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[5:54] Hyrum Graff: Thoughts?
boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/gameplay-balance/Vw3Exorn-perfect-veigar-e-buff
[5:55] IntrospectionMan: that seems overbearingly strong
i think right now he's in a good spot, but his numbers are overtuned to balance out his Q/W being spotty in a 1v1 scenario
adding that utility to his E would probably make him cancerous to play against in niche scenarios
and while it would be cool thematically, in the form that your enemy must predict where you are, it can lead to serious balancing issues in that a removal of team sight in such a huge radius
is increidbly strong
[5:58] Hyrum Graff: It doesn't remove team sight, though.
Like, if I put it around you and your ally is next to you, you can still see them and everything they see.
ANd vice versa
It's like a ring of bushes, not a smokescreen
[5:58] IntrospectionMan: sure, that's fine, but let's say a fight in the river happens, or you even E around minions and have someone lane gank
it provides a ton of utility to a skill that is already increadibly strong both in teamfights and small 2v2 skirmishes
making it even more so wouldn't really add to counterplay or outplay potential, it'd just be slapping on utiltiy, even more so, to an ability that's very potent
youd end up with something that's as overloaded as ekko's W, which is hands down the worst designed ability in league
[6:01] : i think a better idea would be to slow people inside of it, dependent on how many enemy champions are inside
as in, the more there are, the less the slow
adding to his 1v1 skirmishing ability, and not making him overbearingly strong in a teamfight
since his entire kit design is to trap you into an area and then attack you within it, it would let him actually be able to hit his W/Q against people who have boots
but it wouldn't make his teamfighting or 2v2/3v3 fighting insane if you managed to trap them inside it, as it already is a massive stun/zoning tool
[6:05] Hyrum Graff: I mean, I'd be ok with a W cooldown nerf, if my buff were too large.
But I also like your idea.
[6:06] IntrospectionMan: eh, adding numbers nerf consistently to balance out utility leads to a pretty stale champion
plus it kinda frontloads everything onto this ONE SKILL
[6:06] Hyrum Graff: or a reducded stun duration.
[6:07] IntrospectionMan: if it proves to be too much
[6:07] Hyrum Graff: 2.5s is still insane for a basic ability
[6:07] IntrospectionMan: probably just increase the E CD by like1/2 across the board
it is, but landing it is already really good, and if you're really tying in utility in the form of vision denial/aoe slow
the stun begins to matter less
and you'd have people literally just walking into the wall to escape
since the cage itself lasts 3s
landing is already really hard**
i don't think he's in a terrible spot, but adding something like that would be nice
but something as powerful as vision denial makes graves W an incredily strong ability
and people would begin to say that E's veigar was way too overloaded, and i don't think they'd be wrong
if it was more spread out on his kit, sure, but there's nowhere on his kit to really toss that
my thoughts on the matter
for credentials, if they matter, reached d1 in s4 by spamming veigar. am currently p1 with 21 games, many on veigar.