"Pyke is a support champion"

chipndip1·May 14, 2018·10 votes·27,224 views

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S5rPJulCKXs

Supporting WHO again?

38 Comments

RaoulMay 14, 201812 votes

Boards: Supports are op because the protect ADCs!

RIOT: Fine, here is an support that does not protect the adc, but is a champion that instead works alone and is not ted to the ADC, so the team gets an Assassin, but loses an Enchanter.

Boards: OMG RIOT, That support can actually do stuff! OP! OP! OP!

So, what exactly ARE SUPPORTS ALLOWED TO DO? Stay in base until the game is over? They aint allowed to protect the ADC They aint allowed to be tanky They aint allowed to have tood Crowd Controle and not THEY AINT ALLOWED TO DO DAMAGE!

WHAT ARE THEY SUPPOSED TO DO TO MAKE YOU PEOPLE STOP FUCKING CRYING???????

Teridax68May 15, 201811 votes

Notice that power that was not actually the subject of discussion in this thread's OP. Rather, the criticism seems to be that Pyke has been marketed as a support, but does not have an actual supportive playstyle, as he doesn't seem to play off of his teammates more than any other solo champion in the above clip. Personally, my opinion on this is that Pyke's support elements are mostly tacked on (e.g. his anti-KS gold sharing on ult), and that there are no innate elements to his kit that have him interact with allies at all. Effectively, Riot didn't design a support-assassin hybrid, so much as just design an assassin and force a few stat-based effects to make him lane as a bot support.

RocketRelmMay 15, 20184 votes

They actually designed a Tank, but then tacked on a "you aren't doing the tank Gekko* thing fuck you" passive. So now they're going to have to buff his numbers through the roof to make him viable cause he's literally barred from building optimally.

*Gekko was an auto-incorrect thing, but I'm just gonna roll with it

RexxieeMay 15, 201810 votes

Hes anything but a support, his lore or game pattern/style is literally zed/talon, or hell even blue kayn, not anywhere close to anything related to a support.

No, hes not an "aggressive support", hes a zed that has a random passive on his ult that gives you extra gold for an assist out of the blue, and no tacking a random passive in 1 ability does not make him any more "support-like". Not even to mention that "Reseting aoe execute" and "support" are two things that will never be together in the same sentence.

I feel bad for ACTUAL support players who got basically a champ slot for their role wasted as riot preffered to cater to the 10 year old mid assasin players that sometimes get auto filled bot lane.

Teridax68May 15, 20184 votes

I agree with this. Pyke isn't an assassin-support hybrid, he's an assassin with too much crowd control and some forced stat-based power to shunt him into bot lane. He is a "support" in the exact same way that Mordekaiser's terrible rework and XP passive make him an "ADC". Even in Pyke's official gameplay introduction videos, he's visibly not doing anything special to interact with his team, and is going out on his own. There is something to be said about a support who leads, rather than follows, but Pyke doesn't even really give gameplay to his allies that any champion with displacement or hard CC doesn't already provide.

RexxieeMay 15, 20182 votes

{quoted}

I agree with this. Pyke isn't an assassin-support hybrid, he's an assassin with too much crowd control and some forced stat-based power to shunt him into bot lane. He is a "support" in the exact same way that Mordekaiser's terrible rework and XP passive make him an "ADC". Even in Pyke's official gameplay introduction videos, he's visibly not doing anything special to interact with his team, and is going out on his own. There is something to be said about a support who leads, rather than follows, but Pyke doesn't even really give gameplay to his allies that any champion with displacement or hard CC doesn't already provide.

He doesnt really lead anything, as with his mobility and stealth he'll going to want to be alone (not like immobile adcs can follow up his dashes and ms buff either).

Hes basically "an assassin with too much cc" and "hes as much support as morde is an adc", i couldnt have said it better myself.

FIDDLESTICKS B0TMay 15, 20181 votes

Couldn't disagree more with you.

Yes, he is an "aggressive support". Anyone who takes more than a minute to glance at his kit will notice that. Riot has already stated that his kit (i.e. ratios and base damage) will be tuned so that he needs help from his teammates to kill enemies. It isn't only this though, just look at his abilities. What there actually does significant damage other than his tap q? He'd need to rely on the minimal damage he gets from auto attacks and e to kill people because keep in mind that his ultimate can only execute enemies after they have already been chunked down significantly.

Overall I see him being a roaming version of someone like blitzcrank.

RocketRelmMay 15, 20182 votes

The problem is that if he needs help to kill people, he will inherently be worthless. He can't build tank, so full damage is his only option. There's enough Damage Creep in the game that you can actually go assassin on a support budget, but not if they deliberately tune him out of that. If he can't reliably 1-shot people on his own, then why not just pick a champion that can? Or pick a champion that has something relevant to offer besides 1-shots?

KaDuLeeMinSinJun 3, 20182 votes

{quoted}

I feel bad for ACTUAL support players who got basically a champ slot for their role wasted as riot preffered to cater to the 10 year old mid assasin players that sometimes get auto filled bot lane.

This. Ten times this.

MhihnjMay 14, 20185 votes

death is the best cc

chipndip1May 14, 20181 votes

Well now with this guy it's an excuse, because when Rek tagged J4, Rek got the full gold after he ulted.

VyupraxMay 14, 20185 votes

Himself

nm1010May 14, 20184 votes

He basically solo kills j4 through shen ult in the first clip xD

In the second one he DOES solo kill him

D357R0Y3RMay 14, 20183 votes

they said death is the best cc

SwiftCraneMay 14, 20181 votes

Yeah honestly if his role is support but he looks like he scales quickly into an assassin instead of someone to actually protect and support the ADC.

The problem with this is he's either going to be garbage as a support and bad as an assassin and be awful because botlane will struggle, or he'll compensate for that by being a hyperscaling assassin which imo isn't what the game needs (simply because assassins in jg and mid are already common and obnoxious)

Although I'm a little salty because I main midlane and I absolutely hate the last mid champ Zoe... I guess I was lowkey hoping this new champ would be a viable midlane mage. God knows when mid's getting another champ now...

RocketRelmMay 15, 20181 votes

Yeah honestly I'm long awaiting the day a true control mage shows up again. The closest we've gotten in years is Taliyah.

TheDeviceMay 14, 20181 votes

Yeah at first I was like... Nope. Not a support.

But when really considering his kit I think hes just a faster, squishier blitz. I think the concept is great.

The only thing I worry about is that passive. We'll just have to see.

YerroFeverMay 14, 20181 votes

I mean, Pyke didn't create the concept of a kill support...

Acheron16May 15, 20181 votes

The "support" tittle they give him is an excuse to say "he has early issues, so he needs a duo lane". Literally nothing about him is supportive, not counting his CC because CC is universally good.

They made this guy so that people have an assassin option to play when they get auto-filled into support, you know, for those guys who think playing Brand support is too easy and boring.

Vlada CutMay 15, 20181 votes

Pyke can be good for adcs who are behind because his ult allows them to come back into the game. His ult execution gives both kill and kill gold to those who assisted it...or make ahead adcs way too ahead.

PhantomPranksterMay 15, 20181 votes

yea i don't know where these morons are getting "pyke is a support" from

ManBearPygMay 30, 20181 votes

Probably from the April Champion Roadmap post that teased a new support with a darker thematic who not only saves allies from drowning but also forces enemies to drown.... https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2018/04/champion-roadmap-april-2018/

ManBearPygMay 30, 20181 votes

A bit more insight here https://www.riftherald.com/interviews/2018/5/14/17352460/pyke-design-interview-lol

"At its core, this is Pyke’s identity. He is an assassin first and support second. But that isn’t to say this his supporting capabilities are poor. When Pyke falls behind, he relies more on his crowd control and support aspects. But if he’s able to get ahead, he becomes an extra carry for the enemy team to worry about."

I FK AFKMay 30, 20181 votes

{quoted}

Probably from the April Champion Roadmap post that teased a new support with a darker thematic who not only saves allies from drowning but also forces enemies to drown.... https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2018/04/champion-roadmap-april-2018/

I don't see anything such "saving allies from drowning"

ManBearPygMay 31, 20181 votes

"We also wanted to create an aggressive playmaker, someone who doesn’t just save a drowning ally, but who forces their enemies to drown themselves… by their own hands."

As far as an ability that saves an ally....not seeing one. My hope is his damage is low and he can't dominate from minute 1. He'll probably be too strong for a few weeks then nerfed to oblivion....before being buffed up to a decent spot. Like Zoe...or every champ that gets released, lol.

6th HonedgeJul 5, 20181 votes

They are getting it from riot, you know, the people who made him.....

MakhlasMay 17, 20181 votes

Guys, pyke was intended to be a support and if he is played elsewhere I'd consider it an insult to riots design team. If you wanna know why so many people think he should be played anywhere that isn't support is be sure of this: there are very few people who main support. Everyone will claim he is best played in the role they main to use an excuse to Insta locking him on blind pick of day of release but he is clearly intended to be support. The case was exactly the same on Kayn's release - all the mid lane mains claimed he was mid, the tops did the same and so did the jungler. In retrospect, we can all look back and see he was always a jungler. Such is the case now. He IS a support so stop trying to trick yourself into thinking otherwise just cos u wanna play him - if u want him that bad do what I have done over the past 2 years and main support and good luck to all.

And furthermore, I'd like to add to what @chipndip1 originally said, ANY support if fed/ahead can easily 1v1 a jungler - I am a support main and more often than not when i pick any of my main support (Bard, Tahm, Lux, Morgana, Alistar), I have easily been able to beat the jungler and in most of these cases the opposing bot lane 2v1 - ANY fed champion is strong and Pyke is not exception

VentusDragoonMay 17, 20181 votes

Dude, I'm a support main, always have been. And this is not a support kit. Well, not a bot lane support kit at the very least. If 2 top, 1 mid, 2 bot was still a thing, he'd be a fantastic top support. His job is to roam and get kills, much like a jungler, but due to his passive and him having mostly single target damage, he can't effectively jungle, at least not early without a Tiamat or something. People will not build support items on him, and almost certainly will just go full damage. The only reason he'd ever have to build support items is that his passive will take the hp on them and put it into more damage.

This is a character that's very obviously intended to be a full assassin, but being forced into a certain place so that he doesn't go out of control (like Tank Ekko, or many other assassins.) It won't take people long to find a better place for him than support.

ManBearPygMay 30, 20181 votes

But what if he's Draven's support? $$$$

TheSeditionistJun 2, 20181 votes

His ult procs adoration!!!! The gold is so real! My pyke sup main's biggest complaint right now with draven/pyke right now is I start one shoting too early to get an execute in. I'm not even joking, those exact words.

AurelionMaths4Oct 30, 20181 votes

You are so fucking right my dude. I am also a support Main and. I have mained him for a while... He is a support and his ultimate proofs that. And for those who think he is broken, thats because they didnt played against him when he had high Ad ratios on ult. He is just basically like having a talon support but fesigned to be a support and its not supposed to be played as mid for example since he's waveclear is soooo bad and its just... If u see his abilities, its basically almost the same as tresh, a hook, a utility W, a cc E, and a R for finishing, engaging... He just builds Ad and lethality because tank him doesnt make any sense, he is basically an assasin support. Pls dony play him mid or top or some of that shit guys xd (coming from a mastery 7 pyke) :3 Pyke

RayrawrxNov 15, 20181 votes

He's actually pretty good mid if built right - I play him mid, jungle and top all the time (and support as well). Jungle pyke or top just depends on the match up but I've easily destroyed akalis, zeds, kats, lux and much more with pyke mid.

hasKeNBGMay 30, 20181 votes

that passive pyke can be jg or top he i op.i like him im gona buy him when he came in lol

TheSeditionistJun 2, 20181 votes

I'm sorry but you guys are wrong. Adc main here and since pyke has come out I've been ksed ONCE; and I was already drowning in gold. #buyanxtralongswordily. He has BUCKETS of peel that make blitzcrank look gentle, and every misplaced zed I meet who thinks Pyke stops babysitting and tries to assasinate ends up hard feeding. The support role has been playmaking damage for far too long. Zyra brand and lux are fine but this isn't??? But hey keep complaining and maybe they'll just buff him again, my new boss pays me commission no matter how much damage he does 😎.

Frost1c3Jun 11, 20181 votes

Nope, he is actually quite bad as support, there are only afew champs with the range and early damage/harass to make him useful in lane, mainly lucian, draven, ez and cait, otherwise he just sits around until late game where he can chain ults. His q is not really good (too slow and readeable) his e takes so long that if they see it and get caught they are mentally challenged and his w alerts everyone to the fact that he is invis, like wtf not even EVe has that. and due to his ) health scaling He is forced into a really irritating early game. No he needs changes and stat.

TheSeditionistJun 18, 20181 votes

My support duo is maining him rn. It's sort of like having a thresh who's also an alternate win condition who heals back up a lot like tahm bench for constant harass pressure. Your abilities are hard to land in lane but not impossible for someone who understands zoning and minion block and how to turn around an engage from a defensive end. The eventual garentee of gold gives every carry a fair chance to scale, and more often than not multiple players do as a result because of roams.

Pyke goes TopMar 21, 20191 votes

My question isn't if he's a support, but why is he not listed as any other position? I mean his sustain in top lane, assassin mid lane damage, and his gank potential kit. Why is he only under the support category? I main him top and was confused to not see him among the "top champions".