Why do people think Zed top is bad?

5D Paragon·Feb 17, 2016·2 votes·6,278 views

I tend to win lane a lot with him at Top. He's a safe champ that can adjust very easily. I mean, as long as there is engage and a tank elsewhere, I feel it's fine.

So why is he "bad?"

29 Comments

Death by GlamourFeb 17, 20166 votes

I somehow doubt he will be able to snowball off a darius/garen/mundo ect

Also its a fairly long walk to gank bot

iodyFeb 17, 20163 votes

because top lane has tanks and cc the 2 things that zed is bad at dealing with. he goes mid because mid laners are squishy.

Ruin LanceFeb 18, 20163 votes

because once the enemy starts building armor they will destroy you, whether you're 1 kill ahead or 4 kills ahead. zed lacks any cc besides his shadow + e slow, and he's countered by mostly everyone in top lane. tl;dr he gets rekt by tanks

Sneakyy XDFeb 17, 20162 votes

He can't kill the enemy top lane, and he has no sustain or defense.

5D ParagonFeb 17, 20161 votes

{quoted}

He can't kill the enemy top lane, and he has no sustain or defense.

I usually always kill the enemy top laner. Zed's damage is ridiculous.

LeBlanc JameśFeb 17, 20162 votes

who are you laning against? You're not killing the top tier tops right now... no way.

5D ParagonFeb 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

who are you laning against? You're not killing the top tier tops right now... no way.

I've beaten Garen, Malphite, Riven, Sion, Trundle and some others I can't remember.

But I don't build normal Zed. My zed build gives 3000 HP and over 400 AD.

LeBlanc JameśFeb 18, 20161 votes

I'm not going to argue with your experiences so keep at it I guess...

Spicy RiceFeb 18, 20161 votes

The hell are you building? Im pretty sure atmas and 5 warmogs isnt a thing anymore

5D ParagonFeb 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

The hell are you building? Im pretty sure atmas and 5 warmogs isnt a thing anymore

Titanic hydra, Mortal Reminder, Mercurial Schimtar, Merc Treads, Randuins and the new AD item.

Malicious MetalFeb 17, 20162 votes

Go ahead, play him top. I like easy lanes.

Meep ManFeb 17, 20162 votes

Because the Top Lane terrors of today: Fiora DrMundo Malphite

All counter Zed. Zed is a decent pick against maybe Graves, but thats the main reason to bring him. Not to mention bringing nearly anyone with a defensive steroid basically counters him.

LeBlanc JameśFeb 17, 20161 votes

Rammus Rammus Rammus Rammus Rammus

This dude top is so dumb with zz'rot

Spicy RiceFeb 18, 20163 votes

Just pick Doge Nasus . He cant do anything to you in lane, and you get extra stacks from the Zz'Top minions

BlueBilberryJul 29, 20161 votes

[{quoted}](name=Inept Maverick,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YB9lgfrj,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2016-02-17T23:40:00.682+0000)

Because the Top Lane terrors of today:

All counter Zed. Zed is a decent pick against maybe Graves, but thats the main reason to bring him. Not to mention bringing nearly anyone with a defensive steroid basically counters him.

Exactly right!

Just had a game with this situation. A Zed top really lacks the tankiness your team needs. If you do play a game where someone dares to play a Zed top, then pray for a quick and early finish - because a late game is much more likely to swing in favour of the side with the tanky top.

YumifriesFeb 17, 20162 votes

I feel like it's better mid lane. Champs there are much more squishy, he can roam more freely without having to take teleport Top has many tanks that will keep zed from snowballing. (i.e. Malphite )

Ironclad DragonFeb 17, 20162 votes

I remember a time when a Zed top went up against me, a Sion. Let's just say he didn't have a good time.

WalkingInACircleFeb 18, 20162 votes

lack of roaming/superior options

Assassins go mid to roam.

Sky of SmilesFeb 18, 20161 votes

It goes all the way back to Season 2. Basically you're only given 5 champions to work in unison against the enemy's 5 champions with only 3 lanes worth of CS flow + Jungle and Dragon + Baron. Currently, everyone wants to play a DPS champion in Support and Jungle. A team comp full of early game DPS can fall off late game vs a more standard team comp consisting of the appropriate amount of tanks who can take the brunt of bursts for their team to capitalize on the timing window when you're not able to output as much damage and thereby impose as much threat towards them. This is especially true in the meta late game when one tank gets GA, tanks everything, then comes back with all your cooldowns blown on him. I've abused the Sunfire damage on Leona before to out duel Fizz Mid and many other burst type assassins as a Support because I can time my W and other skills to counter their timing windows on their skills if not dodge them making them wasted on trying to get me when they're single handedly carrying their team. This is one of the reasons why people argued Shaco and Lee Sin fall off late game back in the day.

SwapShadowsFeb 18, 20161 votes

Most people in this thread don't have a clue.

Zed top is actually pretty good, beats majority of toplaners.

The cons are that if he does happen to fall behind you will probably lack any kill potential since the enemy toplaner will get too tanky for you to catch up in damage and if your team isn't doing well then it can prevent any good roams/potential snowballing.

mogonkFeb 18, 20161 votes

You're missing the point. The question isn't "can Zed go top", the question is "why would you send Zed top".

"But I can kill my lane opponents!"

If you can kill tanks, you would be absolutely destroying champs with no resists, and thus snowballing harder. This is common sense. A champion who is happy to rush an armor item is a bad matchup for Zed, it's that simple.

More to the point, Zed falls off in late game when your prime targets have QSS or Zhonyas. You want to maximize his impact on the game by roaming before that happens. Roaming from top lane is less impactful than roaming from mid.

"But I still roam and get kills!"

Then you would have gotten more kills and exerted more pressure if you went mid. Again, common sense.

SwapShadowsFeb 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You're missing the point. The question isn't "can Zed go top", the question is "why would you send Zed top".

"But I can kill my lane opponents!"

If you can kill tanks, you would be absolutely destroying champs with no resists, and thus snowballing harder. This is common sense. A champion who is happy to rush an armor item is a bad matchup for Zed, it's that simple.

More to the point, Zed falls off in late game when your prime targets have QSS or Zhonyas. You want to maximize his impact on the game by roaming before that happens. Roaming from top lane is less impactful than roaming from mid.

"But I still roam and get kills!"

Then you would have gotten more kills and exerted more pressure if you went mid. Again, common sense.

Yea he's definitely better mid in every way but if mid is taken then top isn't a bad option at all.

5D ParagonFeb 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

You're missing the point. The question isn't "can Zed go top", the question is "why would you send Zed top".

"But I can kill my lane opponents!"

If you can kill tanks, you would be absolutely destroying champs with no resists, and thus snowballing harder. This is common sense. A champion who is happy to rush an armor item is a bad matchup for Zed, it's that simple.

More to the point, Zed falls off in late game when your prime targets have QSS or Zhonyas. You want to maximize his impact on the game by roaming before that happens. Roaming from top lane is less impactful than roaming from mid.

"But I still roam and get kills!"

Then you would have gotten more kills and exerted more pressure if you went mid. Again, common sense.

They build armor, you build LW. It's quite simple. You may not be able to kill them after they finish an item and a half, (Let's say Frozen Heart / Cinders) but then that's when you become a strong split pushing top laner. (Especially with my build that involves hydra) I've beaten many tanky tops who tried rushing armor against me, but I just bought LW right when I backed, came back and continued dominating.

In addition to this, you also take TP. Your presence on the map, although you won't be roaming as often as a mid lane Zed, is still strong. Most fights if your jungle comes, will result in a kill for you, even if the enemy jungler counterganks. In a sense, your damage helps you control the top portion of the map because not many people can really out damage you unless it's an uneven fight (1v2). If you wish, you can ward the enemy top side jungle and control it from there with that mobility and damage, while maintaining some pressure on mid if you ever go MIA as well as pressure on bot with your TP. There's just so many ways to snowball with Zed top lane even if top is the most isolated lane.

Lastly, if you're Zed, you don't target people with QSS or Zhonyas. Of course, this goes for all Zed's mid or top, when it comes to that point you'll just fall into splitpushing (which top lane Zed excels better at than mid lane due to build and summoners) OR what people don't know is that you just ulti the tanks and help burst them down faster than your own tanks will die.

Rain NTFeb 18, 20161 votes

why try to kill tanks when you can just kill carries lol. Im not complaining though I play Zed top to sometimes and run ignite and buy mobo boots so I can get around the map faster. But imo theres just better picks, hes a decent top, but if you want a kill threat champ I rather go a different champ like maybe Irelia or Wukong or Rengar or Riven over Zed lol.

And imo knowing how to play Zed mid and top, he doesnt win top lane matchup like he does with mid lane. If Zed goes mid and snowballs, he snowballs hard. If Zed get a kill top and try to snowball, it probably wont start rolling hard IF the top laner is smart which most are in my elo. But anything works in lower elo, I've won with AD ahri and AD diana in silver elo with my smurf, thats how far behind they are in terms of fundamentals and the basics of the game.

ScumbagZedFeb 18, 20161 votes

its not considered a great pick as zed doesn't synergize with teleport as well as say a malphite or maokai with hard cc does. Most top laners carry some form of cc, and zed has none! :)

5D ParagonFeb 18, 20161 votes

{quoted}

its not considered a great pick as zed doesn't synergize with teleport as well as say a malphite or maokai with hard cc does. Most top laners carry some form of cc, and zed has none! :)

I agree, the lack of CC is his only downfall, but in the event someone like Malphite TP's down bot, your splitpush power should be enough to take down the tower fast. If the fight where Malphite TP'd seems salvageable, you just follow him and clean up, thus snowballing yourself anyways.

Zed doesn't need ignite to do damage.

ScumbagZedFeb 18, 20161 votes

Sure that might work in a bronze/silver setting, but in a better player setting running zed in top lane would be very problematic when you're playing vs. people that know that they're doing. Thus why zed top is never played in any ELO above gold & in the LCS

SwapShadowsFeb 18, 20161 votes

tbh there is almost no reason for ever going top zed over mid zed unless mid is taken....

BluePolarizerFeb 18, 20161 votes

You can pick Zed and play him like Pantheon (use cancerous Q poke and take 0 damage, while last hitting everything) that actually has an escape. However, Zed's escape top is weaker than his escape mid because it's longer from the middle of lane to his tower and there are fewer walls. On the other hand, you can easily bully melees with Q spam.