Garen Hate...and all Counter winning passives.

Caytheles··2 votes·476 views

So i am learning assassins because they seem fun and would be a good addition to my Champion pool. And with Talone i do pretty well... But i just realised that garens Villain passive is the most counter productive thing i have ever known... next to Irelias stupid stun.

Why was i being punished for being 8/2/2... He could dps me down and for what? all because i won my lane? also why on earth can irelia stun when you beat her at dueling... and why does tryndamere do more dmg the lower he gets aswell as having an undying passive.

These types of passives need to be removed, No point in winning when it will only give the enemy champ an advantage.

18 Comments

Caytheles2 votes

More downvotes, probably from people that main those champs... psh

Caytheles1 votes

Already a downvote... but tell my how are these justified?

BoilTheOil1 votes

cuz ur bad

Caytheles1 votes

i was 8/2 how am i bad XD.

Caytheles1 votes

i was 8/2 how am i bad XD. i was also beating them.... but those passives makes it so that they do dmg for losing.. but since you are plat... why dont you tell me why those HAVE to be in their kits... or in the game at all.

BoilTheOil1 votes

because if they didnt have those things in their kits they would probably be bad

Guyy Fieri2 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tetris C,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UwxFHQEH,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2016-01-02T02:09:15.796+0000)

Already a downvote... but tell my how are these justified?

It's part of their kit. Why is fair that Talkn can go stealthed before deing a boat load of AOE damage? Because it's his kit.

Caytheles1 votes

Because he is squishy and has no escape and no hard cc.... thats why.

It still doesnt answerthe question at all, and if Talon falls behind he has nothing to really come back to other than trying to kill the adc if they are alone.

But why is there punishment for doing good... Why can a Tank, be able to 1v1 your most fed player even if he isnt fed.

Why can a burst fighter such as irelia Punish you for beating her in duels for 2 whole seconds...

And why does tryndamere get a passive that promotes being at 1 hp with ult...

You are right, it is part of their kits... but in no way does it make sense or make the person they are fighting want to try against them.

Guyy Fieri5 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tetris C,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UwxFHQEH,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2016-01-02T02:58:09.086+0000)

Because he is squishy and has no escape and no hard cc.... thats why.

It still doesnt answerthe question at all, and if Talon falls behind he has nothing to really come back to other than trying to kill the adc if they are alone.

But why is there punishment for doing good... Why can a Tank, be able to 1v1 your most fed player even if he isnt fed.

Why can a burst fighter such as irelia Punish you for beating her in duels for 2 whole seconds...

And why does tryndamere get a passive that promotes being at 1 hp with ult...

You are right, it is part of their kits... but in no way does it make sense or make the person they are fighting want to try against them.

You will learn that this is part of the downside to playing assassins. Most are feast or famine (not all I know but most.) They are insanely snowball reliant. Put yourself in Garen's shoes real quick. He's in top lane and his mid lane feeds to a Talon. All the while, he's doing fine top lane. Why is fair that you just immediately take away everything from Garen's game? The need for coutnerplay goes both ways. You can counter Garen because you are still more mobile than Garen. To be fair though, if you are Talon, you really don't ever want to be targeting Garen unless everyone else is dead. Garen will build armor and especially with the Last Whisper nerf, it will be harder to Talon to assassinate Garen.

Further, if a Tank can 1 v 1 your most fed players, then those most fed are likely doing something wrong. Whether its not utilizing their spells rotation properly or missing skill shots or not kiting the tanks (which the biggest thing I see fed ADCs, mid laners not doing), then the tank should win because the goal of most assassins is to not stand there and try for sustained damage but to deal a whole of burst damage and run away. A weak point of assassins tends to be their lack of sustained damage, meaning if they can't kite, use their spell rotations properly and hit all their skills shots, they will lose to tanks, who tend to deal good sustained damage.

Irelia is a duelist. If you as an assassin try to duel her, you will lose. Rather than focus Irelia, focus the ADC. I know you said this was an issue but that is literally the single reason why assassins are strong right now. ADCs are strong, and assassins best role is to kill the ADC. In a team fight, if you are putting your damage on a Garen or Irelia, then the problem is with the playstyle.

I don't know where Tryndamere came into this but let me entertain you. Tryndamere is a split pusher. That ultimate grants Tryndamere the ability to split push with a safety net; much like Aatrox's passive. If you look at Tryndamere's kit, he has a very lack luster escape, one slow that is meh and then an abilitiy that grants him his sustain/his rage bar and his ultimate. That's it. There is no triple dash, no %health damage, no hard CC. Tryndamere's ult allows him to fulfill his role as a split pusher.

All of this is the point I am trying to tell you. You, as Talon, will need to think very carefully about who you target. You don't deal sustained damage, you deal burst damage, your goal should be to burst down a squishy target and either kill them or take them out a fight and then allow your sustained damage teammates to clean up the fight.

Guyy Fieri1 votes

And I actually downvoted because the ability for Garen and Irelia to do this is not linked with their passives. Garen's passive is health regen and Irelias is tenacity based on the number of nearby enemies. Neither of these would make you lose a duel. The mechanics you are talking about are abilities that the champions have. Before you QQ about these champions, learn what they actually do.

Caytheles1 votes

Irelias Slow is basically a slow... its passive is that if she has less % hp than you its a stun...

Garens is a passive to his ult. it isnt an Active ability.

Please learn that they are also passives of their active abilities.... dont be so dumb next time.

Guyy Fieri3 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tetris C,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UwxFHQEH,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2016-01-02T03:00:43.713+0000)

Irelias Slow is basically a slow... its passive is that if she has less % hp than you its a stun...

Garens is a passive to his ult. it isnt an Active ability.

Please learn that they are also passives of their active abilities.... dont be so dumb next time.

Ok no. Irelia's E is an ability that slows but if the enemy has more %health, then it stuns. There is nothing passive about it. A passive would be when champions gain armor or mr just for unlocking an ability. That's a passive. If Irelia's E were a passive, it would be stun central. But it's an active. Not a passive.

I cannot say for certain that Garen's isn't listed as a passive, its been a while since I played Garen. I think that it is actually coded as part of the tooltip, not a passive. Meaning it just states the conditions of being a villain and what it does.

Can I just ask if you have ever actually played Irelia or Garen?

Caytheles1 votes

You dont know what a passive means... but i will let it go. Vocabulary is something that most (S) people dont know the full extent of.

And yes, i have played them, it just makes winning Easier, and losing harder with the Villain passive.

And as for irelia... if there is a condition to where it can be activated... it is a passive... and is basically a counter win mechanic.

Guyy Fieri1 votes

[{quoted}](name=Tetris C,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=UwxFHQEH,comment-id=0002000000000000,timestamp=2016-01-02T03:33:44.533+0000)

You dont know what a passive means... but i will let it go. Vocabulary is something that most (S) people dont know the full extent of.

And yes, i have played them, it just makes winning Easier, and losing harder with the Villain passive.

And as for irelia... if there is a condition to where it can be activated... it is a passive... and is basically a counter win mechanic.

Lol. You really think I am so stupid that I don't know what passive means? You are clearly not going to talk maturely here and you clearly do not agree with me and will not listen to so reasonable logic. Enjoy your downvotes. Bye.

Caytheles1 votes

Snowflake

Crossette1 votes

Enjoy your downvotes.

talk maturely here

clearly do not agree with me

reasonable logic

Do you realize that you look like a 12 year old right now?

1st Movement1 votes

Talon is an assaisain he suppose to target squishes not tanks Garen has silence you should get qss Second talon dps is from his abilities Are you properly comboing on him?

Sir Yamazuki1 votes

Having 8 kills is irrelevant when you don't farm. You are better off with no kills and more farm.

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