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At the moment, there's only ONE class of champions Yasuo doesn't counter

Frontline Fury··6 votes·1,093 views

Why is it okay for him to counter roughly 130 champions when similar champions like Riven, Fiora and Jax got nerfed for it?

As it stands Yasuo is a duelist that hard counters marksmen, mages, tanks, juggernauts, AD casters, melee champions and assassins.

The ONLY class he doesn't counter is the slayer class, and even there he has no true counters - all his matchups are skill based, where his opponent has to play a LOT better than Yasuo himself to actually beat him. Similar to Tryndamere, actually, except armor actually works against Tryndamere and he's hampered by long cooldowns.

Why can he do this? When similar champions like Riven, Jax and Urgot got nerfed specifically to give them weaknesses so that they wouldn't be jack of all trades? He inherently stat-checks the majority of the roster through pure base stats - to the point he can afford to build ONLY attack speed items with no additional defensive or offensive stats against heavy AD all-in champions or burst mages and still come out on top.

The game has been going in a much better direction in the two recent patches. Especially last patch, everyone seems to be enjoying the game a lot more - and the marksmen item changes have brought the adc role back into relevancy.

And now suddenly, Yasuo is THE highest win rate in comparison to pick rate champion in the game. A champion supposed to have a weak early game and distinct counters are getting super fed early game across all ranks in every single lane he is played in.

Why? Weren't the marksmen item changes (besides being much cheaper) overall a nerf to their early game, single-item power? So why is he (and not similar champions like Tryndamere) suddenly at the very top of the game?

Edit: i’m glad Yasuo is my prime concern in game balance, because it means the rest of the game is in a pretty good spot.

23 Comments

Poske5 votes

How many Yasuo games you got?

Saezio2 votes

I like how people downvote high elo players but don't reply with an argument xD

Hotarµ2 votes

People downvoted him because you don't need to play a champion to see how strong they are.

I disagree with some things that OP said since they seem overexaggerated but there's no denying that Yasuo is strong right now (Rioter's have admitted this and stated he's getting a nerf soon.) You don't need to play him to figure that out.

Saezio1 votes

If you check my other comment, I agree yasuo is strong atm. And, sure one can determine what champ is strong just by looking at winrates and pickrates most of the time. Saying a champ is strong doesn't require experience on it. But suggesting nerfs, declaring what champions he counters and in what way requires to have actually played the champ. Especially when half the stuff in OP's post are not true.

Hotarµ2 votes

But suggesting nerfs, declaring what champions he counters and in what way requires to have actually played the champ. 

No it doesn't? Why do you need playtime with a champion to think constructively about buffs or nerfs?

Going to continue using Yasuo as an example: If people have a problem with his mobility, hit his mobility or tone his damage back so he has to commit harder. If he was dying too quickly, buff his resistances. If he does too much damage, tone his damage back.

Balance is an ebb and flow and you don't need playtime to see that. I'd prefer input from dedicated mains of the champion but you don't have to be mastery 7 with 1,000 hours of playtime to say "Hey, this champion is a little too strong at the moment"

Pandemic Punch1 votes

It is like he is saying that you can't know that jumping off of a building is dangerous until you try it yourself

lol

Saezio1 votes

Well, the point is to make changes that will stick and not require constant compensation rebuffs or re-nerfs. i never said anything about mastery 7 or 1000 hours. I said "to have played the champ" be it in 2 normals or 1million ranked games. And, again, I didn't say one needs to have even 1 game on the champ to claim if they are weak/strong, I said that explaining how Yasuo counters all classes except for slayers (btw melee champions is a class I guess) when that is clearly not the case, suggests that yeah, they don't know what they are talking about. This is my opinion. Every problem needs to be addressed after we have examined all angles and PoVs if we want to have a valid opinion. Now if you think that looking only one side gives enough to disregard whatever the counter points might be, it is your right to believe that.

P.S. you can also gain insight without playing the champ by watching others play it (full games not highlight reels)

keccak2565 votes

they should just gut him to the ground for a good year or 5

xDogMeatx1 votes

pull a olaf sure i wouldnt mind it after all a good yasuo counters all champs so yes it would help alot.

huhndog1 votes

GIve 'em the Ryze treatment, so he can be in the hole where he belongs He's been in the spotlight too long

Saezio5 votes

He is at a high point atm but you are exaggerating a lot. for example, you say mages are countered by him but Annie Malzahar Karthus Veigar Lissandra Ziggs Vladimir all counter yasuo

Same with many assassins like fizz and kata

Kazekiba1 votes

{quoted}

He is at a high point atm but you are exaggerating a lot. for example, you say mages are countered by him but Annie Malzahar Karthus Veigar Lissandra Ziggs Vladimir all counter yasuo

Same with many assassins like fizz and kata

Kayle Her main damage ignores wind wall despite being ranged, her Ult counters his even if shes not directly targeted (as long as he doesnt hit multiple champs) and she has a bit of self-peel. Plus not depending on armor means his ignoring bonus armor isnt huge

Saezio1 votes

I would have included her but wanted to avoid the "Kayle is not a mage" comments :P

Hotarµ2 votes

He's got a nerf in the works right now.

Dr Dog2 votes

id care more about it if he wasnt permaed every game as usual, and yasuos i trust on me team still somehow manage to feed as usual so really nothings changed for me

iiGazeii1 votes

Yasuo is the opposite of a stat check, he's a skill check. Everything he does is telegraphed, and his kit revolves around landing a single skillshot. If you dodge the tornado, he can't do much to you, his Windwall can be baited and played around, his shield can be popped with one auto attack, his dash is dependent on minions being nearby, and he's forced to push the wave if he wants to use his abilities.

If Yasuo were a stat check, he'd just auto-win a 1v1 when you're weaker than him. Garen is a stat check.

Yasuo is a skill check because he only punishes players who can't dodge, can't manage the wave, and can't manage their spell rotations.

Its All Skillzz1 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo is the opposite of a stat check, he's a skill check. Everything he does is telegraphed, and his kit revolves around landing a single skillshot. If you dodge the tornado, he can't do much to you, his Windwall can be baited and played around, his shield can be popped with one auto attack, his dash is dependent on minions being nearby, and he's forced to push the wave if he wants to use his abilities.

If Yasuo were a stat check, he'd just auto-win a 1v1 when you're weaker than him. Garen is a stat check.

Yasuo is a skill check because he only punishes players who can't dodge, can't manage the wave, and can't manage their spell rotations.

actually yasuo can dash ontop of you an knock you up with his Q during his E, so dodging the torando only stops his long range engage, it doesnt stop him from building Q then dashing ontop of you for the free knock.

xDogMeatx1 votes

yep unlimited dashes is total skill check got it. not to mention a point and click W E Q so he never misses a ult. nice counterplay there.

iiGazeii1 votes

His dashes aren't unlimited because his targets are limited. In-between waves and in jungle/objective skirmishes, he can only dash to players. Once. If he uses his "unlimited" dashes to engage on you, he doesn't have a way out for quite some time.

His Windwall can be played around. It's cooldown is long af. Virtually anything you could bait it with besides an ult will come off cooldown before he gets another Windwall. If he's engaging/retreating or you attack a different side, Windwall does nothing.

His Q (first and second cast) is melee-range, and it's technically an AoE skillshot, not point-and-click. He chooses a direction and deals damage to everything in that area. It's not an auto-targeted ability. He can miss it. The third cast is 100% a skillshot unless he commits to being melee range with you. In order to hit you with the E+Q, he needs to throw himself at you as the skillshot, and it's still an AoE around him, not auto-targeted.

Everything he does can be avoided, predicted, or otherwise messed up. Yasuo has one of the most interactive and telegraphed kits in the game. He tells you when he has his shield ready. He tells you when he has his knockup ready. You know when and where he can dash to at all times because he launches himself a set distance in the direction of a target. His Windwall is probably the easiest cooldown to track in the game. There's no excuse for not being able to deal with him.

xDogMeatx1 votes

all he does is this dash skip minions so he doesnt run out and once he gets engaged/focused on then boop magical block all windwall which pretty much makes him tanky indirectly then his passive which is directly. now add in a Q empowered E which automatically gets a ult in it. the worst part is that everything is telegraphed and visible but theres nothing you can do its like a slow suicide happening on TV bolted to a chair forced to watch it because you want to stop it but you cant due to his magical "lol nothing can break me" windwall yasuo has more power than the defender here he can choose when they die the defenders dont have a choice but to accept it and they call it a outplay but in reality how can it be if 1 defense ability nullifies 70% (even ults) skillshots and point and click attacks it should have a ultimate based cooldown.

Frontline Fury1 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo is the opposite of a stat check, he's a skill check. Everything he does is telegraphed, and his kit revolves around landing a single skillshot. If you dodge the tornado, he can't do much to you, his Windwall can be baited and played around, his shield can be popped with one auto attack, his dash is dependent on minions being nearby, and he's forced to push the wave if he wants to use his abilities.

If Yasuo were a stat check, he'd just auto-win a 1v1 when you're weaker than him. Garen is a stat check.

Yasuo is a skill check because he only punishes players who can't dodge, can't manage the wave, and can't manage their spell rotations.

Yes, dodge the 1000 range skillshot with a hitbox twice as wide as a fully stacked Cho’gath, that can be turned into a 450-500 unit AOE... On a 2.2 second cooldown. Right...

The only champion that consistently shuts down Yasuo is Renekton, and ONLY as long as they’re even.

Garen’s Q and ult are both extremely well telegraphed, yet you consider him a stat-check rather than a skill matchup. How come? Because Yasuo’s Q is a skillshot that hits at 4 times the range of his basic attack range?

Yasuo’s shield draws minion aggro when popped, and can be recharged both in and out of combat. Similar champions have to avoid any damage for up to 16 seconds to recharge theirs. (Or did they buff Malphite’s passive? I haven’t had an opportunity to check since picking him is the same as forfeiting top lane, as armor no longer matters until mid-game provided you can get 2.5k+ hp and 300+ armor.)

I don’t know, «high skill cap» champions like Yasuo, Riven and Vayne haven’t really been feeling that high skill dependent ever since they started 2-shotting everything with their 2-item spikes and true damage out the yordle.

Bent Pixels1 votes

They buffed the crit items with the intention of bringing ADC back, which worked well. HOWEVER they probably didn't factor in how strong, if at all, Yasuo would be with these new reworked items. Obviously he is strong as fuck and does need to be nerfed, but they release patches every 2 weeks, so you can't ask for a big nerf to a champion before then.

He has a nerf coming, as Rioters have already informed us of this. Until then just ban his annoying ass so you don't have to deal with him

keccak2561 votes

since yas players like to boast "hes so complicated"

lets give him ANOTHER PASSIVE. to add to the complication. i suggest this one:

PASSIVE: Double Edged Sword: for every kill or assist yasuo gets, each members of his team (including him) is given a stack of "Double Edged Sword". Max 42 stacks. Each stack will reduce all damage dealt to enemy champions by 1.2%.

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