Viktor gets straight nerfs

tXQbsPrjN5·Mar 22, 2016·211 votes·7,611 views

Fiora and Yi get compensation buffs.

Ok Riot.

143 Comments

ElwynnMar 22, 201648 votes

Cus viktor doesnt sell trashy looking project skins

Malicious MetalMar 22, 201666 votes

He's the friggin' creator!

La BarbotteMar 22, 201615 votes

no he created battlecast's malecious (same shit if you ask me)

Malicious MetalMar 22, 201628 votes

Yeah, bad wording on my part. I meant he's no mere project, he creates his very own science projects!

La BarbotteMar 22, 20163 votes

ohh i see, on a side note, are you sad the new mecha skin isnt for the lord of metal himself ?

Malicious MetalMar 22, 201611 votes

I'd rather see him receive a VU before he gets any more skins^^ I think Dragon Knight would look pretty darn rad with today's tech.

Troll for TrumpMar 22, 20163 votes

It's confirmed SIon

Malicious MetalMar 22, 201636 votes

And he's sitting at the lowest mid lane Win rate nowadays :/

Very Hard EngageMar 22, 201618 votes

[{quoted}](name=Malicious Metal,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=V01jWXNa,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2016-03-22T19:47:01.105+0000)

And he's sitting at the lowest mid lane Win rate nowadays :/

does that make Veigar viable now that hes moved up to 47th place? up from 48th?

MarshbouyMar 22, 20161 votes

legit question here, what makes viegar bad? i find i always reck face with hi, its probably just my elo so fill me in on what im missing

Ruin LanceMar 22, 201624 votes

because of all the adcs and ad mids and stuff and the fact that items like item 3156 are being built on almost every AD every game

MarshbouyMar 22, 20162 votes

oh, thats it? must just be bad itemization on the part of the people i play against

RetillinMar 22, 20161 votes

You can still win with him. And the less people play him, means the stronger he is. People forget/don't know how to play against, and those that do play him play him at a higher skill than someone who just picked him up.

bill84Mar 23, 201610 votes

This is why Galio is secret op.

DAM1VMar 23, 20164 votes

Also games generally end pretty quickly in higher tier games if I'm not mistaken, so his power isn't so strong if he only gets 20 minutes to farm instead of an hour.

Low elo games are still pretty long considering people don't know how to capitalize on any mistakes made, so you can still get a lot more time to farm up and just one shot anyone.

Slamurai JackMar 22, 201623 votes

Without compensation buffs, Yi and Fiora continue to build the exact same way, only they'll be a bit worse at it. And that won't do at all considering they're trying to change their playstyle.

GayFluffyUnicornMar 23, 20162 votes

So to avoid that it is better to not change anything at all and in the case of yi even give him more base true dmg. Seems legit.

Slamurai JackMar 23, 20168 votes

Tanky, health stacking builds are significantly nerfed for both champions. I don't feel like going through all the math but the break even point for damage on both champs requires a far greater amount of bonus AD than their current meta builds give them. The break even point for Yi is something like 175 bonus AD IIRC.

ZorasamaMar 23, 20162 votes

Some dude did a math on Yi's E, seems like he need to build ~2 more offensive items to deal the same damage so yeah. But Fiora's passive got nerf just by...1%. and no longer scale with level, now get max scaling at level 1. I don't think that's gonna hurt her much, or even at all.

Slamurai JackMar 23, 20167 votes

By the time you have enough AD for the max scaling to make up for the 1% base that was lost, you're almost always going to have been past the level (lvl 8) where your passive would have had 3.5% base before. For reference, the break even point at lvl 1 is .028X+3%=.045x+2%. X=59. That means the break even point at lvl 1 is 59 bonus AD, which is obviously impossible. The break even point at lvl 8 is 100 bonus AD. Any point beyond lvl 8 is a straight nerf no matter how much AD you have. So yes, it's a nerf all around no matter how you look at it, especially early. Her 8-13 is also significantly weaker as well since they cut the utility scaling on her E which she maxes second. And they heavily nerfed Titanic Hydra as well. And Tiamat is now a weaker powerspike than before.

ZorasamaMar 23, 20162 votes

Oh, you're right. I forgot about Tiamat/Titanic nerf >.>

zC43Vd9D03Mar 22, 201613 votes

Was Viktor abusing an unintended playstyle?

Axis the DragonMar 22, 201610 votes

Not even, that's the worst part. His entire spiel is and always was zone control and waveclear - which required him to build almost pure damage - both of which Azir did better when they were both meta. Then they both got nerfed a little + meta changes and they've disappeared, with only Azir reappearing lately. Somewhat. xD

WyrmbladeMar 22, 201619 votes

Viktor wasn't even abusing his intended playstyle.

My Waifu VanillaMar 22, 201612 votes

Because Fiora and Yi need actual incentives to buy damage, if they don't do that then you are stuck being a terrible bulky champion AND a terrible damage dealer regardless of what they buy. For instance, say no compensation is ever administered and Yi builds the same things he does now after direct nerfs to this build. He would proceed to do mediocre damage and just be a bulky champion with no CC, aka basically useless. Scenario 2 with no compensation is this Yi is tired of doing no damage so he goes for a damage build. In this scenario since they trashed his bases (aimed at tank build) and didn't touch ratios his damage is now still PRETTY garbage, but he now dies the second he gets CC'ed since he built damage, aka basically useless.

Viktor received 1 nerf to E recently and yes, it did hit his waveclear, but he can still waveclear if ahead and burst people like before. Viktor wasn't breaking any "rules" in the game and still scales extremely well, but has to buy a bit more early AP if you REALLY want that 1 E clear the entire wave (which was a tad bit rediculous tbh). Viktor was designed as a bursty wavecleary mage that cleared waves and killed people if they were caught out. He did that and thus, only received a nerf because he did it a little TOO well and can still theoretically do it with a bit more AP. Yi/Fiora on the other hand were designed as "light fighters" that have high mobility and shred your back line if you let them, but die relatively easily when focused. They do most of this, but they do it without the downside of "die relatively easily when focused" part since they do enough damage with low items and can just for 2 damage+4 tank items. Hitting bases stops this scenario, but makes it so they can now die easily when focused, but also make it so they cannot even kill their targets WITH damage items so it is a complete lose-lose and the champion is now trash tier. This is why scalings were buffed to make it so they can still DO their job at dealing damage. Viktor didn't need a scaling buff because he still kills people since his common build allowed him to do so regardless of his bases since his scalings are already pretty f*cking good. Viktor was a case of "I will blow you up after I get 2 items", but was guaranteed those 2 items since E made getting gold a trivial concept since it was guaranteed to clear waves (or atleast the casters) early on regardless if you were 0/2 or 3/0.

NiaphimMar 22, 201610 votes

They will just continue to nerf all AP champions who still manage to lane against AD (Zed, Corki) until there is none viable. All praise League of AD!

GayFluffyUnicornMar 23, 20164 votes

How about not laning against a Zed without armor runes? Seriously i get flamed so often as Zed when i stomp the enemy mage but they show up with 19 armor against a zed who has 12 arpen at lvl1 and 22 after the first back (or 25 something like that)

foinhasMar 23, 20161 votes

But muh 5 AP! :'(

NineTailedMysticMar 23, 20161 votes

Who runs armor quints as a mid laner? Armor yellows are the go to and AP yellows suck. It's irrelevant because 9 armor really isn't anything, anyways.

GayFluffyUnicornJun 22, 20161 votes

If you legit think there is no difference i have nothing left to say. Orianna for example when i remember correctly got 12 armor without her ball. I as Zed got 12-15 arpen on lvl. So i'm dealing true dmg to her. And you really think atleast 10-15% percent dmg reduction isn't anything? Especially on the first lvls?

THESuperStuntManMar 22, 20169 votes

It seems you forgot which game we're playing. This is League of AD we're playing here.

LSmaster16Mar 22, 20169 votes

I believe the reason for compensation buffs is because they don't want to nerf fiora/yi they want to nerf bruiser fiora/yi.

IgotlazyMar 22, 20166 votes

Basically this. Trashcanning Champions is what Riot has been trying to avoid recently. Fiora and Yi don't offer much to a Team utility wise so if they can't do their damage they become overshadowed by other potential picks. These changes are trying to keep them relevant but push away their Tanky builds.

GayFluffyUnicornMar 23, 20161 votes

Oh okay, so after riot nerfed every champ who could solo carry a team only fiora and yi are allowed to 1v5 an entire team because of reasons? Seems legit.

LSmaster16Mar 23, 20166 votes

People have not been complaining or having problems with damage heavy fiora or yi builds. The problem is that people are building them as bruisers which is what was overpowered. Riot is trying to nerf that build, not the champion in general to move the champion back to being a light fighter instead of making the champion average at being a bruiser but underpowered at their intended role.

Supreme Senpai69Mar 22, 20165 votes

T-they buffed Fiora and Yi?

Lol nice one that's a good joke surely that wouldn't happen

pls b joking

My Waifu VanillaMar 22, 201612 votes

All they did was drop tank build damage and make more than 2 damage items almost necessary that way if you DO CC or focus them they don't just laugh at you and still kill your carries. It's fine since if they didn't get compensation buffs the Champions would be both bad at doing damage (their whole "thing" as a light fighter) and taking it, and thus be useless.

Supreme Senpai69Mar 23, 20164 votes

Oh okay thanks for the answer. Not sure why downvoted for asking a question though. Darn downvote drones have stuck again I guess

TotalJerkMar 23, 20163 votes

No. It's a power neutral change if you actually built damage and a straight nerf if you built tank.

seachromeMar 23, 20164 votes

The compensation buff was to reallocate their strengths to damage to get rid of the tank build. Victor got a straight up Nerf because he doesn't have that problem, he just did too much damage.

SeenanMar 22, 20163 votes

Because Viktor makes playing Leblanc painful obviously.

VelasanMar 22, 20163 votes

IMO Viktor should go back to being a siege mage and not an instant kill enemy target with your immense burst mage. More in line with a Xerath or Lux and not with an Annie.

Big LincolnMar 22, 201620 votes

viktor has never not had obscene burst

Sire HippingtonMar 22, 20167 votes

He always was bursty, but befor the rework, he certainly had less burst and better poke. His Q did m,ore damage without AA followup, which is better for pokeing, but didn't have the option to go more risky with the followup AA for significant burst. The E did less aditional damge from the upgrade and did it as dot over 3 sec, but you just needed to connect the inital lazor instead of landing a followup explosion, so easier to fully applie the damage, less overall damage. Ult did less upfront burst, but had more dps and the short silence. As a result, old victor was better at pokeing but raerly blew up people like he does now. Whill he did 100-0 people, it usually involved his Ult ticking away for a couple of aditional sec and more often than not useing a second Q opposed to vaporazing the victim in a split second as he can since the rework. if comboed correctly.