Statikk Shiv's niche is inferior to Runaan's Hurricane

Bonipherus··18 votes·5,906 views

Statikk Shiv is an item that marksmen are supposed to buy when they need more waveclear. The bonus damage to minions tooltip tries to sell this point. The problem, however, is that Runaan's Hurricane allows you to clear an entire wave faster than Statikk Shiv will while also granting you more power in team fights.

25 Comments

YumaS2Astral17 votes

Yeah but Statikk Shiv is still superior to Runaan's Hurricane in 1x1 due to the passive.

Essentially, Statikk Shiv is a halfway between Runnan's Hurricane and Rapid Firecannon.

jaymc11301 votes

{quoted}

Yeah but Statikk Shiv is still superior to Runaan's Hurricane in 1x1 due to the passive.

Essentially, Statikk Shiv is a halfway between Runnan's Hurricane and Rapid Firecannon.

Just build all three. Problem solved.

=P

Beldair1 votes

That's what i do. It works out quite well too.

Bonipherus1 votes

But the point of building a Statikk Shiv is supposed to be for enhanced waveclear and Runaan's isn't meant for 1v1's. So just because Runaan's isn't as good at one on one combat as a Statikk doesn't mean that Statikk is doing what it is supposed to or that Runaan's isn't still better for waveclear than a shiv.

qetzel1 votes

It offers more waveclear in a siege. You don't want to be attacking too much as the minion wave approaches. That could leave you vulnerable.

Bonipherus1 votes

True, when you cannot safely attack minons shiv will do you better for waveclear because of the lack of auto attacks you will be getting off on them. However, I don't believe this situation is justifiable enough to let the overall waveclear difference between the items remain the same when Shiv has been quoted to be the crit item a marksman gets when they want to clear some minion waves.

MohawkBird1 votes

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Theturtlebox2 votes

runaans has crit chance now, and the side bolts can crit, also gives ms. They're basically the same item at this point. other than the unique actives i mean

Sire Hippington1 votes

the sidebolts may crit now, but their basedamage was nerfed, so unless you have 100% crit or 66%crit+IE, they deal less damage than befor

ModKnightsKemplar3 votes

I see your point. I have long bemoaned the way that Runaan's works in this game. The fact is that the way statikk works just makes it better, because you can take it for single target burst damage. It works great for that AND has decent waveclear.

Now, in theory, I agree with what people said below... Basically that runaan's is better for teamfighting. Unfortunate truth is... no, in my experience. The reason is that the range for the bolts on Runaan's is pitifully low. I hardly ever get it to actually work well. I sometimes build it anyway, hoping I judged it too soon, and I always wind up disappointed. It's just a bad item, and the rework didn't help. It needs to have that range extended, and Statikk needs to only apply to targets around your main target. With those changes, things would be a lot better.

TL;DR - You are only right in theory. If the items filled their intended purposes, you would be right. But they don't, and Statikk is just better 99% of the time.

BiBoX22 votes

The range of the bolts were cool in S4 and S5. However it's nerfed recently (pre-season S6) so the range of bolts is really pitiful now. Worse, is that the nerf is a 'ninja nerf' - not documented in the patch notes. Hopefully when many people realizes that Rito will admit it in the next patch.

Statikk Shiv were better because of cheap price and the MS boost - only lower than Trinity Force and Zephyr. Now it, RFC and Runaan are quite close, just a little different depending on champion.

Remlap12232 votes

Statik Shiv is meant for burst damage while Runaan's is meant for on hit damage.

Sivir and Miss Fortune make best use of Statik Shiv, while Jinx and Ashe make better use of Runaan's because of the slow and rockets. They don't need Statik Shiv to supplement their burst, since Ashe is used for utility and Jinx already has her rockets.

Bonipherus1 votes

Quote from patch notes 5.22: We set out to accomplish this goal by making each decision more specialized, like Last Whisper only affecting bonus armor, so it's not just a generalist "deal more damage" item - it's specifically for armor-stacking opponents. This means it's also possible to make the wrong decision, like buying a Statikk Shiv for waveclear when your team really needs siege potential.

Here, Riot directly tells us the strategic niche Statikk Shiv is supposed to fill.

Side note: ifyou want actual burst damage from a crit item then item 3094 will do better than shiv with its higher base damage on its passive proc.

Sasogwa2 votes

{quoted}

Quote from patch notes 5.22: We set out to accomplish this goal by making each decision more specialized, like Last Whisper only affecting bonus armor, so it's not just a generalist "deal more damage" item - it's specifically for armor-stacking opponents. This means it's also possible to make the wrong decision, like buying a Statikk Shiv for waveclear when your team really needs siege potential.

Here, Riot directly tells us the strategic niche Statikk Shiv is supposed to fill.

Side note: ifyou want actual burst damage from a crit item then item 3094 will do better than shiv with its higher base damage on its passive proc.

According to the description, Rapidfire's passive can't crit and shiv can. If you crit, the burst is higher with statikk. Also statikk gives slightly more attackspeed.

Bonipherus2 votes

Did not notice that the firecannon proc couldn't crit. But it seems that the only way that Statikk will deal more damage is from a crit with Infinity edge's bonus crit damage. Otherwise the values seem the extremely similar if not exactly the same with a normal crit. Correct me if I'm wrong though.

chipndip11 votes

{quoted}

Statik Shiv is meant for burst damage while Runaan's is meant for on hit damage.

Sivir and Miss Fortune make best use of Statik Shiv, while Jinx and Ashe make better use of Runaan's because of the slow and rockets. They don't need Statik Shiv to supplement their burst, since Ashe is used for utility and Jinx already has her rockets.

  1. You're right: Jinx would opt for Runaan's/RFC/PD, not Shiv.

  2. Jinx's rockets aren't burst. The main reason why Jinx doesn't need Shiv is because Runaan's can layer crits on opponents for more damage without charging it.

AyRe CoNteMpT1 votes

the main problem with all these items and the entire ad-item rework is that they basically made all these items the exact same with different passives. really bad design choice and impossible to balance because one of them will ALWAYS be better.

rampaging poet1 votes

As opposed to before, where just about everyone always built Phantom Dancer because it had the best stats? At least we have a choice of passives now.

AyRe CoNteMpT1 votes

well before it was the same thing. phantom dancer and statikk shiv were the same items except shiv was a little better for a while and then it was worse and thus everyone only bought one of these items.

for example, the old runaans hurricane was really great because it was completely different than anything else and even tho only kalista and kayle really used that item, it was still a good item to have in the game, "underused" or not.

its just good to have vastly different items and ofcourse the more unique these items are, the fewer champions will buy them but at least you have more options. diversity.

right now, you could just remove half of the existing items and nobody would notice because they are all the same anyways. its not like you have a choice of passives, you pick the best naturally.

DarthSpectrum1 votes

Shiv is stronger for 1 v 1 situations, especially if the champion with Shiv has a ton of mobility. You don't see Vayne building Hurricane, but she does build Shiv or Hand Cannon.

As well, I think you also missed the entire part of Hurricane being a RANGED-ONLY item. Some melee champions such as Tryndamere, Yasuo, or even AD-Alistar builds Shiv.

Bonipherus1 votes

I'm talking in reference to marksmen; as these items are primarily for them in design and came adjusted from the marksman update. Also, Riot already said Tryndamere and Yasuo's kits had to be tailored for crit so I don't care about them when talking about Statikk/Hurricane waveclear as they are clear outliers in this comparison.

Chuck Charles1 votes

I actually ike Shiv over hurricane. I think the items are mostly balanced with Pd still needing a slight buff to make it viable. over the other 3.

RFC right now is perfect for safe poking/sieging if that is your playstyle and goal.

Shiv is decent for a bit of burst while also providing good wave clear.

Hurricane provides good wave clear, but is good for those looking to team fight in the fray.

PD is supposed to be this dueling beast with its passive and superior stats, but it just seems to fall a bit short. I would personally like to see it have 50% attack speed again as it would fit a niche of someone just wanting the most attack speed they can out of their single crit attack speed item rather than just all these unique effects.

Cindikle1 votes

That was it's niche before Ranaan's became a Zeal item. Ranaan's has always been a strong waveclear item.

Shiv comes with more burst and mixed damage. Ranaan's has better AoE.

Sire Hippington1 votes

Runaan's is only superior in crowded teamfights where you can hit atelast one adittional target most of the time and dps is more important than burst. While the waveclear it offeres is often sufficient, it clearly is infirior to SS. SS gives more burst, better waveclear and better poke. In any situation in which you can't consistantly AA, it is the better option.

SnazzyTheMister1 votes

what if you consider shiv to be the more split pushy option?

so hurricane lets you quickly eat waves but if you are gona push a wave out you are gona want to also be able to fight one on one with someone which shiv is stronger at.

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