Boards›Gameplay

Post rework Mord's durability should still be focused around in-combat shielding

Malicious Metal··36 votes·2,399 views

So, I spammed a ton of Mordekaiser today (who would've thought, huh?) and even got the chance to face off against one myself (literally never happens to me) and it got me thinking. Mordekaiser's entire design is one big mess that can be extremely unhealthy to play against due to it basically making his durability scale with his damage output while also not having any downtime for that one defensive steroid.

Yet. these big shields are what most Mordekaiser players love about him and I really feel in order to make him stand out from his Juggernaut brethren he should still be mostly be based around the concept of strong shields keeping him save from certain death.

"Shielded from true death by necromancy and the force of his own dark will" Like his lore tells us. It paints a pretty cool image and on both a gameplay aspect and thematic/visual one Mordekaiser's design really benefits from shielding as a mechanic. He should thrive in combat like any other Juggernaut but unlike their percentage HEALS he should have SHIELDS.

He's already this armored Warlord ghost so why not play up that part and give him the shields to match that Iron Shell.

The thing here is though that in order for him to be able to have strong shields he should not have it as a passive ability but rather have some agency over his durability, being able to manage it properly and reward good Mordekaisers for effectively weaving cool downs and engage favorable fights.

Most other Juggernauts also have the problem of being hard-countered by grievous wounds, giving an unliving Wraith shields that can't be reduced give him the edge to combat that weakness and give him some unique reasons to be picked.

Not only this but shields are temporary while health is permanent, making him reliant on managing it properly, especially during the laning phase if he wants to trade. He could actually get decent HP regen but the lack of healing could actually make his lane more interactive and reward good players who manage to abuse this weakness.

Just my two cents on that topic, I really feel Mordekaiser has the potential to be one of the coolest Juggernauts simply by delivering on some rather unique themes that really fit him as a character and make him stand out from his peers!

http://wallup.net/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/157771-Overlord_2-video_games-748x468.jpg

28 Comments

Rebonack8 votes

Just to throw it out there, if Morde only got his shield from fighting champions rather than for blasting minions, it would allow quite a bit more power to be juggled around in his kit.

Personally?

I think catching Morde when his defenses are down through surprise would fit perfectly with his lore background.

After all, how did he lose to begin with?

Someone snuck in while he wasn't looking and stole his skull.

A frontal assault against Morde should end in ruin for whoever is fighting him. Defeating the Iron Reverent should require guile and subterfuge.

Malicious Metal8 votes

I actually feel the whole damage->shield aspect needs to be scrapped so that his shield gain can just be balanced around it being an active spell he has to manage if he wants to get the most out of it.

But yes, I completely agree. Juggernauts in general are not to be engaged head on, they need to be played around and engaged when they do not expect it, it not only fits his lore but also general theme as a heavy metal juggernaut.

Felvyne1 votes

So... Maybe a shielding ability that last as long as you keep yourself in combat against champions but with a long CD? Like Guinsoo's passive?

EvilMerodach1 votes

{quoted}

Just to throw it out there, if Morde only got his shield from fighting champions rather than for blasting minions, it would allow quite a bit more power to be juggled around in his kit.

Personally?

I think catching Morde when his defenses are down through surprise would fit perfectly with his lore background.

After all, how did he lose to begin with?

Someone snuck in while he wasn't looking and stole his skull.

A frontal assault against Morde should end in ruin for whoever is fighting him. Defeating the Iron Reverent should require guile and subterfuge.

Lets give him a "mini-game" where he has his skull somewhere near him (like Shen's sword) and make it so the skull takes more damage than morde!

#/s ######Plz don' kil meh

Really though, I had an idea a while back that boils down to- Lower his damage, make his shield a LOT stronger but take longer to build up/have a 'max' it can build from 1 combo (1s cooldown on passive? So you can't just spam everything and have max shield.) THEN, when you have over XX% of max shield, your abilities gain an extra effect. (Something like Rumble passive in reverse.)

This would give him better teamfight presence, in that either- A: Enemy is forced to poke at him to keep him from getting his shield stored up, or B: Have to deal with extra shit he can do once he has his shield built up.

As of right now (and...pretty much forever,) because of his lack of CC (which he also should also never get outside of itemization, item 3116 item 3146, etc) as far as his tanky side goes, best plan is pretty much always avoid/circumvent him, kill everyone else, than come back for him later.

This might make him more feast/famine though, and don't really have a solution for that. Just an idea.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

Are you saying they should change him so he can't be 1v1'd and the counterplay is to gank him? It makes sense lore wise but that seems... terrible for gameplay. It sounds nice but you sorta have to do a "frontal assault" in this game because you can either move forward or backward, and all this game is about is moving forward to the enemy base. There's two directions in a lane sadly.

Rebonack1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Revan Senpai,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=WEo3G16X,comment-id=00010002,timestamp=2017-01-29T12:39:48.569+0000)

Are you saying they should change him so he can't be 1v1'd and the counterplay is to gank him? It makes sense lore wise but that seems... terrible for gameplay. It sounds nice but you sorta have to do a "frontal assault" in this game because you can either move forward or backward, and all this game is about is moving forward to the enemy base. There's two directions in a lane sadly.

More like 'trying to fight Morde when he has his shield isn't going to go so great for you'. There are a ton of ways that could manifest in gameplay.

Supreme Senpai691 votes

Oh so sorta like Yasuo? Wait crap this is gameplay boards.

Umm...

You mean like Pantheon? Giving him a window of power sorta thing?

Hovering Hentai2 votes

Until a Vel'Koz hides in an unearned bush and 100-0's him

Azteryz4 votes

imo they could make morde one of the coolest damn champs visually AND im not even adding the fact that he is a metal monster

picture this

moredekaiser has 0% shield filled up he kind of just looks like a more than average metal knight to be honest

but

as he gains shields armor pieces start forming on him and then when he is max shields he looks like a machine of war than a knight

plus this would make every morde skin incredible

think this

http://i.imgur.com/5NTLtA9.gif

Thoughts?

Xeruon1 votes

I think it needs to be more dramatic.

At 0% shielding, he's just a skeleton with a helmet, a few broken fragments of metal armor, and some cloth rags.

But as he builds his shield up, he turns into a steel demon that can take as much punishment as he can deal; a fucking lot.

snibedi snab2 votes

I'm still amazed and impressed that you and other Morde players are still trying to think of ways to fix Morde, as if Riot will ever listen or care. There's only one sure-fire way to make shit-tier forgotten champions good again in this game and that's to have a different developer that knows what they're doing.

Skelenth1 votes

Unlike Concept & Creations' Champions this rework will happen eventually, so them giving ideas and inspiration to the guys who are responsible for it is actually very good and useful.

BastionKross2 votes

The issue you're dancing around, MM, is that Riot just can't balance drain tanks. They're either so weak they're useless unless they get incredibly fed or powerful enough to warp the game around them.

Aatrox "I was naughty back in season 3 and they put me in the bad boy corner ever since." Warwick "My rework has been the most anyone's paid attention to me since patch 4.20." Vladimir "They nerfed one item and my whole kit fell apart." Fiddlesticks "I've forgotten what the jungle looks like. Is Gromp still doing well?"

Morde is a drain tank, with the notable exception that

shields are temporary while health is permanent, making him reliant on managing it properly, especially during the laning phase if he wants to trade.

Morde is less of an issue compared to other drain tanks in that he doesn't keep his shield once he's drained it, most of it goes away if you leave combat. (And what remains is often barely enough to block half an auto attack... from Annie )

This is especially easy to take advantage of, since Morde doesn't have the tools to stop you from disengaging and then re-engaging once his shield wears off if you're melee or just poking him down if you have range. Yes, he can charge his shield on minions, but that's pretty much required of him just so he can survive.

Prophet of Urgod1 votes

Like the "naughty" bit.

Big Lincoln1 votes

if it was on an ability but worked sort of as-is (decent base shield, but he can do damage to refill it/increase it as long as it doesn't get popped?) i would think it'd be a cool idea

I don't really want just a "shield self for a while" like we have on so many tanks already, though; it should have a caveat, a way for him to keep it up but on a long cooldown so he has to manage his power more than he does currently

also I liked old mord's general design much better; as in, he was innately tanky and had to build damage, rather than having innate damage and having to build tanky.

RivetAce1 votes

His E has always given him bonus shield, I think it could work if it was his only shielding ability.

Imagine this: Q is for single target damage, W is for waveclear and w/e (movespeed? resists? healing?), E is for shielding, and R is for 6v4. His abilities wouldn't give him shield besides his E, so you could play around his E cooldown instead of constant shield uptime. E would also probably have to deal reduced damage to minions so as to make a relevant choice between maxing W and maxing E.

ScissorsNstuff1 votes

Yasuo item 3070

CyberBalt1 votes

The only reason I want them to keep his current shield is because it's pretty much the only thing that lets Morde stand up to ranged champions. I think it would be sad if one of the few melee abilities that actually lets them stand up to ranged poke in top lane was removed for being "unhealthy." That being said, when you're playing vs Morde as a melee, it is indeed very oppressive.

So if they could somehow find a replacement for it that both A. lets him still stand up to ranged harass and B. not be so oppressive to other melees, I'd be completely down for that.

Sasogwa1 votes

Checked out the wiki, I don't even understand how the E works. "For each enemy champion hit, Mordekaiser generates a bonus percentage of Iron Man shield." What does that even mean? He has increased shield generation for a short while? His current shield is increased by a %? The shield generated by this ability is amplified? I don't even..

Didn't it use to be a %of his max health generated in shield? That fitted well the juggernaught thingy, why did it go?

Tychusfindlay9191 votes

Honestly, they should give him darius level regen but tone down his W heal A LOT. It's pretty weird that he has good healing on top of great shielding.

And make his base stats better, at least 5 more MS and a good 10 more hp per level.

Little Paws1 votes

Not going to lie, the first time I saw morde I thought that his shield bar was his resource bar. I thought you had to properly manage landing skills to build the shield, at the same time it could be expended by enemies hitting you and such.

ProfDrDeath1 votes

So, ideally he would have a shield ability with a medium duration (2-3 seconds) and a low cooldown (6-8 seconds base, 3.6-4.8 seconds with full CdR), with the cooldown only starting once the shield fell off? That could work...

Legacy Hydralpha1 votes

So, is the idea here being a shield that's tied to an ability? Maybe it could be a base shield that increased and extended the duration when you deal damage through either just abilities or through everything. The best similarity I have is Diana's shield, which gains strength after you hit all the orbs.

no to toxic1 votes

I think they should focus on out-of-combat shielding. Instead of Morde managing his shield it immediantly dissapears whenever he gets hit by something. Then they turn Mordekaiser from a Juggernaut into a melle carry. Then we triple his crit chance and make him do 10% less magic dmg. He also gets a situational mobility spell. Something like needing to be alive to use the dash with a 5 second cooldown. His Q will be kept the same, but his maze is now cursed making Morde instantly appear behind the target like pre-rework Talon did. Morde will also need to play a minigame to do all of that. There I fixed Mordekaiser

KnightOfEloHell1 votes

[{quoted}](name=no to toxic,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=WEo3G16X,comment-id=000c,timestamp=2017-01-29T16:24:50.711+0000)

I think they should focus on out-of-combat shielding. Instead of Morde managing his shield it immediantly dissapears whenever he gets hit by something. Then they turn Mordekaiser from a Juggernaut into a melle carry. Then we triple his crit chance and make him do 10% less magic dmg. He also gets a situational mobility spell. Something like needing to be alive to use the dash with a 5 second cooldown. His Q will be kept the same, but his maze is now cursed making Morde instantly appear behind the target like pre-rework Talon did. Morde will also need to play a minigame to do all of that. There I fixed Mordekaiser

He was already turned into a melee carry. That's why he was reworked for bot lane by Certainly T.

10% less magic damage is Q not procing on hit effects on 3rd Q

W is a situational mobility spell

Build crit on current Morde, its halarious. Your crit AA's do almost as much damage as first Q. Remember that Mord has the highest base AD in the game. That being said, Infinity Edge and Steraks are strong as fuck in him

MunchCrunchLunch1 votes

so you want to bring what made it so hard to balance morde back into his kit after VGU. you aren't as smart as I thought MM. that will simply hold back the rest of his kit.

Malicious Metal1 votes

What held him back was his BS bully playstyle that relies on snowballing above all else due to his durability scaling off his damage output.

Shields are a healthy mechanic and making him stand out from the other healing Juggernauts would be really neat.

More from Gameplay

3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay764 comments
7,167
votes
3 Refunds per season, upvote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay156 comments
3,510
votes
UPVOTE FOR URF
Gameplay606 comments
2,440
votes
Yes plz.
Gameplay456 comments
1,721
votes
3 Refunds per season, up vote if you want 3 refunds per season.
Gameplay114 comments
1,716
votes
When is ANYONE at riot going to address the awful new player experience?
Gameplay634 comments
1,383
votes

More by Malicious Metal

The one buff Karthus NEEDS
Gameplay126 comments
464
votes
Viktor's Patch 6.9 entry shows that whoever worked on Vik has no idea who he truly is >_>
Gameplay224 comments
414
votes
I have achieved my final form!
Memes & Games62 comments
320
votes
There's actually an ingenious way to solve the whole FQC and Ap CDR crisis
Gameplay223 comments
280
votes
A champion should NEVER be made more clunky/less satisfying to play (Regarding Viktor's PBE changes)
Gameplay140 comments
279
votes
Malphite will be the best Camille counter
Memes & Games60 comments
257
votes