Welp, We're screwed.
-Mordekaiser's perma banned at a competitive level -He's unfun to play against -Ghostcrawler has mentioned that Mordekaiser's an issue -Pro players were asked what they would change in the game (Mordekaiser being removed is a common answer) -His solo laning is still dumpstered
I seriously an't wait for an official Riot response on the matter 'cause I fear for Morde's future in the game and how he'll be handled. Hue...
Ignis066 votesI don't understand why Riot just doesn't revert all morde changes to pre-juggernaught changes. They can then just dump him in line for another rework with yorick and poppy and shit. This would be better than what they're doing now with him.
Helmight54 votesRiot generally doesn't revert reworks, especially not large ones like the Mordekaiser rework. I don't know why - maybe because it's tantamount to admitting that they fucked up in the worst way possible? - but they are assured to keep Morde around in his current state until they can find a way to balance his kit.
What's most likely to happen is that Morde's numbers will get gutted, leaving him nigh-unplayable, until a new Mordekaiser rework comes around five years from now.
Or, you know, they could just remove the free XP passive and the dragon ghost - but no, that would be too easy.
Malicious Metal30 votesThe sad thing is that this is the most likely outcome... And I thought having him reworked was the worst part. I hate being proven wrong...
Helmight22 votesMan, the rework COULD have been so good for Mordekaiser. Making him more dependent on Q instead of E gives him more counterplay in lane and removes his lane bully presence. The W changes were silly, but at least they did a few useful things for Morde - like giving him sustain.
But then Morde just got shit piled on top of him with the rest of the rework for no godly reason. The free XP passive literally could be slapped on any champion to make them viable in the bottom lane, and the dragon ghost is a gimmick more than anything.
BetaDude4022 votesBut then Morde just got shit piled on top of him with the rest of the rework for no godly reason.
You just described CertainlyT's design philosophy in one sentence.
Helmight21 votesI generally defend CertainlyT, since I think he has unique ideas, but in this case I think he reached a little too far. The XP passive has no reason, thematically or gameplay-wise, to be present on Morde's kit. It's only reason for existing is because CT wanted to shove Mordekaiser into the bottom lane - and that, I really can't defend. I'm all for making champions geared for a particular role, but flat-out forcing a champion into the position is frankly bad design.
BetaDude408 votesI mean, I know the guy gets more hate than Donald Trump's entire career, but some of the things he does is absolutely atrocious. He has unique ideas, but he uses all of those ideas on one champion instead of several champions. Like, why does Kalista have SO MUCH in her kit? And it's not even an issue with the huge amount of things, either. Her power budget is just so seemingly inflated with all of this crap that she's either impossible to use or absolutely dominates all competition not purposefully picked to counter her. Like, against other ADCs, she's pretty meh. Her range isn't excellent, so people like Caitlyn just sit back and harass, assuming the opposing side isn't capable of retaliating. Against short-range bruisers and mages with skillshots, she turns into an ungodly monster that you beat your computer screen in over. And it makes sense for the interactions of different roles between champs, but Kalista just flat-out hard counters any melee without a gapcloser or reliable (possibly a luckily landed) form of CC.
CT has a good mind, and he can think outside the box really well. But, really, you gotta know what's inside the box first before you can think of going outside of it.
Hyrum Graff10 votesI mean, I know the guy gets more hate than Donald Trump's entire career, but some of the things he does is absolutely atrocious. He has unique ideas, but he uses all of those ideas on one champion instead of several champions. Like, why does Kalista have SO MUCH in her kit? And it's not even an issue with the huge amount of things, either. Her power budget is just so seemingly inflated with all of this crap that she's either impossible to use or absolutely dominates all competition not purposefully picked to counter her. Like, against other ADCs, she's pretty meh. Her range isn't excellent, so people like Caitlyn just sit back and harass, assuming the opposing side isn't capable of retaliating. Against short-range bruisers and mages with skillshots, she turns into an ungodly monster that you beat your computer screen in over. And it makes sense for the interactions of different roles between champs, but Kalista just flat-out hard counters any melee without a gapcloser or reliable (possibly a luckily landed) form of CC.
CT has a good mind, and he can think outside the box really well. But, really, you gotta know what's inside the box first before you can think of going outside of it.
outside the box? I want him inside the box!
A Miss Fortune2 votesCertainlyT in a nutshell.
Chromatic Eagle3 votesBelieve or not people actually like the current Morde, and Cass, and Karma. I agree that a lot of these reworks are bad, but that's generally the reason. Also it's not like they can flip a switch and revert them. It takes time.
Helmight14 votesI understand those people - after all, I'm one of them in regards to the Cassiopeia and Karma reworks. However, those two characters kept generally the same playstyle and aren't nearly as toxic as the current Mordekaiser is. Riot has just about admitted that the Morde rework was a mistake, while with Cass and Karma it was just a question of scope.
I don't actually want a revert to the old Mordekaiser, as that was unhealthy for the game as well. Instead, I just want Riot actively working on the issue and iterating Mordekaiser on the PBE, instead of the near-constant radio silence we've had about his issues. Morde's rework has a lot of things I like - it's just a question of getting rid of the toxic elements he's been given.
ScurvyNave7 votesI understand those people - after all, I'm one of them in regards to the Cassiopeia and Karma reworks. However, those two characters kept generally the same playstyle and aren't nearly as toxic as the current Mordekaiser is. Riot has just about admitted that the Morde rework was a mistake, while with Cass and Karma it was just a question of scope.
I don't actually want a revert to the old Mordekaiser, as that was unhealthy for the game as well. Instead, I just want Riot actively working on the issue and iterating Mordekaiser on the PBE, instead of the near-constant radio silence we've had about his issues. Morde's rework has a lot of things I like - it's just a question of getting rid of the toxic elements he's been given.
This is just like the terrible Cass rework last year that happened right before/during worlds. Riot's too busy hyping up LCS shit and Worlds to be busy trying to fix Morde. It's already too late for the pros anyways the patch their playing on is just *@#$ed balance wise and now Riots committed to these changes despite people screaming at them for 4 patches in a row.
But don't worry at least CertainlyT had nothing to do with kindred and Tahm kench so theres at least some sane people in the champ creation team.
Hyrum Graff3 voteskept generally the same playstyle
Canastus would like a word with you.
Ardond4 votesto be fair Karma and Cass we pretty consistent in playstyle compared to Mord. Both kept the same lane and their same mage type (high poke damage and high constant damage respectively), in the mean time Mord was forced to duo lane and rely on auto attacks.
chriserit2 votesEeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee.
Don't think i need to add anything else
chriserit3 votesCassio didnt kept the same playstyle at all. She just turned into an e spammer removing everything from all the other abilities. It's like if syndra do damage, sustain and everything else just with her stun with everything else gutted (even ult).
Anyway prob you dont remember cassio pre nerf. Not even zed could lane with her (and he was pretty op). Whoever was near enough to her was nuked down with her e spam. If you tried to fight her you were dead (even because you cant dodge neither her e nor her w).
And should i remember you all the sustain they gave her (and that needed) just to make her able to move next to your enemy and spam your e? With all that sustain so could stay in lane 24/7 and that was toxic as hell as well.
killd0zer4 votesComputer Engineers have huger pride because their games are literally their identity
admitting they messed up means they aren't good at their job.
Helmight7 votesI can understand the pride involved, but admitting you messed up doesn't mean that you're bad at the job. It just means that you made a mistake - happens to all of us. We're only human, after all.
Prophet of Decay7 votesActually, admitting your failure is GOOD! It shows you still want to learn and become better. The fact that they keep Mordekaiser and the rest the broken way they are, without admitting they broke their kits, only puts them in the worst spotlight.
Audiomancy5 votesI don't understand why Riot just doesn't revert all morde changes to pre-juggernaught changes. They can then just dump him in line for another rework with yorick and poppy and shit. This would be better than what they're doing now with him.
Because that would mean they'd have to admit they were wrong. And of course, Riot is never wrong! Just look at all their other successful reworks like 
and 
. Nothing bad ever came out of those!
/sarcasm
Shonjl1 votesWhat about Viegar and Ahri? They seem pretty fine and same as they were before. Sure Fiora is a bit oppressive but she is not that hard to shut down and unlike say Darius that can always come back, once she is down she stays down, she doesn't have tankiness to fall back on. Cass is meh, she is basically nonexistant but even then its probably because she is boring, all she does is spam E and that probably isnt fun. At least another champ people cry about, being Riven or Vayne actually have to do things to kill someone, not just E. As for Nidalee, its just how messed up she is. I am glad her spear does crap damage now since there was no excuse it could do ult levels of damage on a very low cd, and her cat form cost no mana to use. Just add mana on cat moves and give her some damage back on her spear and she will be fine.
Audiomancy2 votesWhat about Viegar and Ahri? They seem pretty fine and same as they were before. Sure Fiora is a bit oppressive but she is not that hard to shut down and unlike say Darius that can always come back, once she is down she stays down, she doesn't have tankiness to fall back on. Cass is meh, she is basically nonexistant but even then its probably because she is boring, all she does is spam E and that probably isnt fun. At least another champ people cry about, being Riven or Vayne actually have to do things to kill someone, not just E. As for Nidalee, its just how messed up she is. I am glad her spear does crap damage now since there was no excuse it could do ult levels of damage on a very low cd, and her cat form cost no mana to use. Just add mana on cat moves and give her some damage back on her spear and she will be fine.
When Veigar was originally reworked, he was trash. Literally complete and utter Veigarbage. Then he was buffed over time, leading to his current state. Ahri on the other hand, was phenomenally overbearing. She gained mobility on top of her mobility, which really wasn't needed. Cass is nothing but an E-bot now because of her rework. Previously she actually had the option of using her Q and W for something other than E resets.
Keevalroy2 votesShe gained mobility on top of her mobility, which really wasn't needed.
Nor was it wanted.
TwitchInMyPants34 votesBan CertainlyT from reworking champions, or make sure he has someone who can shoot down his ideas. This is the worst rework since permaroot Ryze and at least they actually fixed asap lol.
Blue Moon Wolf25 votesRiot is really ignoring the issue if they don't listen the only players they care about. If the pro's are telling you something is wrong, then something is wrong. These are the kind of people who don't complain about changes often, they just learn and adapt cause they are trying to be the best. When they see a problem with a champ that they at least have a hard time adapting to, it's time to admit that you screwed up and go back to the drawing board. at the very least they could revert Harvester of sorrow since he: a) didn't have a heal before, why bother keeping it if it's not good for anything other than healing (which they nerfed -__-). b) Dosen't need a stupid full XP in duo lane gimmick. No one needs that gimmick. Even more so when it doesn't work on every map.
SaltyToplaneGoat16 votes1.) Find the guy who did the Sion rework or the one who worked on Gangplank, because those two were awesome.
2.) Give him the job and kick CertainlyT out of the team for two-four weeks, assing him to the lore team temporarely as an intern so he can learn what a character's theme and personality is.
3.) ???
4.) Profit.
Celosar3 votesYou know, the GP rework was a straight buff but I honestly miss the old one. I played the shit out of him before the rework and basically haven't touched him since. Just feels off.
edit: spelling is hard.
SaltyToplaneGoat2 votesBut it solved many problems old GP had while adding something new that fit his theme. When I shoot at a barrel and it exploded I'm like "Yeah, this is something GP would do!" Even better when you lure enemies to bushes full of armed powder kegs...
Sure, it feels different, but even better in my opinion. They kept the core aspects and exanded on it.
Same thing was with Sion: kept the shield-explosion as it was iconic, looked at his theme and went on from there. You really have the feel of a brutal undead one-man-army in that champ...
And how did that work? Because both designers worked along the theme they were given. CertainlyT cannot do that. He's just about gameplay and mechanical understanding, but seems to have zero creativity in any area besides that. Most champs he designed are not complex lore characters either: Zyra is a plain dryad, Yasuo the classical ronin stuffed with a knockup-mechanic, and Tresh is barely anything more than "spooky children story". There are no spells that really interact with souls or anything, he's just 100% gameplay...
As I said it before, let CertainlyT spend some time with the lore department. He might really need it.
Count Buffon2 votesThey cranked the Farmville factor up to 11, though. If you don't have the mechanics to max his ultimate, then don't even bother trying him.
Taigongwang16 votesRiot honestly needs to have the lead on the rework team address this. CertainlyT has replied and brushed off the responses while trying to pin the blame on the PBE testers, while other designers have openly said that Mordekaiser is now, after this rework, a major issue. If there is any time that someone needs to man up, take responsibility, and fix this ASAP, it is now.
ZT Xperimentor4 votesI concur!
MyCarIsADragon10 votesMordekaiser Before the Patch: HUE HUE HUE HUE HUE 
HUE HUE HUE HUE HUE
Mordekaiser After the Patch: 
Maximum Morde9 votesIt was a good effort on their part, and the changes ARE strong. It's just too binary of a kit to be healthy from a game play standpoint. Hit third Q? Grats you win. Dont? You probably lose, unless you got your R on someone good and the rest of the team kills them for you.
Doctor Dyment8 votesThese are dark times my friend. Dark times indeed. But we must not go quietly into the night. Nay, we must make our voices be heard. And even if everything we know and love comes crashing down around us, and the fist of wrath is positioned over our heads, we will still scream in defiance before we are silenced. Continue to fight Malicious Metal. Victory is not awarded to the strongest, or the fastest, or even the smartest. Victory is awarded to those who can endure the longest.
Mordepool8 votesI always Dreamed of riding a Mordekaiser Themed Rollercoaster.
But NOT LIKE THIS.
NOT LIKE THIS
Sicksadpanda7 votesAtleast I had fun playing as Darius pre-nerfed...
Morde isn't fun to play as...
If they wanted Morde to be competitive level (even if it means permabanned) they should've just buffed old morde, not create an unfun rework.
ZT Xperimentor6 votesAgreed, sure he was rough, but he just needed some quality of life buffs to be viable; but this rework makes him play like a tinfoil child instead of a mega-maniacal metal manipulater.
Keljx6 votesCan I get a link to where Ghostcrawler mentioned Morde is an issue (unless it was before his most recent change), or where a pro mentions him? I need to see/hear this for myself.
Mordepool7 votesCan I get a link to where Ghostcrawler mentioned Morde is an issue (unless it was before his most recent change), or where a pro mentions him? I need to see/hear this for myself.
http://ask.fm/RiotGhostcrawler
Very vague very concerning
Slamurai Jack5 votesRiot is never going to outright revert a rework once it goes live. That would set an unacceptable precedent for Riot.
Malicious Metal7 votesThen what about rework numero dos? He needed work yes, but this one will probably just builds up to basically deleting a champion
Seekêr5 votesmaybe now that the pros are speaking up, even going as far as to say they would like him removed from the game, riot might listen.
Ulquiorra9954 votesKnowing Riot, they will listen and remove him from game.
Well, not literally, but destroy his numbers and leave him near unplayable until next rework hits somewhere in 2020.
Malicious Metal5 votesThat's the worst case scenario and simultaneously the most likely outcome...
rtbf313756854 votesThe Morde remake was the worst changes in League since I started playing a few years ago. Morde was probably my favorite champ. He was just fine before. Barely anyone picked him, and each victory was well earned. In no way was he OP or "toxic" (a BS term that has no real meaning).
Nowadays, even if I can use Morde, I don't feel like doing so. He is boring and weak. Worst of all, he lacks the OOMPH that he had before. Before, when you E'd a wave, it felt satisfying. Now his E feels like shit. His Q feels like shit. His shield feels like shit. His ult feels like shit.
The guy who redid him should honestly fire himself. He is a disgrace.
Big Lincoln3 votesreverting it would be really bad publicity
I would just hope they're open to another rework. I'll even be okay with CT doing it again, if he listens to the people who play him
Mordepool10 votes[{quoted}](name=Solomon Money,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=X7LxAAsP,comment-id=000d,timestamp=2015-10-06T22:05:39.293+0000)
reverting it would be really bad publicity
I would just hope they're open to another rework. I'll even be okay with CT doing it again, if he listens to the people who play him
Nope he's proven he never played him and can't be trusted to keep champion identity
Malicious Metal6 votesWhat do you suggest? That they get a designer who loves the champ to work on Morde who would come back to the Morde playerbase for feedback and advice?
Can this please happen as an early Snowdown present?
ZT Xperimentor6 votesConsidering he never comments on his own discussion boards . . . he'll never listen until someone decks him. Sadly he's either too arrogant or too ignorant from what I've seen in the beta boards.
