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Riots Needs to Punish People for False Reports

atomicwit··56 votes·7,495 views

I get reported a lot without harassing anyone but merely for defending myself. For example, if someone says "ur so bad... bronze 5 trash" etc., I'll type something like "actually, according to our rankings, I'm a better player than you." This is factual and logical based on what statistics can be checked and using the only objective method of determining who the better player is. This makes them rage even more and I realize that they don't like facing the truth but I'm not going to let people abuse me without challenging them when they're wrong. I get spite reports from players like this all the time just because their BS was deconstructed.

Virtually everything I get reported for is merely in response to toxic behavior. I do admit that I called some kid "incredibly pathetic" for afking a ranked game we were winning because he was mad J4 took his cs. However, even here, I think pathetic is an apt description of a person who chooses to sabotage the game for 4 others because he's mad at 1.

I once was about to mute a toxic player and typed in chat "muted and reported." He then says he's reporting me for refusing to communicate since I'm muting him.

Other times, I go non-meta picks and the raging team types stuff like "report x for trolling." It's not even an actual report category and champion choice isn't reportable according to ToS so sometimes they just report a random category in that case.

My point is, the system doesn't care very much if reports are valid or not. It just tallies the reports and then punishes you. No one is actually reading anything and verifying the reports aren't complete BS. It wouldn't even be feasible for Riot considering they have tens of millions playing online every month. This is why the system needs to be changed to check the validity of reports and/or punish those who make false reports. If you're the kind of person that fights back against toxicity (even without calling someone else an idiot, terrible, etc.) but just using logical arguments, you'll get punished as well. It makes no sense and seems incredibly stupid/flawed.

37 Comments

Handsome Jhin12 votes

Honestly, the easiest thing to do is mute them without responding (and usually not even telling them you're going to mute them). I really doubt a lot of people are going to remember or bother to report you for "not communicating" if you're not saying anything in chat.

Using "logical arguments" to fight back against toxic players is a waste of time. They don't care at all and arguing with them is just baiting them into being even more toxic toward you. There's really no better way to win an argument than to not acknowledge there's even an argument going on, IMO.

Fried Noob8 votes

The system does catch people who falsely report and their reports wind up have little to no weight in the system. If they are bad enough (i.e. they threaten reports every game) they get a ban for it.

atomicwit3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Fried Noob,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=XPEFiBuZ,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2015-04-29T04:58:58.154+0000)

The system does catch people who falsely report and their reports wind up have little to no weight in the system. If they are bad enough (i.e. they threaten reports every game) they get a ban for it.

Show me a single example of where this happened. I am very skeptical that this is the case.

Hellioning4 votes

Apart from the fact that Riot tells us this whenever someone comes to the forum and says things like 'WTF I played badly and everyone on my team said to report me, am I going to be banned'?

atomicwit2 votes

{quoted}

Apart from the fact that Riot tells us this whenever someone comes to the forum and says things like 'WTF I played badly and everyone on my team said to report me, am I going to be banned'?

Getting banned and getting chat restricted are entirely different things.

Hellioning3 votes

That's irrelevant. What I'm saying is that Riot has a system to track false reports, and people that give false reports often have their reports devalued.

Mathbalnase2 votes

'Reports devalued' is not 'player consistently logging false reports themselves punished'

Hellioning3 votes

Are they hurting anyone by logging their false reports? Since the reports are devalued, they are not.

Hell, having it be known that 'if you report falsely a lot you will get banned' might result in people not reporting people that might be banworthy because they don't want to get punished.

CATS OF THE RIFT1 votes

I was under the impression that the tribunal watches the games and gets an overview of everything going on in the game, that way they don't falsely ban anyone (unless you AFK, then you automatically get banned temporarily and placed in a low priority queue).

Hellioning3 votes

That's how the tribunal usually works, but it's out of commission until they can fix it (don't expect it to be fixed anytime soon, it's been down for a while.)

Now, it's automated for chat bans (you get a certain amount of good reports, you get chat punishments) but bans (both temp and perm) are overseen by Rioters.

atomicwit5 votes

{quoted}

Are they hurting anyone by logging their false reports? Since the reports are devalued, they are not.

Hell, having it be known that 'if you report falsely a lot you will get banned' might result in people not reporting people that might be banworthy because they don't want to get punished.

They're devalued if they do it a lot. Their report power is nearly intact if they only make blatantly false reports occasionally (perhaps only out of spite).

There is no system verifying the accuracy of the reports, it's just whether there is statistical agreement. We could all agree you're a witch but that doesn't make it true. You should see how some toxic duos treat reporting.

Moreover, I think there's a bigger problem with people making false reports than not reporting enough. I see report requests almost every other game when someone does really badly in a game. It's usually "report X feeding/trolling" even when they are clearly trying and not dying on purpose. Sometimes I see those report requests for non-meta picks even when the player performs adequately. Poor champion choice isn't a report category but that doesn't stop people.

yukonl7 votes

{quoted}

I'll type something like "actually, according to our rankings, I'm a better player than you." This is factual and logical based on what statistics can be checked and using the only objective method of determining who the better player is.

I once was about to mute a toxic player and typed in chat "muted and reported."

If you've been reported, and you've done nothing wrong, you won't get punished.

I had many players threatening to report me, but I haven't received a single punishment to this day.

Oh and also, that entitled attitude of yours (I'm the better player, "muted and reported") pisses me off like the players who type in "ez" after games whether I win or lose.

There's no point in saying you're the better player even with evidence or saying muted and reported because all you're doing is making it worse for everyone on your team and yourself.

If the tribunal was back and the community saw you saying things like that, you would receive a lot more punishments than if you just presented the report to the system Riot put up.

Eraest973 votes

For example, if someone says "ur so bad... bronze 5 trash" etc., I'll type something like "actually, according to our rankings, I'm a better player than you."

He never said he was the better player. He said according to the logic of the toxic player, the lower rank you are the worse you are. So OP is using the toxic player's logic against him. Never say he was, just saying that according to the toxic player's logic, OP is better than him.

atomicwit1 votes

{quoted}

If you've been reported, and you've done nothing wrong, you won't get punished.

I had many players threatening to report me, but I haven't received a single punishment to this day.

Oh and also, that entitled attitude of yours (I'm the better player, "muted and reported") pisses me off like the players who type in "ez" after games whether I win or lose.

There's no point in saying you're the better player even with evidence or saying muted and reported because all you're doing is making it worse for everyone on your team and yourself.

If the tribunal was back and the community saw you saying things like that, you would receive a lot more punishments than if you just presented the report to the system Riot put up.

There is no entitled attitude and I'm not even sure what you mean by that. I would only type any of that if I'm harassed and if it's objectively true. If someone says "u suck, noob adc, go back to Bronze 5" then yeah I'll say "muted and reported." That's exactly what they deserve. I don't mind advice or even players being unhappy with my performance but it can be written in a less antagonistic way.

Likewise, if that player who keeps telling me I suck all game is ranked worse, I will point that out because he's being a hypocrite and everyone has bad games sometimes. This is simply keeping people in check and grounding the situation in reality. I would hope someone would do the same to me if I let my ego get out of line. Although, I don't think I'm a great player anyway.

Perhaps my comments are unnecessary but they are also not harassment and I don't think LoL is Soviet Russia. I'm allowed to express an opinion. If someone's comments are condescending and antagonistic to the extreme, I feel no qualms about exposing contrary facts.

However, I will never go out of my way to point someone's lower ranking out etc. if they do not harass me. Thus, if I sound like a dick, it's only because someone else is being a dick to me. Moreover, I never cross the line to the point of violating ToS even though I get reported by said player. Responding to "u suck" with "you're actually ranked worse than me" might be annoying but it is not against ToS.

BTW: Many people don't actually report when they say they'll report you. I sometimes don't either if a player stopped being a jerk or if I simply forget. Make no mistake though, the punishments are indeed automatic. The bans might not be but that's as far as it goes.

Laisenberg7 votes

you sound like a dick.

atomicwit5 votes

After many demands for chat logs upon my chat restriction, I've gotten a response. Here is the amazing toxicity I was punished for with the full logs:

[0:51] Me: waiting on potion [3:21] Me: 3 troll promo games ina row [5:29] Me: cant dos ht [5:59] Me: no man, normalyl its no sissu3e [6:04] Me: he got that lucky kill and hes snowballing [6:17] Me: dangerous game saved him [6:45] Me: you dare to talk? [6:54] Me: lolll [6:56] Me: yes you did [7:04] Me: and you were also lane [7:05] Me: late [7:10] Me: shes 0 1 [7:38] Me: yeah i get turret dived [7:40] Me: nothing i can do [7:44] Me: you want me to stop then come here [9:01] Me: you fed him almost as much [9:11] Me: you talk after being late to lane??/ seriously [9:12] Me: muted [9:20] Me: yes due to dangerous game [9:24] Me: and then he snowbalsl [9:34] Me: you are the kind of player Tribunal was made for [9:51] Me: im amazed you're not chat restricted yet [10:04] Me: msut be someone else's account hoenstly [11:05] Me: gonna get turret divd soon [11:12] Me: will die 100% [11:38] Me: annie, maybe carry if you're gonna talk sht at the very least [11:59] Me: yup, it's called snowballing [12:05] Me: did you even watch? i died in less than 1 sec [12:14] Me: you're almost the same score and had jg help [12:18] Me: muted [12:23] Me: finally got around to it [12:28] Me: you're not even ranked well [12:44] Me: i have 64% winrate as singed and it's just an unlucky game from that first kill [12:55] Me: rengar snowballs harder than lb [13:01] Me: if she says anything of value, tell me [13:04] Me: otherwise, i keep her muted [13:06] Me: pure cancer [13:28] Me: probabyl some loser teengage kid so not worth wasting time on [13:39] Me: just trying to make himself feel important by talking sht [13:43] Me: pathetic really [15:21] [All] Me: i'm the only one that died to him, and I def. got any help at all when i said he 1 shots me now [15:39] [All] Me: it's all off that 1 kill without trade due to dangerous game and he just snowballs after [15:48] [All] Me: all the other deaths were basically under turret [16:27] [All] Me: and i have to deal with nonstop annie harass too... most toxic player I've ever seen... dares to talk after being late [16:35] [All] Me: good thing I muted [16:48] [All] Me: welcome to my world [17:06] [All] Me: he could do that basically after 1 kill [17:16] [All] Me: lol he was [17:21] [All] Me: i got turret dived 4x lmao [17:23] [All] Me: he did [17:34] [All] Me: ask him [17:50] [All] Me: any jg help ever could have traded some of those [18:38] [All] Me: unless I have ult and can react, i get 1 shot

All things considered this isn't the most toxic chat log I've seen. However that's why you only received restrictions and not a game ban. The issue here is that you keep arguing and putting down other players. Calling them cancer and losers is not helping you win the game and it isn't helping them improve their behavior.

Here is my response to Riot:

I see little that merits a report there (in context) or is violating ToS.

All I see is opinions and responses to harassment from toxic players (which would be evident if the statements were presented in context). For example "you fed him almost as much" is clearly a response to someone accusing another player of feeding an enemy carry. "probabyl some loser teengage kid so not worth wasting time on... just trying to make himself feel important by talking sht... pathetic really" is a response to a player harassing our whole team, intentionally feeding and later afking. Note, I did not even call him a loser but merely stated a likelihood based on observed behavior so that the team stops focusing on him and plays the game instead. And yes, I stand by calling this sort of behavior pathetic. It is an opinion with a firm foundation. "3 troll promo games ina row" is a reaction to getting DCs or incredibly one-sided games. "you dare to talk?" is a response to a player harassing our team after being DC for 10 minutes.

These are either factual statements or opinions. There is nothing inherently toxic in any of these statements unless Riot believes thought control is a good thing and that I am not allowed to express opinions. It's not even retaliation. Retaliation would be akin to person A stating: you're an idiot and then me responding "you're a dipshit" etc. I guarantee I've been called an idiot many times in those chat logs and yet at no point, did I respond likewise. A lot of this is merely describing reality and explaining my course of action. For example:

[13:01] Me: if she says anything of value, tell me [13:04] Me: otherwise, i keep her muted [13:06] Me: pure cancer

A player is harassing me and I'm asking the team to relay any potentially useful information. I also describe the atmosphere created by this player as "pure cancer." This is my opinion and I believe if the chat logs for said player were included, you'd agree. I see absolutely nothing wrong with this.

I am allowed to express opinions and I see not a shred of evidence that I violated anything in ToS or was even toxic. Some of these are negative statements but that is merely a reflection of reality not for the sake of bringing people down. Negative attitude is more applicable to people typing "gg surrender" after first-blood etc., not when we have a person harassing us, intentionally feeding and then afking. You can't pigeonhole all negative statements as negative attitude when the circumstances are not equivalent.

At no point did I call anyone a bad player, idiot, etc. or initiate any sort of quarrel. The only negative statements that were even presented are obviously in response to toxic players and negative situations (merely descriptions of reality).

atomicwit2 votes

Other's opinions on this?

x No Heart1 votes

{quoted}

After many demands for chat logs upon my chat restriction, I've gotten a response. Here is the amazing toxicity I was punished for with the full logs: Here is my response to Riot:

I see little that merits a report there (in context) or is violating ToS.

All I see is opinions and responses to harassment from toxic players (which would be evident if the statements were presented in context). For example "you fed him almost as much" is clearly a response to someone accusing another player of feeding an enemy carry. "probabyl some loser teengage kid so not worth wasting time on... just trying to make himself feel important by talking sht... pathetic really" is a response to a player harassing our whole team, intentionally feeding and later afking. Note, I did not even call him a loser but merely stated a likelihood based on observed behavior so that the team stops focusing on him and plays the game instead. And yes, I stand by calling this sort of behavior pathetic. It is an opinion with a firm foundation. "3 troll promo games ina row" is a reaction to getting DCs or incredibly one-sided games. "you dare to talk?" is a response to a player harassing our team after being DC for 10 minutes.

These are either factual statements or opinions. There is nothing inherently toxic in any of these statements unless Riot believes thought control is a good thing and that I am not allowed to express opinions. It's not even retaliation. Retaliation would be akin to person A stating: you're an idiot and then me responding "you're a dipshit" etc. I guarantee I've been called an idiot many times in those chat logs and yet at no point, did I respond likewise. A lot of this is merely describing reality and explaining my course of action. For example:

[13:01] Me: if she says anything of value, tell me [13:04] Me: otherwise, i keep her muted [13:06] Me: pure cancer

A player is harassing me and I'm asking the team to relay any potentially useful information. I also describe the atmosphere created by this player as "pure cancer." This is my opinion and I believe if the chat logs for said player were included, you'd agree. I see absolutely nothing wrong with this.

I am allowed to express opinions and I see not a shred of evidence that I violated anything in ToS or was even toxic. Some of these are negative statements but that is merely a reflection of reality not for the sake of bringing people down. Negative attitude is more applicable to people typing "gg surrender" after first-blood etc., not when we have a person harassing us, intentionally feeding and then afking. You can't pigeonhole all negative statements as negative attitude when the circumstances are not equivalent.

At no point did I call anyone a bad player, idiot, etc. or initiate any sort of quarrel. The only negative statements that were even presented are obviously in response to toxic players and negative situations (merely descriptions of reality).

Just...lol. I don't understand how people like you justify what you say to people.

AMYS GRAVE1 votes

If you would type less and play more you might have been able to do something that game.

atomicwit4 votes

I find their comments really unfair/inaccurate and that's why I respond. If it's legitimate but written in a toxic way, I actually won't bother to argue about it (let's say I got caught or made a bad engage). Even if it's a waste of time to respond when unfairly harassed, I shouldn't get reported unless I retaliate and am toxic to them. For instance, if I say "u suck, stfu," "you're an idiot," etc. I fully merit a report. However, I never say things like that. I simply deal with the content of their argument.

I still remember a game where one guy raged that I missed my Jinx ult from halfway across the map a few times. The players moved and I can't predict with full certainty where they'll go. I told him that it's a dodgeable ability and he shouldn't have expectations of it hitting a lot. He continues with stuff like "that's cause ur bad, just admit it" and blames me constantly. You can miss an ability or it can be dodged - 2 ways of looking at it. After the game, he asks for reports on "negative attitude" since I'm not "taking responsibility." Basically, he wants me to admit that I suck (and I'm sure I do compared to high ELO players but Jinx ults. aren't the main reason for it). I don't see how not admitting/disagreeing you played something badly falls under negative attitude but apparently it does. This kind of stuff happens way too much.

jgarna1437504 votes

The only time I respond to things like this is when someone is telling the other team to report me, which happens about 80% of the time when I'm doing bad. The players flaming me for my lack of skill then goes on to report me for negative attitude. It seems that the only report warnings I get are for negative attitude, and that is insane. If your going to report someone, do it for the right thing. I've gotten a plethora of chat restrictions because I didn't play the jungler that someone wanted me to, and then got reported for negative attitude, or I didn't do so well, and got reported for negative attitude. That's bullshit. No other way to put it. How the hell are you supposed to get better at the game if your getting punished and harassed for a lack of skill?

ModUlanopo3 votes

http://forums.na.leagueoflegends.com/board/showthread.php?t=4086541

Almost all of this information is still valid, including the information about the report weighting system.

atomicwit3 votes

I just had it happen again. I was harassed the whole game by a toxic top "noob adc etc. all game" and basically the only thing I typed was "muted and reported." Why did I type that? Honestly, it's less just to get them to stop and more because I want them to know that justice is coming. It's cathartic.

I didn't harass anyone or anything of that sort. After the lobby, he continued to be toxic and I reported him but got a message indicating I was reported as well. The spite reports are just getting ridiculous and it's completely unfair. I even got a chat restriction for the first time in months due to this nonsense. Just because I let a player know I'm reporting him and he spite reports should NOT lead to punishments for me. I'm probably getting punished as much as the ragers.

Meep Man1 votes

If you report someone and only you report the person, then they won't get banned and the worth of your reports goes down, making their fake reports irrelevant.

Epilogue of Life1 votes

To the top with this. Tired of people feeding, raging, AND reporting at the same time

Drunk Rummate1 votes

Here's a thought: Don't humor them with a response.

Just report them and move on with your life. It's probably just a kid anyways, he'll grow out of it eventually.

Discoinfernape1 votes

Man I'm sorry Bro, Riot's system sucks. I play so many games with people who deserve instant bans, and they don't get it because they're spending all their time restricting people like you who don't deserve it at all. I'm sorry brah, this is ridiculous.

thepay31 votes

Anybody know when the actual tribunal will be up again?

atomicwit1 votes

{quoted}

Anybody know when the actual tribunal will be up again?

I don't think Riot made an announcement about it. It's definitely in the works. I hope to see it soon because the current system isn't working well for anyone.

thepay31 votes

{quoted}

I don't think Riot made an announcement about it. It's definitely in the works. I hope to see it soon because the current system isn't working well for anyone.

yeah

Neo Cyrus1 votes

They already confirmed they do. If someone sends a massive amount of reports that never result in anything, they can get a ban for it, it has happened. Obviously the system needs improvement since there are too many false reports but at least the basic iteration of it is there.

atomicwit1 votes

I was playing the entire time and there is no rule against typing. Some people are able to type quite fast and find time in between recalls, death timers or other moments of down-time. In fact, if I wanted to, I could type a full sentence just in-between CS without missing. Don't presume to know the situation or how my typing affected play. The quality of my play isn't under discussion though and I've never claimed to be a great player.

As far as people getting banned for false reports, I highly doubt that and I don't think you could link to a single case of this ever happening. Riot also mentions Tribunal when issuing automated punishments and we all know that doesn't exist anymore.

JasonSunleaf1 votes

Yeah but how i deal with people that keeps reporting you for "bad build". I mean I know the most suitable items for every champion, but i get bored of it and i want to try something new, and it's no fun in playing co-op and i still don't get the idea why people forget that this is just a game (I'm talking about classic and the other mobs, rank I understand that some people want to stay focus). What do they think that they can achieve at winning or losing. NOTHING. Is just a game to get relax and stuff. If your so great go to rank and play there. I rarely go rank for the reason of meeting crybabies, sure you can mute them, but the point of this game is to strategies with your team to play. Well i feel better now that i release a little my anger, sorry for my crybaby moment.

OVCO1 votes

I had a game which we lost but i have said only one thing and it was not offence :O and after the game BAM reported for saying bad words :O

seriesido1 votes

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Galgigrin1 votes

Can someone tell me that what to do when my internet connection broke for some reason and afterward I log-in but some player has reported about me, that I left the game in middle and I get penalty for that how to tell Riot that it was not my fault ? and remove the penalty ?

Çhåryzård1 votes

I thought, at least in certain categories of reports, the system looks for certain words that were used in chat.

So like if someone decides to report you for harassment and you never spoke to them all game, the system doesn't find you using any words considered toxic and throws out the report.

Idk

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