Boards›Gameplay

Ziggs does "no damage"

atomicwit·9/21/2016, 12:59:39 AM·69 votes·6,596 views

He can't stall games for 50+ min after the new Baron was added and his ult. no longer instantly waveclears since its bonus damage vs minions was removed. Basically, the biggest reason to pick Ziggs in the past is gone now (good riddance) and the tower execute doesn't make him strong enough to be a worthwhile pick.

His poke is potentially decent but it's too easy to dodge for it to be that scary. In lane, he has basically zero kill pressure vs competent mids and thus fairly low snowball potential while being pretty free vs some popular mids like Ahri. His waveclear is fine but not even best in class. Viktor can do it better while having way more burst and CC. His escape is nice but its unreliability makes it no better than just having a hard CC spell.

I don't think Ziggs is ever the best choice in a teamcomp atm and the main reason is that he doesn't snowball as well as other mids while also not having a dominating late game. He needs slightly better scaling. His CC is pretty low so his damage needs to make a great impact.

90 Comments

zecastar9/21/2016, 3:13:25 AM27 votes

Ziggs actually has the 2nd highest damage in the game but it doesn't make much of a difference. He has a high range on Q but the effective range if you want a real shot at doing ANY damage is ~750. He's mainly hitting frontline tanks with good regen. Even if he does hit the random Ezeal, Ziggs can't continue to whittle down the same target. Meanwhile, Ezreal will likely lifesteal back all the damage before a teamfight even starts.

Ziggs poke is random rather than surgical like Xerath's. He just hopes to do any damage rather than meaningful damage since it doesn't pass through units like Xerath's does. Plus, Xerath can force a squishy he poked completely away from an objective due to his ult. Ziggs' Qs will almost never hit the back-line and if they do, it's not repeatable. I'd say this inability to really target who you want is part of Ziggs' "crazy" image but it's a big weakness and his numbers would need to be a lot better to overcome it. Even Ahri's poke is actually better because her Q can pass through the tanks and mess up that pretty little Ezreal's face.

Zirzon9/21/2016, 2:01:49 AM25 votes

I'd just like a revert to the hitbox nerf they did way back. He's always felt worse to play as ever since, due to his Q being completely unreliable on anything non-stationary.

PrometheS9/21/2016, 1:25:15 AM16 votes

Ziggs isn't exactly bad, he just isn't strong enough to merit ever being picked. He needs a Corki level buff... aka just a nudge in the right direction. Otherwise, he'll remain at a 2% playrate in Plat+ which is just the people who really enjoy his personality and kit. I guess the other way he'd get more play is if all 20 mids who are better than him are brought down to his level.

He's kind of in a funny spot. His skillfloor is in the middle but his skillcap is very high (sort of like an Ezreal). Unfortunately, even for those who are near the skillcap, he won't be the type of champion to hard carry the way a LB or Syndra can. Ziggs is the definition of balanced or slightly underpowered.

Poske9/21/2016, 9:57:25 AM8 votes

As A Ziggs main everything this guy said is true

His waveclear is mediocore atm and he isnt going to stall anything vs baron and season6 winning team automatic lane pushing
His poke is a joke. Xerath Q is 5 times easier to hit. Varus Q same. They also have way longer range
His zone. He doesnt have a zone at all. Everyone knows he is gimmicky and none is afraid to be near him
His global ultimate is not global. It wont hit anything if you try to use it outside of 3k range. well except minions
His satchel charge is gimmicky. You dont want to splitpush with ziggs since he ll lose 1vs1 to 90% of champions and he already has passive for pushing
His abilities do pathetic dmg
His abilities have rather short range due to delay, bouncing bomb speed (Its like 370 just move backwards wont reach you)

Hibeki9/21/2016, 5:26:07 AM6 votes

Ziggs was a problem pre nerf because Athene's enabled him to do what he did. Now that Athene's doesn't exist and everyone in the game has mobility to catch his ass, he should really be reverted.

Supreme Senpai699/21/2016, 6:32:18 AM6 votes

His W passive can't really be used. If a tower is under 25% HP chances are it's gonna be taken within a couple more seconds anyway

MunchCrunchLunch9/21/2016, 10:28:24 AM4 votes

ziggs damage is random. he does usually the most damage in a match. but much like teemo. its random and it doesn't really give you any sort of advantage. he usually whittles down people to half hp. they sit back and regen it with lifesteal or other forms of regen. and most of his damage is absorbed by tanks.

also PS i found it really nice to get tear on ziggs. rod of ages and morrelos is def a lot of mana. and is enough but if u wanna spam go for an early tear. since ap. doesn't really help him a lot early on. he relies mostly on Q base damage

Wheatloaf9/21/2016, 4:45:30 AM4 votes

He's supposed to be unreliable against champions, but maybe that's too unreliable atm. I definitely don't think straight damage buffs are what he needs (though he may still need damage buffs; just not only damage buffs).

The Deckowner9/21/2016, 4:45:26 AM3 votes

Ziggs is very strong against players who don't know ho to play against him, but other wise Champions like Xerath/varus are much more consistant and does similar things

his ult does kind of oneshots enemy squishies tho.

Tobias Brackner9/21/2016, 11:44:26 PM3 votes

Nah, Ziggs does plenty of damage and has strong utility for teamfights, picks, and waveclear.

Git gud.

Rock MD9/22/2016, 12:27:36 AM3 votes

Ziggs' entire kit isn't for damage, it's for zoning.

Because if you land a single Q you knock a squishy down 33-50% of their health. Ult is around 70-80%.

He's fine he just has a different playstyle, because if he could reliably land Q's he would be the most disgustingly powerful midlaner in the game.

Akali is SO HOT9/21/2016, 4:27:20 AM3 votes

Because it's really fun trying to siege against Ziggs when he's strong.

Hyperiön9/21/2016, 12:27:58 PM2 votes

Just revert ziggs back to when they nerfed his hitbox on Q, and the dmg reduction oh minefield.

ofart10/1/2016, 2:11:26 AM2 votes

QQ no Ziggs at Worlds.

H2k did troll hover him and get my hopes up though. I guess it's a lot like hovering Teemo for top.

A little Peepo9/21/2016, 8:41:17 AM2 votes

I don't really think his problem is much of "he deals no damage" but rather that they removed mama regeneration from his core items which really crippled him in lane. Don't get me wrong the item changes were not bad but some champions benefit more out of mana regen than flat mana and ziggy was one of those champions.

Ziggs depended on harassing his enemy in lane with endless poke so chalice/Athenes allowed him to do all of that but now with him not building that item he can only do so much before he goes oom. In all consideration they should have given him smaller mana costs to compensate for the fact that they removed mana regeneration from his build... not every mage is annie, viktor, ahri,ect who benefit from straight up mana more than mana regeneration.

Sire Hippington9/21/2016, 10:49:35 AM2 votes

honestly, i have no issues with his numbers, his damage potential is fine as it is. The one big issue i have with ziggs is how hard it is to land his main damage spell. The nerfs to his Q-hitbox in the past just killed him imo. However, just reverting it wouldn't be grate aswell i guess, since the old hitbox gave a very dominant laneingphase. So maybe some base damages nerfs and buffs to the ratio whil reverting or atleast buffing the hitbox might work. But right now, he just doesn't feel right, landing his Qs on competent opponents once they have tier-2 boots is close to a miracle.

DunkinNoobs9/21/2016, 4:19:19 AM2 votes

I usually just ult their adc for 80% of their health. But what do I know?

Mogarl9/21/2016, 5:01:25 AM1 votes

The problem with Ziggs, is that if he get's ahead he is extremely bullshit. Not because of crazy poke (as has been said it's fairly random), but because of his zero cast time. I've seen a fed ziggs flash into my team, die instantly, but still manage to kill two people when he point blanks them with every ability. This leads to what I see as the actual problem with Ziggs, he has no cast times so if he has enough damage to kill you in one rotation you will die instantly.

While I hate laning against Ziggs any time he's anywhere near strong, I don't care what kinds buffs they give him if they put cast times on the little shit. However without some kind of cast times I personally don't think Ziggs should be put in a spot where he can snowball like some other mages.

Elisheva9/21/2016, 3:20:42 AM1 votes

It's adorable that you really believe some of what you typed.