So, Kindred is Death, and Bard is Order, Is something coming? to the point that Beings that go throughout space and time in all things need to make themselves into Physical/spectral beings, What is coming? and what relation does Bard have with Kindred
Edit: Think of them as the 4 horseman of Runeterra? I expect 2 more Champions that Govern reality.
insaiyanbacca7 votesdefinitely an interesting possibility and i hope that's the case. perhaps kog'maw's "daddy" is coming. because iirc someone mentioned kogs father being extremely powerful or something.
Caytheles5 votesthe True Baron Nashor, is Kog'maw's dad, Maybe the Watchers are coming? or even Ao Shin. or Ao Shin Controlled by the Watchers? e_e lol
aaronconlin2 votesthe True Baron Nashor, is Kog'maw's dad, Maybe the Watchers are coming? or even Ao Shin. or Ao Shin Controlled by the Watchers? e_e lol
The "true" Baron Nashor is the one on Summoner's Rift now, it was retconned with the removal of the IoW and LoL. It's no longer a copy
CaptnJakSparrow3 votesThe "true" Baron Nashor is the one on Summoner's Rift now, it was retconned with the removal of the IoW and LoL. It's no longer a copy
Baron Nashor is a pussy.
Ferno1 votesi think kindred maybe is ao shin except they ditched ao shin and made kindred, also they have a striking resemblance
GreenLore1 votesNot really,Ao shin is an asian dragon,with storm powers,while kindred are a lamb and a wolf spirit that represents death.
I think they said that they put ao shin on ice for now,since it was difficult managing his serpentine body ingame.
V The Support V1 votesFrom what we have seen with the terrain traverse abilities(reksai/bard) / Global abilites (reksai,TahmK) and now the Wolf aspect of Kindred's visuals it may not be outside the realm of possibility that these are all just practice tests for what #AoShin may become.
Pikmints1 votesI do hope that sooner or later we get a void event, and I could see this being them setting up for it if that's in Riot's scope at the moment.
I'm more tempted to write this off as Riot trying to make a unique and interesting character though. Their old characters are an explorer (Ezreal), a pyromancer girl (Annie), and a mage (Ryze). Their newer champions are a dual representation of death (Kindred), deity of order (Bard), and a specter of vengeance (Kalista).
It looks to me like Riot is simply trying to make more memorable characters that also touch on areas that they haven't yet. Their older ideas worked, especially in a context with summoners and the Institute, but the newer characters feel more like the powerful mythical creatures or most powerful individuals of their land where before they felt more like people that were good with magic.
Chromatic Eagle5 votesI think it's more of Riot creating something to replace the IoW while expanding the lore. They like the idea of cosmic beings representing certain themes.
GreenLore5 votesWell they are both some sort of spirits who wear masks and whose abilities encourage roaming,so I think they might belong to the same type of spirit.
might be such a spirit who took off her mask and thus became mortal
could also be one cnsidering that he also wears a glowing mask
Ralanr1 votesJax is a mystery after all.
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votesWell, since the OP spamed in many threads about this, i will post my own theory that connects Bard and Kindred:
Kindred are a "Celestial Being" in charge of the death.
We know that
are Celestials... but they dont look alike, however, if we compare them with Lamb and Wolf, we can see the similarities.
. She is a female and if we look at her body structure, her legs to be exact, we can see that she has "goat like" legs.
Lamb in other hand, according to my theory, is a Celestial Being that brings death. As
If we compare him with Lamb and Wolf, we can notice that they also wear masks, Lamb has also strange legs, and like Wolf, his real body is... really abstract. Now, if we compare Bard with Soraka, we can also notice that they both have a horn and weird legs.
All those champs have, at least an slight similitude with the Caprinae.
.... but... where does the Wolf fits in all this?
Well, remember our friend
, after drinking the potion, he became a Werewolf. Why did he turned into a Werewolf? Well, it seems obvious that it was because the potion had the fang of a Balefire dire wolf... but... Why did
Ralanr2 votes
the chosen of the sun and 
the chosen of the moon. Both mortal conduits of these cosmic bodies.
seems to be a cosmic being. If Bard and Kindred are aware of each other, with Kindred being life and death and Bard being Order...something is coming.
The shadow isles has its four horsemen. 
is famine because he pursues you until you break, just like hunger follows you until you die. 
is war. 
is death. 
is pestilence/conquest.
Perhaps 
is a cosmic being of chaos? 
will most likely keep his nightmare theme.
If we needed a sin of wrath, I think 
would fit the cosmic form of it until changed.
The everlasting hunters have arrived. The question remains, who are they planning to hunt? If the theory of them killing the Ruined King is true...actually that makes more sense than I previously thought.
The Ruined King became obsessed with life and death, seeking to break the boundaries of it. Kindred is the personification of life and death. The Ruined King was a threat, a threat that needed to be removed.
As much as I wanted a Mt. Targon lore event, I'm now pumped as hell for the Shadow Isles.
Æsema1 votes isn't a shadow isles champion and thresh is a being of death collecter of souls 
is famine for she hungers to live forever
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votes
...... .... ...... what?
Karthus is a harbinger of oblivion, zealously devoted to the beauty and clarity of death. Even in his youth, he was utterly obsessed with mortality, growing ever more relentless in the pursuit of his dark desires. Yearning to be one with death itself, Karthus journeyed to the Shadow Isles and willingly offered himself to undeath. Karthus transformed into the Deathsinger, a dread lich existing solely to deliver the blessed gift of annihilation.
Caytheles2 votesAwe they made his lore smaller!!! Why?!?!?!?! it was so good. But he used to be human, he gained his power IN the Shadow isles. i forgot where his place of birth was though.
Sharjo1 votesOne thing I noticed from their VO is that they seem to have a bunch of lines for Bard specifically:
"Pop the balloon!" Wolf. Great sense of humor on that guy! "We know your name child, woven across countless almost lives." Lamb "Rushing to meet us again I see?" Lamb "Have we met before?" Wolf "His song sounds good!" Wolf "The singer mistakes melody for substance." Lamb "Long have we shadowed your deeds." Lamb "Turn and face us now!" Wolf
I dunno if they're all for Bard but they seem to be from my standpoint. "His song", "Pop the balloon!"? Seem appropriate for our resident Bard. If these are directed at him, it implies a few things concerning their relationship:
But why? I'd say it's because Bard intervenes in the natural way of things; Kindred has expressed that they don't like people who run from death, in Lamb's own words: "Those who run from death stood still in life.", and Bard is someone who has managed to save people from certain doom presumably countless times throughout history, both directly and indirectly. Bard is responsible for thousands of lives existing in the present day that wouldn't exist otherwise, throwing the natural course of life and death off. He's delayed the inevitable demise millions of people, and has done so for thousands of years. I don't know about you guys, but if I was even just one half of Kindred I'd be pretty upset about that!
EDIT: Scratch that, it's probably Karthus she's taunting for most of those, which makes sense too; he steals people from life and death, bringing them to undeath.
Ebonmaw Dragon3 votesOne thing I noticed from their VO is that they seem to have a bunch of lines for Bard specifically:
"Pop the balloon!" Wolf. Great sense of humor on that guy! "We know your name child, woven across countless almost lives." Lamb "Rushing to meet us again I see?" Lamb "Have we met before?" Wolf "His song sounds good!" Wolf "The singer mistakes melody for substance." Lamb "Long have we shadowed your deeds." Lamb "Turn and face us now!" Wolf
I dunno if they're all for Bard but they seem to be from my standpoint. "His song", "Pop the balloon!"? Seem appropriate for our resident Bard. If these are directed at him, it implies a few things concerning their relationship:
- They've encountered each other at least once before, and at least in a passing way.
- Kindred really doesn't approve of Bard's actions.
- Kindred knows the extent to which Bard has kept Runeterra, and potentially other worlds safe.
But why? I'd say it's because Bard intervenes in the natural way of things; Kindred has expressed that they don't like people who run from death, in Lamb's own words: "Those who run from death stood still in life.", and Bard is someone who has managed to save people from certain doom presumably countless times throughout history, both directly and indirectly. Bard is responsible for thousands of lives existing in the present day that wouldn't exist otherwise, throwing the natural course of life and death off. He's delayed the inevitable demise millions of people, and has done so for thousands of years. I don't know about you guys, but if I was even just one half of Kindred I'd be pretty upset about that!
I think that "His song sounds good!" Wolf "The singer mistakes melody for substance." Lamb talks about
Xeynid1 votes"We know your name, woven across countless Almost-Lives" doesn't sound like it addresses Bard.
Kalista or Aatrox maybe?
Peridition1 votes"We know your name, woven across countless Almost-Lives" doesn't sound like it addresses Bard.
Kalista or Aatrox maybe?
Its actually, "We know your name child,..."
So most likely its Annie.
WarlockLaw1 votes"...woven across countless Almost-Lives" doesn't really sound like a description of Annie. Keep in mind that this is an ancient being that seemingly embodies death, most things would seem like children to Kindred.
Peridition1 votes"...woven across countless Almost-Lives" doesn't really sound like a description of Annie. Keep in mind that this is an ancient being that seemingly embodies death, most things would seem like children to Kindred.
In retrospect, given its placement I think it might actually be for Ekko.
All responses are in alphabetical order and this one occurs before the one that likely Gangplank, but after Bard.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesIn retrospect, given its placement I think it might actually be for Ekko.
All responses are in alphabetical order and this one occurs before the one that likely Gangplank, but after Bard.
... it would mean that They are unaffected by the "time"?
Æsema1 votesekko
Axis the Dragon1 votesKindred is Life & Death (with Karthus being just Death), Bard/Soraka are Order, Zilean (and Ekko) are Time... Kassadin/Malz are Space? I guess? Balance - the Kinkou (Shen, Akali, Kennen)
What else would be missing? Chaos (Shaco, Aatrox)? We already have Luck/Chance (TF), Light (Lux) and Dark (Nocturne)/Shadow (Zed), Good (Garen) and Evil (Singed).
-edit- Idk if the 7 sins really fit with what we're looking for but hey whatever xD Wrath... Sion, Tryndamere, Olaf Greed... TF, Syndra/Veigar (Greed for power) Sloth... Nunu - 'cuz Willump does all the work, Nunu just throws snowballs Lust... Evelynn, I guess? Envy... Amumu, definitely Amumu. Gluttony... Tahm Kench, Cho'Gath, Willump (Nunu's Yeti)
Caytheles2 votesZilean and Ekko arent the Governers of time, they just found a way to control it, Just like Karthus isnt the Govern of Death, Kindred IS death itself, so you will most likely see kindred at every death.
What i mean here is that these are beings that Govern what they do, Bard Governs Order throughout Time itself. (I dont know how he can see time but maybe we will see WHO allows bard to tell what happens in the future id he doesnt stop what.
Soraka, well she lives in the stars, to the point where mortals come to her for guidance, So i would say she is a lesser Celestial.
And the one who governs space would be the one who Rules the Void, maybe Baron? not really sure.
Also Kindred is only Death, the reason she has her Ult symbolizes as a "it is not your time yet, but soon" sort of Thought.
Melledoneus1 votesThe 7 deadly sins are already personified in the Shadow Isles champions.
Evelynn-Lust. Yorick- Sloth. Thresh- Gluttony. Elise- Greed. Mordekaiser- Envy. Hecarim- Wrath. Karthus- Pride.
Ralanr1 votesHow is mordekaiser envy?
Melledoneus1 votesMordekaiser in German apparently means "Murder Emperor" or something along those lines. The main theory is that Mordekaiser envied the dominion of the Ruined King so he murdered him and stole his power. I mean, that mace and armor had to come from somewhere, right?
GreenLore1 votes
gets left out or what?
Honestly that theory doesn't really hold itself,it was merely "oh hey there are 7 shadow isles champions,they must represent the 7 deadly sins!"
I've seen already multiple people now trying to shove the void champs into the 7deadly sins simply because there are currently 7 void champs.
Not to mention that some of them don't fit that well(thresh doesn't consume souls,he tortures them out of sadism,which would actually fit lust more and there is nothing really that speaks for morde being envious on anyone)
Melledoneus1 votesThresh doesn't torture every single soul he comes across, mind you. Also, his passive at 250 or so stacks becomes "Soul Glutton."
Additionally, he is seen obviously consuming souls during his taunt animation. He opens the lantern and he literally EATS them. "Torment comes in so many flavors."
He's like the Tahm Kench of the Shadow Isles.
Also, Kalista is a being of vengeance. She only punishes betrayal, thus she would not fit within the 7 deadly sins, except maybe wrath, but it's shaky at best.
Mordekaiser himself is very mysterious. However, there is a strong theory that he once served the Ruined King. I suppose he may have betrayed and killed the King, since his name means "Murder Emperor" in German. Also, if you listen to the altars in the Twisted Treeline: "I serve you, because** I must**, Mordekaiser." "Free me, my **lord, so I may aid you!"
The first implies that since Mordekaiser is the emperor/lord of sorts, she has no choice but to serve him. The second literally says "my lord," heavily implying this as well. There is more evidence than you believe, and perhaps when the Shadow Isles event comes we can learn more about how he overthrew and killed the Ruined King.
GreenLore1 votesI'd say kalista would fit wrath more than hecarim. Hecarim gets associated with wrath since he is associated with violence and war,but he doesn't actually seem wrathful,while in kalistas case its really anger why she fights.Also why would kalista be the exception?Evelynn is a complete mystery and from what we know probably doesn't work for the shadow isles,yorick is just a guy doing his job and Elise isn't even necessarily undead. These are far bigger oddballs than Kalista.
And Morde probably didn't betray the king(at least not directly),since kalista didn't mark him as a betrayer(she did mark hecarim though) and taking something from someone isn't necessarily envy(thats more greed),envy is more about taking/destroying something from someone because you don't want them to have it. Also I wouldn't put that much emphasis on Mordes name,it probably just refers to him being a lord and a guy who kills people...
Melledoneus1 votesI suppose Kalista could fit, but she does not embody wrath as much as being the higher power that helps for a price. In exchange for their soul, a person helpless in their death could appeal to the Spirit of Vengeance, who could use her superior strength and power to get the revenge a person could never get on their own. She's more like an avenger than a wrathful beast.
Hecarim is wrathful, and being the commander of an army of undead proves that's the reason he was the one to lead them. The one to lead the charge headlong with a battlecry, tearing apart all who opposed him. Hecarim is literally filled with spectral flame, symbolizing his flaring anger that burns within him. Just my observations.
Evelynn can be said to portray lust just by hearing her VU. She's obviously in the succubus area of seductive, which is the embodiment of a lustful demon.
Yorick was lazy and did not get married to have a child, meaning that he was the one to eternally dig the graves of the Shadow Isles. Sloth defines him as a result.
Mordekaiser doesn't want his opponents to have their lives, so he steals their souls from them to destroy it. He doesn't want to give them rest, and he harvests their sorrow when he takes it.
GreenLore1 voteskalista acts out of hatred. Its her wrath that causes her to hunt betrayers and she gets hired by people who also hate betrayers so much,that they are willing to sell their soul to Kalista.These souls become a part of Kalista meaning that more and more hatred builds up in her,so much in fact that it threatens to consume her own personality.
Hecarim on the other hand is the herald of the shadow isles,but just because he is a fierce and wild fighter doesn't mean he is wrathful. He enjoys slaughtering his enemies,he enjoys war,but that doesn't mean he acts out of wrath.Its just that violence&war are easier associated with wrath,even if they don't necessarily happen because of it.
And I very well understand why Eve and Yorick supposedly represent lust&sloth,but that wasn't my question. You said Kalista is an exception because she is different from the other shadow isles champs,so she is left out. But Yorick and Evelynn are also different,yet they aren't left out,simply because it is convenient for the 7deadly-sin theory.
Melledoneus1 votesI completely agree how Kalista could fit wrath. But unfortunately, it's not that simple.
Kalista embodies the "Eye for an Eye" idea. She is the one who hunts betrayers, bound to this task because of some strange spectral curse that occurred when she was betrayed by her fellow soldiers. (Hence the spears in her body) Kalista is filled with hatred for traitors, and she seems them more as a disease to be purged, a sickness to be cleansed.
Hecarim is just really, really pissed off. Sure, he laughs and makes jokes sometimes, but the reason he lived on was his fury and wrath. He still leads the armies of Mordekaiser, and the literal flame inside him is his burning passion anger. For some reason, he's full of fury at all times. Maybe it was the manner of his resurrection, or he's just like Sion.
GreenLore1 votesI completely agree how Kalista could fit wrath. But unfortunately, it's not that simple.
Kalista embodies the "Eye for an Eye" idea. She is the one who hunts betrayers, bound to this task because of some strange spectral curse that occurred when she was betrayed by her fellow soldiers. (Hence the spears in her body) Kalista is filled with hatred for traitors, and she seems them more as a disease to be purged, a sickness to be cleansed.
And your arguement here is? Like you describe it,Kalista is full of hatred,I dunno how thats "not that simple". it doesn't matter what Kalista does,but why she does what she does and that is quite simply wrath. Its like saying "I agree how Eve could fit lust,but its not that simple,she is an assassin that is mysterious" Why does it matter that Kalista hunts betrayers?Why would that be a reason for her not to embody wrath?Everyone from the shadow isles does something different.
Hecarim is just really, really pissed off. Sure, he laughs and makes jokes sometimes, but the reason he lived on was his fury and wrath. He still leads the armies of Mordekaiser, and the literal flame inside him is his burning passion anger. For some reason, he's full of fury at all times. Maybe it was the manner of his resurrection, or he's just like Sion.
And all what you are saying here is pure speculation. Hecarim might be simply devoted to the shadow isles,what he does might be out of pure loyalty,pure fervor,or simply pure sadism,fascination with war.
Melledoneus1 votesHatred is not wrath. Wrath is anger. Sion is a perfect example of wrath, he's always screaming, growling, spitting threats at everyone. Hecarim is also quite wrathful, as he doesn't tear through enemy lines without a reason to. His anger fuels him. Here's an excerpt from his lore: "...he was the vengeful shade of an ancient warrior, intent on destroying all living beings..." He is the "vanguard of undeath" who enjoys tearing down people, raining down his wrath upon all who are foolish enough to oppose him.
Fascination with war is more like Aatrox.
GreenLore1 votesIn what way is hatred not related to anger?Hatred IS anger.If you hate someone,then you are mad at that person,you feel annoyment or anger just thinking about that person. Kalista acts out of the anger over her betrayal. Anger is wrath.
And you should have posted the whole sentence from hecarims lore: "Some claimed that he was the vengeful shade of an ancient warrior, intent on destroying all living beings..." We can't be sure if this is really true or just the legends about hecarim(not to mention that this is from his old lore,which might not be canon anymore,especially since it was still written with the IoW in mind). Also wanting to destroy life doesn't need to come from anger or wrath. For example it could also come from his pride as a member of the shadow isles,seeing the living as inferior.
Also Hecarim is the shadow of war and he even has "War is eternal." as a quote,meanwhile he has not a single quote about anger or wrath.
Melledoneus1 votesYou bring up a good point about the lore not being canon anymore. Seeing as how that's the basis of my argument, I concede my point. Well said, good sir.
Axis the Dragon4 votesI've tried digging around for a confirmation
From what I've gathered, Riot didn't actually plan for that to happen, it was just kind of coincidental - mind you, this was back in, like, 2013 (Grumpy Monkey is a Senior Character Artist at Riot)
Zerglinator: I see the current arrangement of Shadow Isles champs as a correlation to the Seven Deadly Sins, where Evelynn represents Lust. I'd like her to work off of that theme if possible."
Grumpy Monkey: Zerg, that's kinda cool. What is your list?"
Zerglinator: Evelynn-Lust. Kind of obvious, being the Widowmaker. She's seductive, people believe she's a safe person, then she strikes when it's too late and leaves them no chance of escape. She always catches up to her victims.
Hecarim-Wrath. He's the Shadow of War, he charges in and starts destroying everything, and in a good number of cases, his furious charge leaves him with no option of running away. Once he begins his rampage, it's hard to stop.
Thresh-Gluttony. He devours souls all the time and keeps growing from it. He even has a hidden bonus buff when he reaches 255 souls which is called "Soul Glutton".
Yorick-Sloth. His lore seems to suggest that he rose from the dead with his job unfinished for a long time. Yorick doesn't do all the work himself, he mostly just summons Ghouls to do his work for him.
Mordekaiser-Envy. He drains life from people with every spell and turns it into a shield. His ultimate brings his envy of another's soul forth, stealing their health, their stats, and the entire person.
Elise-Greed. For the sake of her own power and vanity, she sacrifices tons of people to the Spider. Spiders also are commonly (to my knowledge) used to symbolize greed with their lifestyle.
Karthus-Pride. A man who thinks he's so important death should bow to him. Upon dying, his desire to keep himself alive allows him to defy death. His ultimate manifests his pride in his song, forcing all to hear his Requiem-it could even be the Requiem he made for his OWN death.
Tigernmas: This isn't as relevant but I saw something earlier in this thread about the shadow isles champions representing the deadly sins, perhaps that idea is more useful if you apply it to the Darkin, with only one confirmed you could easily portray the rest in a way that they all line up with one sin or another.
Grumpy Monkey: "Yeah I like the Seven Deadly Sin Theme. I agree that making her a full fledged Darkin would be a lot of work, and could potentially close the door on making a brand new Darkin. Sooo, what if she was only Half-Darkin? A Hybrid with no place in the world, so she has to carve out her own destiny with all the fun character development that comes with it? I feel like I need to draw now."
This is pretty much all I could find on the subject.
Melledoneus1 votesYou, sir, have done your homework and see what I mean. You get an upvote.
However, even though Mordekaiser's place as envy fits, it's shaky at best. He's implied to be a lord, and he's implied to be a corrupt leader in most iterations. The altars especially note this. "I serve you because I must" mirrors the peasant who follows the King's order because he/she must, not because they would like to.
It's true that Riot didn't base them off it, or rather it seems that way, however now that the comparison makes so much sense it provides a great place to start improving on champions.
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesYou, sir, have done your homework and see what I mean. You get an upvote.
However, even though Mordekaiser's place as envy fits, it's shaky at best. He's implied to be a lord, and he's implied to be a corrupt leader in most iterations. The altars especially note this. "I serve you because I must" mirrors the peasant who follows the King's order because he/she must, not because they would like to.
It's true that Riot didn't base them off it, or rather it seems that way, however now that the comparison makes so much sense it provides a great place to start improving on champions.
To be fair, the altar says "I serve you because I must." to all the champions, but to Mordekaiser she says: "I serve you, because I must, Mordekaiser."
Melledoneus1 votesShe means it when she says that to Mordekaiser. If she doesn't serve him, he'll just force her, and just makes things harder.
Melledoneus1 votesNot to mention Aatrox embodies strife and chaos.
Perhaps we now await the one who governs life.
Caytheles2 votesTrue, however Aatrox seems more like a being that interferes for his own benefit with mortals, Meanwhile Bard and Kindred are more of Natural sources. We all die, and order must be kept. but maybe... we dont know much about the Darkin.
Bard and Kindred might be part of the 5 Darkin, then it would Put Aatrox at their level. so many possibilities,
Ebonmaw Dragon1 votesTrue, however Aatrox seems more like a being that interferes for his own benefit with mortals, Meanwhile Bard and Kindred are more of Natural sources. We all die, and order must be kept. but maybe... we dont know much about the Darkin.
Bard and Kindred might be part of the 5 Darkin, then it would Put Aatrox at their level. so many possibilities,
Riot confirmed that Bard is not a Darkin, he is a Celestial Being.
Caytheles1 votesWelp, i guess that answers that, and if there are only 5 Darkin that means they were killed by something. Meanwhile Bard and Kindred cant die, they can only be repelled,
(well bard Returns to his normal form and then takes on his body again when he is ready or when he needs to)
(and kindred is death....)
Man i just want to know!!!
Melledoneus1 votesIf you think about it, Hecarim is a spirit of war. I know he once served the Ruined King, but even mere men can become gods.