Let's be clear here: Kayn is not OP

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actually kayn's still quite mediocre early

and his shadow form is pretty decent

but yeah red form is fucking brutally stronk. i've straightup had like 27:1 KDAs on rhaast and usually like 3:1 or 3.50:1 on shadow form.

I'd be totally cool with rhaast getting a bit of tuning down so long as they dont gut base kayn or shadow form alongside it.

the biggest issue i have with that is kayn is supposed to have a weak early game.. but he is completely invulnerable to invades becuase of his shadow step as well as having a dash that gets him through walls even if that is on cooldown.

he can still very easily 1v1 squishy junglers. even those who have strong early games.

"weak" early game means u can take advantage of it BEFORE he becomes oppressive.. with kayn... you really CAN'T. therefore i can hardly call it "weak".

A really good Kayn can be really nasty early game. He doesn't really excel at dueling, in fact from my experiences he loses in most 1v1 matchups, however he makes it up with his exceptionally cheeky kit, which was designed to clear the jungle fast. As long as he doesn't get caught by the enemy jungler, he will be ganking and taking your jungle. He can be really oppressive due to his excellent mobility and clear.

His shadow form is a niche pick, because the team usually needs another bruiser/tank rather than another assassin. However, his shadow form is the best pick if the enemy is full of squishies and/or your team lacks damage. Not to mention that his shadow form is both a really good assassin and a really good splitpusher.

Rhaast still has the vulnerability of being focused. Unlike Shadow Kayn, his E can be virtually useless if Rhaast gets hit by slow, which means his escapes can be limited. CC is his main enemy.

And again, Kayn still relies a bit more on his team than others, because good ganking opportunities still kind of depend on your teammates. Kayn is squishy early, so ganking under tower with him is usually a suicide. If he can't gank, his transformation will be delayed. If he doesn't get to gank that specific type of players, his necessary transformation will be delayed. His transformation is really reliant on the enemy composition as well. Sometimes Shadow Assassin become available first thanks to the abundance of ranged characters on the enemy's end, but the team needs Rhast more than him, so it requires Kayn to wait 4 mins before he can get the second chance. His way of choosing his 2nd form is really clunky if you ask me.

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Yea not sure where people are getting that Kayn is OP from. He gets hardcountered by in Rhaast form, and Shadow Assassin is countered by not being a moron and going alone half way down the lane. I have a lot of experience on Kayn and I'll tell you if you ignite Rhaast and focus him down hes not that tanky.

Also stop doing the negative 5 IQ flash when I'm already ulted inside of you and you'll see a lot more success.

I want to uovite because of your last line xD, but frankly I disagree and do believe that is overtuned.

Fair point but that reduction feels a little weak when there's so much additional healing available...

• Death's Dance
• Ravenous Hunter
• Spirit Visage

To name a few.

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Rhaast is op when you're stupid enough to not build a fucking Executioner's, which is almost everyone.

Look I see what you're saying but you must know that I have to build the exact same build path in the exact same order every game. Clearly, this is on Riot.

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Rhaast is op when you're stupid enough to not build a fucking Executioner's, which is almost everyone.

That item is basically useless against him. His damage is still to overpowering, I picked up Kayn as one of my junglers. Lets just say first game 6/3 Second game 15/4 and every game after 20 kills plus- in Plat One ranked games. #balance. Morellinomicon does Nothing to stop me :)

Like honestly.

Rhaast is actually a champion.

Shadow Assassin is 4fun and only if you want to have a good chance to lose a winning game.

He got 2 seconds on his Shadow Walk, and slightly more MS on Shadow Assassin's Shadow Walk, how does that suddenly make him overbearing early game? He's still one of the few champions in the game who need multiple rotations just to fight, especially Q.

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SA is stupid broken when ahead.

Rhaast is just stupid broken.

Can't really say SA is that balanced when he can AoE destroy everything in the same frame with WQ and possibly and auto or R added in. I think half the reason why he's even considered weak is just because you can't go rhaast if you're SA lol. He's not auto lose he's just not as efficient in that you can literally do what he does as rhaast abit more slowly but way more reliably and less snowball reliant since its mostly base damage rather then ratios.

Rhaast is disgusting because he still does a boatload of damage while having the sustain and bulkiness to be unkillable. He does max health damage so everybody gets destroyed by him, not just squishies like SA, so generally he gets the job done on everything while SA just punishes full squishy comps. + a knockup which strengthens his utility/engage probability.

Shadow form is fine. If you solo extend in a lane with no peel and expect a mobile Assassin to not kill you, especially one who crosses walls, you’re at fault for getting rekt

Rhaast form is Q U I T E S T R O N G but not OP, just way too strong right now Buy an exe calling and boom hes outtie

Rhaast does better in tank metas.....tanks can't punish him early for being formless and he shreds tanks with %max health damage which penetrates MOST armor since he goes BC and CAN pick up a Dominik's together with it. Tank's are health sponges to Rhaast and would do incredibly well when 2-3 are present on a team. The ONLY way he dies is if he gets perfectly chain CC'ed and his team watches him die otherwise if they only do 95% of his health before he gets the ult off then he heals to full off their front line ESPECIALLY if he has Death's Dance.

Then improve your gameplay

have you tried buying boots? It's tied to a slow skillshot that is telegraphed. You can pretty much only hit it consistently on a target that is already CC'ed since Kayn doesn't have any way to reliably get in range to use W outside of coming out of a wall and even then you can know where he is coming from due to the orb.