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Riot continues to brainlessly buff strong Champions for Worlds

Rαy··72 votes·17,487 views

Thresh and Pyke are in a perfectly fine spot right now. They are probably two of the few champions we can call balanced. I practiced Pyke recently and let's be honest, in the right hands he is too strong even. But hey, look what is in the making right before Worlds:

  • Death from Below (R) execute damage changed from [200-605] to [250-605]

We all know this game lacks damage, right? How about 25% more base damage on his outplay button?

  • Death Sentence (Q) cost lowered from 80 to 60 cooldown lowered from 20/18/16/14/12 to 16/15/14/13/12

We get it, you want flashy, edgy champions at Worlds. We need mysterious, mobile wet dreams for teenagers. That's why it took them months to finally touch Kai'Sa, Jhin & Graves still get completely ignored and Lucian was turned into this oppressive monster. Because f*ck balance and a decently fun game I guess. Gotta sell dem $kin$.

Don't get me wrong, I love Thresh and Pyke. That's why I know THEY ARE FINE RIGHT NOW. But nah, they don't get picked in pro play, so let's crank them up to 100% pick/ban status in Solo Queue to fuck their players. BUT AT LEAST I CAN STILL SEE THEM AT WORLDS, RIGHT?

Getting sick of the balance team.

58 Comments

Rexxiee19 votes

Pyke currently has a 30% ban rate in diamond already with a 50%+ win rate.

You can bet with those buffs his ban rate will double or even triple, champ is already absurd if not played by a monkey.

Rαy4 votes

{quoted}

Pyke currently has a 30% ban rate in diamond already with a 50%+ win rate.

You can bet with those buffs his ban rate will double or even triple, champ is already absurd if not played by a monkey.

Exactly my point. I spammed him like crazy these past days and got increasingly ridiculous stats the better I got at him.

It is so easy not to die if you know what you are doing due to his E and W being disgustingly strong escaping tools that synergize with each other.

There is no point in buffing him at all.

Jaspers16 votes

The Pyke one baffles me. I like Pyke, I hate executes.

Nami's HP at base level 6 is 781. 250 is 33% of Nami's base HP, 34% of Janna's. For most ADCs it's 30%. That's without bonus AD, which he sill have by level 6.

Seems a bit much.

Regina George3 votes

You really expect Riot to listen to reason and facts? haaa

Jaspers2 votes

Got my figures wrong, it's 32% for Nami, 32.4% for Janna.

Rakan is the worst because his passive shield and E won't save him.

Sweet Tennessee12 votes

What's even worse is that they practically admitted they nerf weak champions like Sej strictly cause of competitive in patch notes

5050BS8 votes

Got to have the new Support in Worlds. Its a "must" on their list.

Summonah123692 votes

{quoted}

Got to have the new Support in Worlds. Its a "must" on their list.

Thresh has been out for years...

Rathar Dashing3 votes

Pyke

Jamaree4 votes

Is that it? You act like these buffs are going to change that much.

Rαy25 votes

{quoted}

Is that it? You act like these buffs are going to change that much.

Pretty sure they will. Both buffs, especially Pyke's, are huge to be honest.

haaaaaaalp23 votes

The fact that they are even buffing mid tier champions instead of nerfing god tier ones shows a huge problem in their philosophy

Spank the Fox4 votes

If the difference between mid tier and god tier is 4 second cds and 50 damage, maybe we’re closer to balance than you’d care to admit.

Rαy6 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2018-09-19T07:08:58.109+0000)

If the difference between mid tier and god tier is 4 second cds and 50 damage, maybe we’re closer to balance than you’d care to admit.

Do you even know how important 50 base damage at level 6 are? Saw you on another thread saying Ahri is fine when she clearly is not.

We are not close to balance. Not at all.

Spank the Fox2 votes

Ahri is fine, she is just super safe which is good for solo queue.

I even played against a fed one (she did 64k damage that game) because they’re one dimensional - dodge charm, you win. Her winrate is good because to climb, all you need to do is not feed your tits off

Thanks for reminding me I’m popular teehee

Rαy3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=00000001000000010000,timestamp=2018-09-19T10:20:43.084+0000)

Ahri is fine, she is just super safe which is good for solo queue.

I even played against a fed one (she did 64k damage that game) because they’re one dimensional - dodge charm, you win. Her winrate is good because to climb, all you need to do is not feed your tits off

Thanks for reminding me I’m popular teehee

Despite the fact she's at her annual point of not having to hit her charm to kill someone again.

Spank the Fox1 votes

I mean, she does if she wants to 1v1 100-0 you, but w/e, not the thread for it.

Rαy1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=0000000100000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-19T11:01:50.230+0000)

I mean, she does if she wants to 1v1 100-0 you, but w/e, not the thread for it.

Yeah.

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/champion/Ahri/Middle/

xd

Dream High1 votes

Except that's only true when fed and you hit everything including, multiple ults, ignite and electrocute.

Rαy4 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dream High,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=0000000100000001000000000001,timestamp=2018-09-19T14:41:52.470+0000)

Except that's only true when fed and you hit everything including, multiple ults, ignite and electrocute.

She sits at a +54% winrate, what's even to discuss? She needs a nerf, simple as that. She was my first and favorite champ, but at least I'm trying to have a positive influence on the state of the game instead of waifu-crying all over the place, defending a champion that is clearly overtuned right now.

You somehow managed to play 100 games on her and score a below-average winrate, so she must be balanced, right? Big fucking yikes.

Ranmaru1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=00000001000000010000,timestamp=2018-09-19T10:20:43.084+0000)

Ahri is fine, she is just super safe which is good for solo queue.

I even played against a fed one (she did 64k damage that game) because they’re one dimensional - dodge charm, you win. Her winrate is good because to climb, all you need to do is not feed your tits off

Thanks for reminding me I’m popular teehee

"Spank the fox" speaks for its self. Ahri fox. We check LOLYALTICS and see ahri has a 54.28% wr in challenger for a "one dimensional champ just dodge charm 4head"

Spank the Fox1 votes

Is this a joke?

I don’t play Ahri.

Don’t @ me.

Ranmaru1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Spank the Fox,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=0000000100000001000000010000,timestamp=2018-09-19T22:33:48.072+0000)

Is this a joke?

I don’t play Ahri.

Don’t @ me.

wdym @

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

> nerfing god tier ones > people complaining about Riot nerfing Sejuani

https://media.giphy.com/media/CaiVJuZGvR8HK/source.gif

Ya'll realize that it's a mix of both yeah, based on the reasons they aren't picked? Simply nerfing the good folk, isn't going to make the others equally viable, if there is a reason the others aren't picked outside of "Countered by the strong folk".

haaaaaaalp1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Mercy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=000000010001,timestamp=2018-09-20T00:59:47.096+0000)

> nerfing god tier ones > people complaining about Riot nerfing Sejuani

https://media.giphy.com/media/CaiVJuZGvR8HK/source.gif

Ya'll realize that it's a mix of both yeah, based on the reasons they aren't picked? Simply nerfing the good folk, isn't going to make the others equally viable, if there is a reason the others aren't picked outside of "Countered by the strong folk".

Why cares if people complain about sej nerfs? If it needs to be done, I would much prefer nerfs to buffs.

Also, balancing shiuld never be a mix of nerfing god tier champions and buffing mid tier ones. It should be nerfing god tier champions and buffing underpowered ones. The mid tier champions should remain untouched as the rest of the lineup is brought in line.

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

Buffing underpowered champs into Competitive level leads to the chance that they run too powerful in SoloQ, since you need to buff them a lot to bring them into the right levels. Example: Yi. Mid Tiers are champions who have the possibility of reaching Competitive, but just need a nudge in the right direction.

Once again, this is not simple. You need to understand why the champion is not seen in Competitive, not just classify them into three "Underpowered, Mid and God Tiers." Some can't be brought to Competitive level without altering them in a major way. Mid Tiers, don't need that much to push them over the line.

haaaaaaalp1 votes

Buffing mid tier champions causes far more problems than buffing low tier champions. Mid tier champions shouldn't be getting nudged in any direction, other champions should be getting nudged towards the mid tier champions.

If your concern is that master yi will be too strong in solo queue, you don't have to buff him. However, that doesn't mean you need to buff an already strong champion in place of yi. You can just nerf all of god tier champions and buff a few underpowered ones that will not destroy solo queue. Keep the mid tier champions untouched.

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

Once again, simply nerfing the strong champs isn't going to bring in the Mid Tiers, unless the reason they aren't picked is because "They're countered by the God-Tier champs". Mid-Tier means they're not played in Competitive, not that they're fine for competitive. So, we're really missing a spot inbetween God Tier and Mid Tier, Playable Tier.

haaaaaaalp1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Dr Mercy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Wj2K4rrT,comment-id=0000000100010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-09-20T04:58:20.567+0000)

Once again, simply nerfing the strong champs isn't going to bring in the Mid Tiers, unless the reason they aren't picked is because "They're countered by the God-Tier champs". Mid-Tier means they're not played in Competitive, not that they're fine for competitive. So, we're really missing a spot inbetween God Tier and Mid Tier, Playable Tier.

Oh, I don't think I made my point clearly, my bad. I said to nerf the god tier champions because that would be step 1 which the balance team isn't really doing. After that, they should be nerfing the rest of the champions between god tier and mid tier, it just hasn't gotten to that point yet. Ideally, everyone should be brought to the level of a mid tier champion eventually.

saltran3 votes

That's why Kai'Sa has not been touched

She has been literally nerfed last patch....things like this makes me dislike a thread that I mostly agree with.

And in the title you talk about strong champs but sorry, Thresh is not weak but he is definetely NOT strong neither on pro play or soloQ.

CppL7 votes

Those nerfs was a joke.

saltran2 votes

Look at the stats by patch after the "joke nerf"

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/champion/Kaisa/historic/

Compare 8.17 with 8.18 stats when overall she has almost 2% winrate less before calling that a joke nerf again.

And I'm not saying that she didn't deserved the nerf, I'm glad that she was nerfed but I wont pretend that she has been not nerfed because that would just be a bs narrative.

Hibeki1 votes

Winrate after patch is stupid source of effectie nerfs. Vladimir at one point had a big nerf which tanked his winrate, it wasnt until the next patch that riot said that despite it being in the patchnotes the nerf didnt actually go through.

Nerfs and buffs in this game has a placebo effect. Nerfing a champ by 5 damage doesnt do shit but you still see winrates go down.

ModAcademy Kayn2 votes

It can work the same way though. If someone has a mental attitude of seeing someone too strong, and sees them get nerfed, they may be more confident in plays against that champion, where they would've doubted their chances before.

Hibeki1 votes

You literally just confirmed the placebo effect.

ModAcademy Kayn1 votes

I'm aware. But it works both ways. Kai'sa could actually be a decently balanced character, with the only reason she's doing so well, is because of people's attitudes towards her, thinking she's broken. I'm more than aware of my attitude shift when playing against things like Heimer, and I'm sure that leaks into my ability to play against him.

It's two sides of a coin, but it depends on what the starting place is.

Rαy1 votes

{quoted}

She has been literally nerfed last patch....things like this makes me dislike a thread that I mostly agree with.

And in the title you talk about strong champs but sorry, Thresh is not weak but he is definetely NOT strong neither on pro play or soloQ.

Edited the thread and added some other candidates.

https://lolalytics.com/ranked/worldwide/platinum/plus/champion/Thresh/Support/

He is absolutely strong. How can you even argue with this?

saltran1 votes

He has not even 51% winrate and you are calling him "strong"? I know that his pickrate is high and that lower his winrate but still I fail to see in which aspect he's strong right now looking at that stats plus him being totally ignored on pro play for a long time.

I think that he's just fine, doesn't need nerfs but neither needed a buff and I dislike that he's buffed.

Rαy2 votes

{quoted}

He has not even 51% winrate and you are calling him "strong"? I know that his pickrate is high and that lower his winrate but still I fail to see in which aspect he's strong right now looking at that stats plus him being totally ignored on pro play for a long time.

I think that he's just fine, doesn't need nerfs but neither needed a buff and I dislike that he's buffed.

I called him strong in the right hands (on the edge of being too strong). A 51% average winrate usually means people who actually know how to play him perform really well. Which is the case. Hence, he doesn't need buffs, because people just need to learn the champ to git gud. He is in a healthy state, yes, which is exactly my point.

TotalJerk1 votes

It's still a really bad Thresh buff. Thresh's Q is expensive for a reason. This change will effectively remove his need to manage his mana.

Qiyana B0T3 votes

And also, why have ardent sensor support mages been totally removed from the game? Ever since the big shield nerfs.

10221 votes

and thats a good thing

EyesOfTheFox2 votes

Yeah not sure the context of the Thresh buffs seeing as how he is normally picked as a counter to Braum, who they are nerfing, even though Braum teams got smashed pretty hard in a lot of season final and regional games. I'm pretty sure Thresh can now spam his hook more than Naut and Blitz, but hey gotta sell that skin right? Oh Urgot is 100% blind pickable, let's leave him, gotta sell that skin. Surprised Lucian didn't get buffs... but then again his skin sells pretty well.

The sad part is all of our concerns about balance don't mean shit to Riot. They will do what they want regardless and it's up to us to either learn to deal with it or just go do something else.

Rαy2 votes

{quoted}

Yeah not sure the context of the Thresh buffs seeing as how he is normally picked as a counter to Braum, who they are nerfing, even though Braum teams got smashed pretty hard in a lot of season final and regional games. I'm pretty sure Thresh can now spam his hook more than Naut and Blitz, but hey gotta sell that skin right? Oh Urgot is 100% blind pickable, let's leave him, gotta sell that skin. Surprised Lucian didn't get buffs... but then again his skin sells pretty well.

The sad part is all of our concerns about balance don't mean shit to Riot. They will do what they want regardless and it's up to us to either learn to deal with it or just go do something else.

Lucian did receive unnecessary buffs. So did Irelia, Rengar and Kassadin.

Thorn30001 votes

"but hey gotta sell that skin right? "

I'd pay someone to scrounge through patch notes on champ buffs and skin releases last 3 years and find that correlation, I'm willing to bet there is one, Lux last 3 years was quite clear, but I am sure one can find many examples and they usually last at least 3-4 patches while they are "gathering data" before repairing it

Rathar Dashing3 votes

The exact opposite thing happened with the Zoe skin. They nerfed her three times in a row, then right after the skin dropped the huge E rework leaked.

saltran1 votes

I have 2 good examples of champs I play: Cait who was gutted after getting her Pulsefire skin and Ashe who was nerfed after Project.

You know, you should also count the champs that are nerfed after getting a skin.

Thorn30001 votes

what does "after" mean? if its a reasonable amount of time its ok, I mean im sure most of the skin sale happens immediately, because everyone interested will get it, that a nerf happens in next patch has little impact

saltran1 votes

But everyone interested on Caitlyn knew that she was going to get nerfed hard and it was exactly on the next patch so sure it had an impact because ppl like me knew that she was going to be gutted so I didn't bought the skin and I waited for the early sales and it was worth considering that for the majority of these 6 months she was god awful.

You can also check Ahri nerf 1 patch away from her new skin, or Kai'Sa that will get a nerf on the same patch she will get the biggest skin of the Event that costs 2500 tokens + a normal skin.

Thorn30001 votes

"But everyone interested on Caitlyn knew that she was going to get nerfed hard"

  • I really dont know what to say to this, do you think majority of LoL players follow PBE news? I really dont think so
  • I'd say I keep myself informed above the average lol player (not too much tho) and I dont know any Kai'sa nerfs are incoming even if I play her a lot and am planning on buying the new skin, I usually don't follow PBE unless extreme cases as many times things there do not actually make it the stable patch, so a lot of times its needless worrying (such as yas ulti going from +150% to +250% some patches back)

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