Kalista picked competitively, instant QQ

Raptamei·Feb 2, 2015·30 votes·3,489 views

Do we want more viable picks or not?

If competitively viable = "op" then don't be surprised when only a few champs are competitively viable.

71 Comments

AetherKingdomFeb 2, 201516 votes

I want more viable picks. Kalista being viable restricts like 90% of melees from being viable.

RaptameiFeb 2, 20154 votes

{quoted}

I want more viable picks. Kalista being viable restricts like 90% of melees from being viable.

If they pick Kalista top, you win after the laning phase.

If they pick Kalista somewhere else, that's like saying Janna isn't viable because Xin kills her without taking damage.

AetherKingdomFeb 2, 201516 votes

Xin Killing janna rofl

Rinky DinkyFeb 2, 20154 votes

Janna

Not dying to Xin in a 1v1

l0l

AetherKingdomFeb 2, 201511 votes

You're right. If the janna had a broken mouse. And was oom. And didn't buy boots.

AnOstrichWithPMSFeb 2, 20153 votes

{quoted}

You're right. If the janna had a broken mouse. And was oom. And didn't buy boots.

pretty sure ive had all of these things and still made it

MEMEME670Feb 2, 20152 votes

You appear to have no idea what you're talking about.

Xin crushes Janna in a 1v1. Janna can run, (note: This won't help you if you're laning vs him, as you'll get 0 cs.) but she can't actually fight him.

AetherKingdomFeb 2, 20158 votes

I'm not talking about Janna mid. I'm talking about Janna support. Janna will never die to a Xin unless she's just bad.

MEMEME670Feb 2, 20153 votes

If they pick Kalista somewhere else, that's like saying Janna isn't viable because Xin kills her without taking damage.

(emphasis mine)

The analogy was based on picking the champion outside of her normal lane, so we aren't talking about support janna.

AetherKingdomFeb 3, 20152 votes

Ah, I understand you now. Either way, I don't feel Janna would have much trouble kiting Xin outside of the first few levels.

Lajinn5Feb 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

If they pick Kalista top, you win after the laning phase.

If they pick Kalista somewhere else, that's like saying Janna isn't viable because Xin kills her without taking damage.

how exactly do you win after laning phase? She's an ad carry, which by itself means she's going to be extremely strong late game.

JoquanFeb 2, 20156 votes

Lack of frontline

Imperial JapanFeb 3, 20152 votes

I played a game just like an hour ago with a trynd (who didnt help at all (youll see later why) ) a Master Yi, a Nidalee, me as kalista, and TF mid. The Yi did all he can but isnt a tank/frontline so dies pretty easily and me tf and nidalee have no frontline because the tryndamere was A: Jerking off just cs'ing, not even taking turret top or B: diving in being instantly killed. Then we proceeded to get killed by their entire team which has many gap closers and stuns/slows.

not a starburstFeb 2, 20153 votes

You get wrecked when Yi shows up and goes 'o hai team of 5 squishies'.

FeathermaneFeb 2, 20154 votes

Pretty sure Irelia being better restricts 90% of melees from being viable.

DeusVultFeb 3, 20152 votes

Irelia loses to a ton of melees, mainly the tankier ones with high bases

she does way better vs ranged squishies

FyreNinjaFeb 2, 201512 votes

Im with you, I hate this crap. Just made a thread about it. I feel like I can't get attached to one champ, because if they have ONE unique characteristic (passive) the Boards immediately sh*t on it

RaptameiFeb 2, 20154 votes

{quoted}

Im with you, I hate this crap. Just made a thread about it. I feel like I can't get attached to one champ, because if they have ONE unique characteristic (passive) the Boards immediately sh*t on it

That too. It's hard to find your personal champions because they WILL get a buff for no reason, or everyone else gets nerfed, or someone picked them in LCS (god forbid there's some pick variety). Immediate QQ follows, your champion gets perma banned, you get accused of picking only ezmode champions, then shortly afterwards an epic nerf follows that leaves the champion in pieces and everyone says "good riddance noob l2p" and moves on to crying about someone else and you're out a champion and €10 for a skin.

bradFeb 2, 201516 votes

{quoted}

Im with you, I hate this crap. Just made a thread about it. I feel like I can't get attached to one champ, because if they have ONE unique characteristic (passive) the Boards immediately sh*t on it

do u play melee at all?

or anyone with any skillshots whatsoever?

NarasimhaFeb 2, 20156 votes

do u play melee at all?

I do. And I have yet to see a Kalista outkite my Akali, Diana, Irelia, Yi, or even Udyr (without red buff).

The Red WardenFeb 2, 20153 votes

If you ever want to have the worst experience in game, have a friend play Kalista while you are Olaf. Have fun.

The ones you listed are assassins with multiple gap-closers (akali, Diana) or the targeted-gapcloser insta-kill assassins (irelia, Yi). Those champions are assassins so of course they wouldn't have trouble reaching her. The only one there that actually has difficulty reaching her is Udyr.

B1naryB0tFeb 2, 20153 votes

Don't complain about "melee" champs then. Many melee champs have some sort of gap closer to give them a chance. Just because she has an easier time to kite bruisers does not mean "If you are melee you have no chance against Kalista"

I remind you, zed is a melee champion.

AerialBladeFeb 2, 20154 votes

kalista has counters. You probably can't reach her as olaf. Sorry. But any other adc out classes her with ACTUAL STEROIDS and huge escapes that don't require kiting ability.

VardenSaladFeb 3, 20151 votes

Damn, all those ADC 1v1s I see all the time in high-level play. Just 2 ADCs in a vacuum.

The fact that 1 ADC dies and 1 doesn't is the entire reason we're having this fucking discussion. Not to compare X to Y in a number crunching contest that a full AP Teemo would win anyway, showing the futility of numbers in a vacuum.

AerialBladeFeb 3, 20151 votes

In a teamfight, trist will put out way more dps, even without hurricane, thanks to her steroids and RIDICULOUS peel and safety (not even close to kalista, honestly). In a 1v1, kalista will probably lose. In a teamfight, sure, she'll do fine dodging skillshots, applying rend, but other adcs have the upper hand in ridiculous dps that kalista doesn't have.

HawkefireFeb 2, 201511 votes

There is a difference between wanting competitively viable champs and allowing champs to be broken.

Kalista's kit is one of the most toxic kits ever designed by Riot. It is the literal epitome of mobility creep in this game.

RaptameiFeb 2, 201518 votes

{quoted}

There is a difference between wanting competitively viable champs and allowing champs to be broken.

Kalista's kit is one of the most toxic kits ever designed by Riot. It is the literal epitome of mobility creep in this game.

That doesn't make her broken, just unfun.

The forums are way too eager to equate "annoying to play against" with "overpowered".

lojicianFeb 2, 201518 votes

"Hypocritical 0 counterplay design against an entire class of champions" is not the same as "annoying to play against". You're just downplaying it because you're not the people riot is giving the middle finger so you think rock/paper bullshit is acceptable.

Vegas DadFeb 2, 20153 votes

{quoted}

That doesn't make her broken, just unfun.

The forums are way too eager to equate "annoying to play against" with "overpowered".

Common misconception by the tards who live for OP champs, I only play that champ because it is fun not OP (translation stomping the piss out of people with an OP champion is fun, positioning poorly and making stupid decisions but but getting away because my champ is broken is fun!), hey champion isnt broken it us just unfun!, ya i know i can play bad and no suffer the same consequences as other champs that is not broken it is just unfun!

No sorry pal the reason it is unfun to play against xyz champ is something about them is broken.

RaptameiFeb 2, 20155 votes

[{quoted}](name=Vegas Dad,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Tep7kprR,comment-id=000300000001,timestamp=2015-02-02T21:00:00.873+0000)

Common misconception by the tards who live for OP champs, I only play that champ because it is fun not OP (translation stomping the piss out of people with an OP champion is fun, positioning poorly and making stupid decisions but but getting away because my champ is broken is fun!), hey champion isnt broken it us just unfun!, ya i know i can play bad and no suffer the same consequences as other champs that is not broken it is just unfun!

No sorry pal the reason it is unfun to play against xyz champ is something about them is broken.

So you're saying Teemo is broken?

AerialBladeFeb 2, 20152 votes

Not at all

Vegas DadFeb 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

So you're saying Teemo is broken?

Nothing remotely unfun about teemo, look we cant cater to every single person idea of what is annoying, but the fact is nothing about teemo is unfun or broken. A truly squishy champion, with short range and no escapes, and top of having low dmg output. His mushrooms give people the illusion of annoyance because they refuse to accept the fact it is his ultimate and it is a dam weak ultimate.

they are just herr durr i kill teemo but went back to farm stepped on a shroom, omfg he is soo annoying, the reality is you only killed him in the first place because his kit is soo weak and subpar. thier is a reason teemo is unianymously considered a terrible champion and it isnt because his shrooms are secret broken OP! it is because he is weak and any competant players play around the mushrooms with ease.

Also teemo is another one of those champs that most of the playerbase has decided is "free win they have a teemo" so when they lose to a teemo in their mind it is really annoying.

JoquanFeb 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=Vegas Dad,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Tep7kprR,comment-id=00030000000100000002,timestamp=2015-02-03T21:12:42.521+0000)

Nothing remotely unfun about teemo, look we cant cater to every single person idea of what is annoying, but the fact is nothing about teemo is unfun or broken.

Your saying it's fun when your playing a melee champ against teemo?

Not saying he's OP, but do you really think that's a fun lane matchup?

1st HanarSpectreFeb 2, 201510 votes

There are enough anti melee champions in this game, we didn't need another one. One that also melts and slows your whole team with a skill that refresh it's cooldown and refunds its mana cost even. One that assure you can never steal baron or dragon from her team. One that has free wards. One that has a 20% max health nuke as a six second passive cooldown, One that can instantly save her support that's in a bad spot.

This champion is beyond broken. She's HoN level of garbage balance broken.

DeusVultFeb 3, 20154 votes

Kalista is being picked for the same reason that mid janna was picked

because she is a bullshit champ. When played correctly, she invalidates 90% of melee champs, skillshot reliant champs, and gives her team total baron/dragon control with her e which can outdamage smite.

Meanwhile, Ahri and Kass getting nerfed on PBE

Subject 5Feb 3, 20152 votes

Yes, Mid janna was bullshit. That map pressure and kill potential is just off the charts, she like doubles the damage leblanc is capable of doing the entire game with just her w. Man good thing these things called old school mages exist, i was almost starting to think that they didn't exist.

Kassadin Veigar Annie Fizz Lissandra Nidalee Orianna Velkoz . . . . . . .

junglerboy16Feb 2, 20153 votes

It isn't so much "Oh she is OP because a pro picked her" it is more she is just anti-fun for the team without a kalista. The frontline basically NEVER touches her if she is even halfway decent at using her passive, she out does junglers who are supposed to have the final say in objective control with smite, and her ult is anti fun for her and her team unless they are a pre made duo/5 man. The issue is that She is so stilted towards 5 man competitive play, while she is really sub par outside of that environment. I agree that people are not thinking straight if they want more viable picks (hey guess what, it is GOOD to not feel like you have enough bans, because that means we have an actual increase in powerful champs to play than usual), but Kalista is too strong right now, she is just one of those complicated champs like Orianna who nobody knows how to play but when somebody figures it out it is totally overpowered.

SpongebobIsLifeFeb 3, 20151 votes

that could be said for many many champs. Kalista isn't op in the slightest. She is just like Katarina imo, in the way that she is a situational pick. If the enemy team lacks hard cc, im picking Kat. If the enemy team is lacking in aoe cc, assassins, or single target cc, im picking Kalista. i'm tired of everyone ranting about how op she is. I'm sorry that the champ you play, does not work in every match up. Champ diversity folks. Enemy team picks kalista, u pick Darius, Irelia, Jax, Maokai, Malphite, Sejuani, Nasus. All of this champs would screw her over due to the fact that once she is slowed, her passive is horrendous. Just like you have to build a team to stop kat, you have to do the same for Kalista. There is a such thing as champion diversity.

ThePlasticSporkFeb 3, 20153 votes

Anyone who even looked at her passive and gave it some thought have been complaining. They've just been proven correct and now are being joined by the people who only voice their opinions on balance when LCS games happen.

Really though, the sheer combination of stupid things in Kalista's kit is almost hilarious.

Outdamaging junglers' smite on Dragon and Baron? TWENTY % magic damage? Not only that, but MAX health? Free wards? Ashe and Quinn's respective reveal abilities don't even come close to being as useful.

Her kit doesn't make sense. Ignoring the fact that she's obnoxious to literally everybody but the Kalista player in solo queue, her kit doesn't have any kind of cohesiveness to it. It's almost as random as old Sions, just without the weird AP/AD scalings.

MatezoideFeb 3, 20151 votes

So much this. Everyone has hated her kit since forever, people were just afraid to complain because of the downvote rain by the "lel she isnt in LC$ noob" folks. Laning with a Kalista is a horrible experience as well, since you cant deny her spear. I love losing control from my character randomly!

It is one thing being good against immobiles. It is another being capable of kiting three immobiles at once with just a Hurricane and actually win by nuking half their health with a single Rend.

The above actually happened to me before btw. Our Shaco's Q was on CD, Janna's Q missed and i was a fed Garen. There was literally nothing we could do to kill this out of position Kalista. This is the first time i am actually crying "Bullshit" in this game.

D1rtFarmerFeb 3, 20151 votes

she sounds like she did a hell of a job tho. couldnt vayne do the same thing? or even jinx?

TauNoob1Feb 2, 20152 votes

Just my humble opinion, but I'm willing to bet it isn't because they think she's op, its because she just IS NOT FUN TO PLAY AGAINST. When you loose to a Kalista you don't feel outplayed like you would to a good Zed or Yasuo, you feel like you lost because of some cheap gimmick the enemy team is abusing.

Nameless VoiceFeb 2, 20155 votes

That's how I feel when I play against Yasuo.

futuresight23Feb 3, 20152 votes

There was already QQ about Kalista; it just got cranked up to 11 after a 3 match span of Sneaky, Doublelift and Wildturtle completely owning with the champ.

LankPantsFeb 3, 20152 votes

You forgot Cop.....

He's a good player damn it.

ErikkustrifeFeb 3, 20151 votes

{quoted}

There was already QQ about Kalista; it just got cranked up to 11 after a 3 match span of Sneaky, Doublelift and Wildturtle completely owning with the champ.

to be fair, in those matches kallista was not the reason they won, they won everylane HARD like it wasnt even a issue without kallista even being there. Not to mention piglit forgot mastiers and runepages, and well....he picked sivir.....for 5.1 tourny play......

The PaulrusFeb 2, 20151 votes

The problem is usually the "competitive picks" are so because they are the most likely to win for their position/most powerful for their position. I can't imagine a more terrifying team than Nasus JarvanIV Zed Kalista Leona . All some of the most powerful champions at what they do for one reason or another. The problem is, the "competitive" play, tries any way it can to break the game to give its team a distinct advantage.

True story.

Kitten of EvilFeb 2, 20152 votes

That team combo seems exceptionally vulnerable to item 3075

JESUSSAYSNOFeb 2, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Paulrus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Tep7kprR,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-02-02T17:57:09.509+0000)

The problem is usually the "competitive picks" are so because they are the most likely to win for their position/most powerful for their position. I can't imagine a more terrifying team than . All some of the most powerful champions at what they do for one reason or another. The problem is, the "competitive" play, tries any way it can to break the game to give its team a distinct advantage.

True story.

That teamcomp is absolute garbage, btw. You build randuin's, thornmail, maybe a warmogs ontop, and they're useless.

Kali is fine, but surprise surprise, just like any other 'op' champ, you have to build or pick against her. frozen mallet, any cutlass buildoff, anybody with solid cc.

FuIlmute AllFeb 4, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=The Paulrus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Tep7kprR,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2015-02-02T17:57:09.509+0000)

The problem is usually the "competitive picks" are so because they are the most likely to win for their position/most powerful for their position. I can't imagine a more terrifying team than . All some of the most powerful champions at what they do for one reason or another. The problem is, the "competitive" play, tries any way it can to break the game to give its team a distinct advantage.

True story.

Full ad team doesnt sound scary at all. Stack armor hard and you out-value them no matter what