Melee champions vs tanks, someone explain to me.

Bultz··2 votes·1,145 views

Imma use this example cause it just happened. I'm playing Yasuo vs Voli. In our first real fight my build looks something like(i dont remember exacts) Pd, tabis, vampiric, Ec. Voli's build had righteous glory(an item in need of gutting because why does it offer so fuckign much, but that's not the point of this post) and boots, he might have had a some armor item, but not much. In every scenario, I should have the advantage, 12% damage reduction from pd, 10 from tabis, lifesteal, slowing any healing he is doing, bone plating, pta, everything to advantage me in a fight. Voli torn me a new fuckign one each trade. Not that he outplayed me, I only lived half the time cause trades where always in my favor in that I was controlling the fight, but could not muster half the damage he is doing.

Someone explain to me why this isn't broken to all fucking hell. Yeah he has a little more hp and armor, but my damage reduction and lifesteal should still throw the fight to me, but not fucking once.

34 Comments

NemeBro4 votes

{quoted}

Imma use this example cause it just happened. I'm playing Yasuo vs Voli.

Voli isn't a tank, stopped reading.

https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/2735999474/208826573?tab=overview

Also, you were feeding, and he was fed off you. Problem? Not really.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Voli isn't a tank, stopped reading.

https://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/2735999474/208826573?tab=overview

Also, you were feeding, and he was fed off you. Problem? Not really.

if he is building pure tank items, he is a tank. If he isn't a tank nerf him into needing to buy damage items as well.

NemeBro4 votes

{quoted}

if he is building pure tank items, he is a tank.

Wrong, stopped reading again, class isn't determined by build. You're wrong and you always will be, no matter how much you cry on the boards.

Tanks don't have attack speed steroids and 75-150 magic damage on-hit with their auto attacks. No tank in the game has as much damage as Volibear.

Infernape2 votes

No tank in the game has as much damage as Volibear.

Well except maybe Ornn. Even then Ornn and Voli are two different classes of champion.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Well except maybe Ornn. Even then Ornn and Voli are two different classes of champion.

Malphite. orn. kench. cho. galio. etc.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Wrong, stopped reading again, class isn't determined by build. You're wrong and you always will be, no matter how much you cry on the boards.

Tanks don't have attack speed steroids and 75-150 magic damage on-hit with their auto attacks. No tank in the game has as much damage as Volibear.

derp deerp he is a tank. go cry in a bush.

redniwediS4 votes

NemeBro is being way too aggressive in what he is saying, but he is correct. Champion classification is based on the champion's base stats and abilities, not based on the items players decide to take on them. It takes the balance goals for their class into account, and understanding the class system helps give insight

Defensive itemization does not place a champion into the Tank class.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

NemeBro is being way too aggressive in what he is saying, but he is correct. Champion classification is based on the champion's base stats and abilities, not based on the items players decide to take on them. It takes the balance goals for their class into account, and understanding the class system helps give insight

Defensive itemization does not place a champion into the Tank class.

Yes it absolutely does. If he is only building tank items, he is a tank. His classification doesn't mean shit if he doesn't build or isn't forced into building more than just tank items.

Ralanr7 votes

If Yasuo builds all AP, he's not suddenly a mage.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

If Yasuo builds all AP, he's not suddenly a mage.

Yasuo build pure tank items before and was gutted to hell because of it. I don't see why voli is some sort of acception. Yasuo isn't a tank so his tank build was okay and the nerfs should be reverted right.

Ralanr3 votes

No because they removed his core weakness. Unlike Volibear, Yasuo can’t really be kited so he has to be easy to kill to force him to move.

Volibear being tanky doesn’t make him unkitable.

And like what was said, build doesn’t determine class. Yasuo doesn’t become a Mage by building all AP.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

No because they removed his core weakness. Unlike Volibear, Yasuo can’t really be kited so he has to be easy to kill to force him to move.

Volibear being tanky doesn’t make him unkitable.

And like what was said, build doesn’t determine class. Yasuo doesn’t become a Mage by building all AP.

Lmao wtf do you mean he can't be kitted. Yes it does make him unkillable. Yasuo build tank items, wasn't a tank, gutted. Voli is building pure tank items, isn't a tank needs to be gutted.

Ralanr2 votes

Yasuo’s mobility works in his favor making him incredibly hard to kite, which makes it a weak strategy against him.

Ragnaveil3 votes

I love the points you are making, but i'm starting to feel it's not getting to him at all, maybe "he" lacks the common knowledge of the game we all know. Not trying to sound toxic, but it's kinda coming off on me like that.

Ralanr2 votes

Oh I know, I've talked with Bultz before. This is usually how I try to explain things to him before I stop talking to him if he refuses to listen.

NemeBro2 votes

{quoted}

Yasuo build pure tank items before and was gutted to hell because of it. I don't see why voli is some sort of acception. Yasuo isn't a tank so his tank build was okay and the nerfs should be reverted right.

The difference is that Yasuo with his bruiser build still had the incredible mobility inherent to Yasuo's kit, as well as his utility and play-making ability, while still dealing enough DPS to threaten tanks.

Volibear is very tanky and dangerous to squishies, but his tank-killing falls off heavily, he has little utility, and he is sloooooooooooooooooooooow.

Your understanding of the game is incredibly basic.

redniwediS2 votes

No. Ashe cannot be a Tank if she builds defensive items. Syndra cannot be a Tank if she builds defensive items.

Tanks have a specific set of requirements BESIDES high defense from items you have to meet. Ekko can legitimately be played as a Tank, while champions like Volibear cannot. Ignorance doesn't make you right.

MorganFreemanBot2 votes

{quoted}

if he is building pure tank items, he is a tank. If he isn't a tank nerf him into needing to buy damage items as well.

No, he's actually not. Building pure defensive items does not a tank make.

Volibear is a fighter / bruiser, more specifically a diver. Tanks are quantified by having oodles of CC (voli has some, but not a ton) and strong controllable defensive steroids. Voli has one fairly large cooldown defensive measure, which he cannot control short of not taking enough damage.

Bruisers / fighters, on the other hand, are big and beefy guys with a combination of baseline offensive power, moderate steroids, innate defenses / high base stats, and varying degrees of tools to reach the back line. They're literally Yasuo's worst nightmare, enemy wise.

Yasuo pretty much loses lane to any non-mage champion due to how much of his defensive power is rolled into wind wall, and how long that cooldown is. Adc laners bully him merciless, and any tank / fighter is his absolute bane.

{quoted}

The "Juggernauts and Tanks are not the same thing, therefore anything someone says regarding a Juggernaut where they refer to them as a Tank is invalid" meme needs to stop.

Boardsposters need to understand that the average player uses the word "tank" to encompass all champions who have full defensive builds, even if they are not technically a "tank".

The fact that "OMG Voli isn't a tank !!!!11!" doesn't make the fact that champions like him shit on champions that build glass or bruiser for no reason okay.

Plenty of bruiser builds will shit on voli, in fact most sustain heavy bruisers and bruiser builds make an absolute mockery of Volibear.

Glass champions have always crumpled to fighters / bruisers if they're caught.. That's kind of the whole point of the bruiser / fighter arch type; tanky enough to take a hit (but not sustained focus fire) and keep going, dangerous enough to murder squishies they catch (though not as fast as assassins, and with not nearly the same level of target access as assassins).

Bultz1 votes

If he does not build one bruiser or fighter item and is absolutely function, he is a not a bruiser. classification means absolutely nothing if he can build pure tank items and be still above.

Anonagon2 votes

The "Juggernauts and Tanks are not the same thing, therefore anything someone says regarding a Juggernaut where they refer to them as a Tank is invalid" meme needs to stop.

Boardsposters need to understand that the average player uses the word "tank" to encompass all champions who have full defensive builds, even if they are not technically a "tank".

The fact that "OMG Voli isn't a tank !!!!11!" doesn't make the fact that champions like him shit on champions that build glass or bruiser for no reason okay.

NemeBro3 votes

{quoted}

The "Juggernauts and Tanks are not the same thing, therefore anything someone says regarding a Juggernaut where they refer to them as a Tank is invalid" meme needs to stop.

It isn't a meme.

The juggernaut class is intentionally designed to be capable of dealing damage. They are damage threats.

This idiotic idea that if a champion is tanky it should under no circumstances deal damage/be capable of 1v1ing is what needs to die. No other MOBA is like this, and League frankly probably never has been either.

Boardsposters need to understand that the average player uses the word "tank" to encompass all champions who have full defensive builds, even if they are not technically a "tank".

He's using the word "tank" as sophistry to disguise the fact that the "tank" he is playing against is meant to be a damage threat, instead of a big low damage sponge.

The fact that "OMG Voli isn't a tank !!!!11!" doesn't make the fact that champions like him shit on champions that build glass or bruiser for no reason okay.

It isn't for no reason. He's designed to be a solid damage threat (particularly against squishies) and capable duelist, as well as a strong early game champion. Why should a squishy late game carry like Yasuo style on him in the early game?

Rexxiee3 votes

Tanks have been degenerate for years, it doesnt help riot keeps making more broken runes for them, you want to play an ad melee champ? Tabi bramble vest bone plating LUL.

They need massive nerfs across the board.

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Tanks have been degenerate for years, it doesnt help riot keeps making more broken runes for them, you want to play an ad melee champ? Tabi bramble vest bone plating LUL.

They need massive nerfs across the board.

Absolutly, but look at this circle jerk on these boards. mention a melee champion lmao.

NemeBro7 votes

{quoted}

Absolutly, but look at this circle jerk on these boards. mention a melee champion lmao.

http://championmasterylookup.derpthemeus.com/summoner?summoner=NemeBro&region=NA

I'm so biased against melee champions that Yasuo is my most-played champion lmao.

People like you are the reason the community hates Yasuo players.

BeatzBoyFTW3 votes

I bet you dashed to his face & his minions nearby cz you think you can 1v1 anyone no matter what.

Typical Yasuo players.

Bultz2 votes

Says the guy who plays pure tanks. Surely not biased at all.

BeatzBoyFTW3 votes

Im sorry for being cancer free.[zombie-brand-clap]

Infernape2 votes

Isn't Volibear actually slightly overtuned?

Bultz1 votes

{quoted}

Isn't Volibear actually slightly overtuned?

I used Voli as an example, but most tanks are like this. They do unreasonable amounts of damage without any damage it requirements.

Ralanr2 votes

Honestly this is one of those times where a video would be helpful. Cause if I had to guess, Voli's passive kicked in when he needed it and you got bit by his W.

Bultz2 votes

That isn't my point. If he can build pure tank items and be doing fighter level damage, he needs to be gutted and forced to build his correct path.

Ralanr3 votes

You’re describing fighter level damage as being able to kill a squishy target.

Again, even by your description, something is off. Actual video evidence would help us better understand the situation. It might make you more valid. Otherwise people will assume you played poorly.

Over Innsmouth2 votes

Sounds like you just couldnt bear it.

Ralanr2 votes

Volibear: Huh...I suppose I was expecting some unbearable pun.

Vladimir: I'm surprised I didn't make you bi-polar with my puns.

Volibear: Ok, now you're fucking dead.

Vladimir: pools away https://i.imgur.com/ZGMPx4J.gif

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