard in lane.

Even a near full health Shen and Udyr going 2v1 and losing to her at level 4.

All Illaoi has to do is Test of Spirit someone trying to auto the tentacles and they are basically committed to a fight regardless of if they want to be or not.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Because they played stupidly vs her, all you have to do is respect her ulti once that's down she's easy to beat.

Passive drop nearby tentacles to 1 hp before doing anything

Q dodge...

w focus on avoiding tentacles

e- think of a blitz/thresh hook if you let yourself be grabbed you need practice....

R- respect and just back off until it's over and she's dreadfully weak

But nope people just want to meltface combos at her and all-in constantly letting her get free q's off and stand in her ulti like standing in karthus' passive while he's landing all qs on you.

Losing to her is more of a joke at this point.

WarlockLaw2 votes

Her e can go through minions unlike other hooks so I'd say it's harder to dodge. Her q hit box is larger than the visuals. And if she uses her ult smartly then you probably won't be able to easily disengage in time. I'm pretty sure she is going to end up being the new Yorrick. You can't beat a smart, only cs, survive and outscale

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

? Her E can't. Her q hitbox needs a visual update. If your team can't disengage in time they were asking for it, respecting her ulti means if you know she hasn't used it yet you don't put your position in her favor. She doesn't outscale also she falls off extremely hard and if the enemy is smart enough to buy executioner when lane phase is over she's non-existent in terms of usefulness.

WarlockLaw1 votes

According to her reveal page "Illaoi sends out a tentacle in target direction. If it hits a champion it pulls out their spirt..." Nowhere in the description does it say it stops on minions or even hits them. I've also had it hit me through my minion wave. So yes it does go through minions.

As for her ult I would say that the first attack from the tentacles is fairly hard if not impossible to avoid unless you have zhonyas or other untargetability. I've seen the first shot one shot squishies. And if it's not in her favor a smart Illaoi won't waste her ult. Smart play cuts both ways.

Also she does have usefulness outside of laning, fighting inside her ult is suicide at every stage of the game, she can control drag and baron rather well with that. She can also force people of their towers with that as well. Sure she can't break a siege, but she can help her team get baron without having to ace the enemy team first

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

It does not go through a minion, it's just a thresh/blitz grab, I actually played her it does not. With how minions pathing is, it wouldn't be surprising if you walked past the minion then back behind the instance she tried to e.

Regardless of experience Illaoi's ultimate is easy to disengage off of unless your team played dumb and stood inside an epic monster pit just waiting for her to ulti......... Smart illaoi wouldn't change how weak her ulti is when you dont let her get it perfectly.

Fighting under her ulti is suicide yet the dumb ones wants to continue fighting in it. They should think like karthus' e, fiddle/rumble ulti. You would respect them and just regroup.

Also if a team starts baron while illaoi can get a freebie ulti, it wasn't a good time to baron anyway. most of the reason grabbing baron is usually a throw even before illaoi.....

Illaoi is just another shaco who plays off the dumb mistakes of the enemy.

Salt Miner 49 Er1 votes

{quoted}

Because they played stupidly vs her, all you have to do is respect her ulti once that's down she's easy to beat.

Passive drop nearby tentacles to 1 hp before doing anything

Q dodge...

w focus on avoiding tentacles

e- think of a blitz/thresh hook if you let yourself be grabbed you need practice....

R- respect and just back off until it's over and she's dreadfully weak

But nope people just want to meltface combos at her and all-in constantly letting her get free q's off and stand in her ulti like standing in karthus' passive while he's landing all qs on you.

Losing to her is more of a joke at this point.

Pretty much. With her E proc'd on you for the tentacle spawning if you keep moving to the side they'll never hit you. But people want to give her free grabs from E and then bitch when they stand still and they smacked.

Irelia Bot1 votes

so dodge the pink spear...

Is this old nidalee all over again?

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Nope old nid could prove useful for assassinations unlike the under powered illaoi at least.

Irelia Bot1 votes

your 13 and 8 record with Illaoi would seem to suggest that you are aware of her being strong and don't want her nerfed.

EcchiOtakuTM1 votes

Her q is dodgeable easily, he w is short range and when it hits all the enemy has to do is dodge tentacles, her E is easy to deal with by fighting her or walking away, her ultimate should be respected since it has damage.

However part of the reason illaoi can somewhat land certain unlandable moves is the minion collision which riot said they're reverting next patch.

But players just need to dodge q, avoid tentacles after w hits, dodge e or just fight/walk away if you let it hit, and respect her ulti which people are still refusing to do. Illaoi's ulti is only good for making someone retreat if they choose to fight illaoi on top of it then it's their fault which some people do. I even experienced some players complain to me about illaoi yet I told them just position and they say they don't want to learn how to do something, honestly if someone doesn't want to learn to deal with something then they have no right to complain cause illaoi is near balanced but underpowered as of this moment.

Buying just an executioner calling further makes illaoi useless since even if she ultis she's weak then.

I'm already experienced at playing her, once players start adjusting to exploiting her flaws and respecting her ulti she's worthless. Great design and lore but riot needs to rework her. She's only useful vs the braindead.

ProfDrDeath1 votes

She's a freshly released champion. So, maybe wait a patch or two?

The issue with the 15-50 games played is, look at the number of people who have played that many games, as well. You cannot discern that part of the pie chart, which means that those with that number of games could very well be a dozen or so people who played her extensively in PBE and thus started with an advantage for taking her straight into ranked, having her mechanics down when nobody knew how to face her yet.

AMYS GRAVE1 votes

41641 games played total.

82.17% of people have 1-5 games played, 10.87 have 5-15 games played. that leaves 6.96 % with more and there is no data at higher bins (which is why the winrates default to the overall average).

6.96% of 41641 is 2898 games.

2.9k games is quite a lot more than i expected. so about 300 illaoi "mains" at this point.

EDIT: for reference the most experience renekton players (125+ games played) have logged in 5.8k games.

Lovelle1 votes

I agree, but so many people seem to think she needs buffs for some reason. She's only weak-ish early game. After she gets Spirit Visage and some tanky items she can out-trade most of the roster. Too much sustain and damage for most champs to deal with alone.

She is a legit raid boss champ, similar to Tahm.

Most people must not be building her tanky enough.

Xicashina1 votes

From my experience Al be it limited she gets countered hard by Shyvana top too as Shyv can crush her in lane with instagibbing her tentacles and just wing away when Illaoi ults (Illaoi is a mediocre duelist with no nearby tentacles)

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