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Healthy Veigar Changes

Very Hard Engage··13 votes·1,623 views

instead of all saying "broken" or "useless" or "wtf rito", lets actually come up with some constructive criticism of how to make veigar better

These are the options that I've read across various threads which i believe would actually work.

  1. rework E from stun, to a gravity pull towards the center of the area, champions move faster while going to the center and experience a slow while moving away.

  2. shorten the range/duration/length of the stun/increased cool down, cant cast the stun as far, the horizon doesn't last as long, a longer cooldown, 1.5s at rank 5 such that non tenacity builds would still have the potential to be picked, but at a higher risk for veigar as he would have less time to use his wombo combo. (i believe that any of the above should've been considered before the hard delay was implemented), in addition any combination of the above so long as the stun remained instant would've been better

  3. spells cast inside of the ring would have different effects, such as multiple meteors inside the ring, or a multi pronged Q, or the Q bounces off the cage wall to even more targets(at reducing damage percentages after each target hit). ult would have a nearby aoe splash damage. etc etc.

  4. (instant placement) enemies who enter the cage are trapped inside it until the duration ends, enemies who have the ring placed on them are placed at the farthest range(but only to the edge of the cage) in relation to veigers current position.

^ basically, imagine a line from veigar to anyone its placed on, no angles involved, only moving them back. they would be moved instantly from where they were to the furthest point to a spot on the edge of the cage. such that enemies who are closer to veigar who have the cage put on them would move a greater distance back to the edge of the cage. and enemies who are further away and have the ring placed on them will experience minimal displacement.

  1. change W entirely to something with a knockback so that veigar has some form of skill to coax people into the stun. (^ srs? its a 5 on my screen/edit, rito wont let me change it >.>)

any other thoughts or ideas? comments? suggestions? id love to hear them.

long story short, veigar needs to change in order to lane, he cant survive any lane matchup besides a karthus, other champions just outperform him in utility, survival, damage, range, sieging, and team fighting. (i would much rather have a ziggs or a xerath every time rather than a veigar).

15 Comments

chumbler8 votes

Step 1: Revert this piece of shit rework.

Job done.

Ragnar424 votes

Step 1) Revert Cage back to Veigar's old cage.
Step 2) Make Cage Veigar's new R, give it a cooldown of 90/80/70 Step 3) Give Veigar a different skill in place of his E, perhaps a point and click Single Target spell. Step 4) Give each skill an enhanced ability if cast on his cage. a) Q Bounces around inside cage doing 15% less damage for each target it hits b) W's cooldown is instant if it hits someone who is trapped by the cage, or was recently trapped by the cage (.5) seconds c) The New E does 80% of the targets AP as additional magic damage if it hits someone who is trapped by the cage, or recently trapped by the cage.

you're welcome.

Squidblimp3 votes

I actually posted about this: why not have Veigar's other abilities stun enemies while they are trapped inside Event Horizon if they land? This way, there is counterplay, since most of his abilties are skillshots and can be dodged, but a skilled Veigar would land them.

Landing his ultimate or his Q to stun would allow a follow-up Dark Matter.

Very Hard Engage1 votes

{quoted}

I actually posted about this: why not have Veigar's other abilities stun enemies while they are trapped inside Event Horizon if they land? This way, there is counterplay, since most of his abilties are skillshots and can be dodged, but a skilled Veigar would land them.

Landing his ultimate or his Q to stun would allow a follow-up Dark Matter.

i like the concept, but sadly it doesnt offer that immediate protection if it has wind up time, and his Q is a projectile, and with max cdr it only allows for 2 Q casts before the horizon disappears making it a very limited window to use.

Reazale1 votes

I would like for Veigar to have similar base dmg and ratios to leblanc , with his combo been done on a similar speed , that would instantly fix him (acually he would be broken as leblanc is but without the mobility)

BuCkeT SeiZureS1 votes

What do you think about this idea?

First. Reduce the stun at max rank. 2.0-2.25 is plenty, favoring the first option. Second, turn it into a linear skill shot. But have the circle have a small central pillar. What I think would be great is that he shoots an orb, similar to his q, that stops at the first enemy hit (minion or champion) after making contact, it will cause the event horizon to erupt. Giving the full circle with the center pillar stunning the target hit by the initial skill shot. Maybe you could even make it reactivate able in order for him to cause his cage to trigger wherever the orb currently is. Like a velkoz q or lissandra claw. I like this because it allows veigar to stun someone directly on top of him, gives warning to the enemy champion with its travel time, and still can be used creatively. You could even give the circumference portion of the circle the .75 sec delay and only have the center pillar stun immediately.

Very Hard Engage1 votes

[{quoted}](name=BuCkeT SeiZureS,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wxf1lF5m,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-03-05T21:17:04.313+0000)

What do you think about this idea?

First. Reduce the stun at max rank. 2.0-2.25 is plenty, favoring the first option. Second, turn it into a linear skill shot. But have the circle have a small central pillar. What I think would be great is that he shoots an orb, similar to his q, that stops at the first enemy hit (minion or champion) after making contact, it will cause the event horizon to erupt. Giving the full circle with the center pillar stunning the target hit by the initial skill shot. Maybe you could even make it reactivate able in order for him to cause his cage to trigger wherever the orb currently is. Like a velkoz q or lissandra claw. I like this because it allows veigar to stun someone directly on top of him, gives warning to the enemy champion with its travel time, and still can be used creatively. You could even give the circumference portion of the circle the .75 sec delay and only have the center pillar stun immediately.

so its like a xerath orb, only it "does more" if it lands. i dont like the concept of having another champions abilities. in terms of balance it would be fairly strong if it lands, stunning both the diver and preventing his team mates from helping with the new horizon right on top of him. on the flip side if it misses veigar is completely screwed

id rather see it as a nami style bubble where the orb is lobbed to an area and we can see it dropping but we have to familiarize ourselves with the stun radius.

BuCkeT SeiZureS1 votes

I can see why you don't like it, but its more than a xerath ability. Only the center pillar would stun instantly, the outside would have a bigger delay. Possibly up to a full second or 1.5. To make up for it. Xerath has his stun flow well with his kit and has other form as of CC and very long poke. Veigar has none of those, so his kit could use it. Besides, the interactions with minions and monsters could allow for some interesting plays. Not to mention it would be used for zoning a lot in lane, rather than offense. I like your idea of it being similar to a nami bubble, as well. But they seem pretty content having it be hard to land. I think they really want it to be a cage more than a flat AoE stun. That's why I think this could work. I still think my idea is better than on live, though it would be tough to make it worse XD

But thank you for the feedback. It was constructive ^^

NGNshuckles1 votes

looks like i forgot to read before posting. brb comitting soduku in the name of veigar

NGNshuckles1 votes

i heard someone say that his stun should still be instant but its like Diannas Q except it goes in that satanic pentagram shape and doesn't have to close completely in order to stun. that way it can be used offensively and defensively but isnt extremely overpowered. Also i think that making his W like kogmaws ult is cool. make it have like 2 ammo and reduce the time it takes for the meteor to land. The ratio can be lowered to compensate.

skyfall6191 votes

just give his W 2-3 charges. so now when people are trapped inside you make a meteor shower within the cage(lower dmg if needed)

Hard Penetrator1 votes

I can't even joke with all of this fine and serious ideas around.

Black Star 12991 votes

I feel like Riot isn't utilizing the e as a stun anymore, it's just an actual impassable terrain (Like jarvan's) and the stun is just an extra.

That does mean though, veigar should get rewarded for trapping people inside his cage, like increased bonus effects in it.

Curling Veigar1 votes

I'd love to make suggestions but 99% of the time riot ain't listening so it's a waste really. Fun theorycraft, though. Have my upvote anyways.

Narog1 votes

this are great ideas all better than the recent veigar change , but new riot doesn't care it seems .

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