League is a team game

Monkey D Luffy·Sep 1, 2015·46 votes·3,450 views

That's why if you're good enough you should be able to carry yourself. (Logic/10)

And before anyone says it's your ability to work with your team, then what about your teams inability to work with you?

64 Comments

Arcane AzmadiSep 1, 201520 votes

I just don't get the mindset of the people who deny the existence of Elo hell on the basis of "if you lost, it can ONLY be your fault, what your team did doesn't matter". These people are deluded. They think that if you can't 1v5 then you don't deserve to win.

DalenthasSep 1, 20153 votes

That's not why Elo hell doesn't exist, math is. If you are consistently good, and you never DC or troll, then your team only has 4 possible members that can be horrible/trolls/AFKers. The enemy team has 5 possible horrible/troll/AFKers. That's a distinct advantage to your side, if you're actually as good as you think you are. Anyone who complains that they're stuck in Elo hell because they're always teamed up with trolls is deliberately blind to the fact the enemy team will statistically have more trolls than their own team. Sometimes both teams will have a troll or AFK, and the whole thing balances out back to a skill match-up. Some times one team will have one AFK and the other will have two! A 3v4 is a very odd game of League, but it does happen from time to time.

Of course, if you yourself are horrible/troll/AFK, then your team has a 100% chance of having at least one person on it bringing the team down, in which case, Elo Hell is a place of your own making.

Yes, you will lose SOME games because of your team. However, you should WIN more of them because of the enemy team. The rest of the games are decided by your skill, so if you play enough you WILL find your level.

TL; DR: Sartre is wrong, Hell isn't other people, it's your own fault.

Art Of Solo QSep 1, 20157 votes

I logged in just because of how tired I am of seeing this flawed logic. Its mind numbing to see people still using it. Regardless if you believe in elo hell or not, which I truly don't care if it exists/doesn't exist simply because I don't care about ranked(I play for fun yo, you know the reason 99% of us downloaded this game, tho I do want that free skin man LOL), this logic only mentions the portion which denies elo hells existence but forgets the part that actually makes the math meaningless.

Simply put, you have a 4 out of 9 chance to get a troll/afk while your opponents have a 5 out of 9. Assuming you don't troll/afk yourself.

NOW! Lets go a step deeper into the math behind your rough 55% advantage over the enemy team. This % boost is only applicable within games that had a troll/afk, it isn't even considered in any other game. People seem to get the understanding of this math wrong, its not how likely you are to have an troll/afk(not to mention it has nothing to do with your % of winning any game without a troll/afk), its how likely that troll/afk is on your team vs the enemy team. The actual math of discovering the probability of a troll/afk being on your team or opponents is beyond discovery. Simply to many variables.

In other words, this advantage is absolutely meaningless until you have had 100 plus games with a troll/afk. This is simply the worst counter to elo hells existence that people seem to use as an "auto win point" because it has absolutely no grounds to stand on and even more so is used incorrectly.

Feeding doesn't count, at all. Its a completely random occurrence that no one can calculate. Counters, bad games, misplays, camps, roams, lag, distractions, I mean every single player will feed. Its just going to happen. Not to mention those who feed on purpose are trolls, so that gets calculated with the troll percentage.

"The rest of the games are decided by your skill, so if you play enough you WILL find your level."

^ Just so you know, this point actually is used to "prove" Elo hell as a reality more so then it is to prove it as a myth. Mainly because most players wont play enough games to actually beat the curve within a season. I can go deeper but I think you get it, or I hope so. Besides I typed to much.

/Rant

Daedalus871Sep 2, 20152 votes

While the logic of "They have 5 potential trolls versus your 4, you should win" is faulty, the conclusion that in the majority of games, you get less trolls than the enemy is true. I have done the math before, and if you want, I can do it again. Just give me what you think is a reasonable % for the players that are undesirable (trolls afk feeders etc)

Arcane AzmadiSep 2, 20153 votes

{quoted}

While the logic of "They have 5 potential trolls versus your 4, you should win" is faulty, the conclusion that in the majority of games, you get less trolls than the enemy is true. I have done the math before, and if you want, I can do it again. Just give me what you think is a reasonable % for the players that are undesirable (trolls afk feeders etc)

No, the conclusion is "in the majority of games you SHOULD get less trolls than the enemy". Unfortunately, life doesn't run on pure mathematics. This is why luck is such an important factor in LoL. Think of how many games you've lost where, if you and your counterpart on the enemy team had traded places and you'd both played exactly the same as you did, you would have won. The games where you crush your toplane opponent, get his tower, and are ready to teleport down to contest dragon whenever you're needed or turn around botlane fights, but your jungler doesn't care about objectives, your ADC and support can't stop feeding and your mid never leaves his tower. Even without counting afks and trolls, there are COUNTLESS games where you can do everything right and still lose anyway because you're only 20% of a team.

It Hertz When IPSep 2, 20151 votes

Since matchmaking tries to balance team MMRs, if you are a decent non-troll player doesn't that mean you have a higher-than-average chance of being paired with a troll?

GorgannanSep 2, 20153 votes

That would only be true if the enemies you were up against were a lower elo, and the game balanced the teams by giving you worse teammates. That's a very "I'm the main character of my life" way to look at it, and it's also false. If anything, it just means you would be playing against better players, your team and theirs, meaning your losses would be because your MMR is inflated, meaning you deserve to drop, which you would then do.

GorgannanSep 2, 20151 votes

Read what you just typed and realize why it's retarded, then feel bad.

"There are other factors."

We don't give a shit about the other factors. It's not even just talking trolls and afk's. It's feeders, it's baddies, it's people who won't group. That's EVERY game. If YOU play perfectly, YOU will win AT LEAST 5% more games than you lose. AT LEAST.

Spacesuit SpiffSep 2, 20151 votes

You dont need to 1v5, you just need to be a big factor in the game. Throw a plat player in silver and theyll get out pretty quick; they wont win every game but it will take some incredible bs to lose a game with their impact.

LaceUp23Sep 2, 20151 votes

And you're talking about a pretty huge difference in skill level.

Spacesuit SpiffSep 2, 20151 votes

If you want to get out really quick (s5 to g5 took me 2 days at the start of this season) thats what it takes. If someone is only a little better than where they are currently itll take a long time for that to be demonstrated statistically. But it will still happen. (And as an aside, the amount of game knowledge you could get from 5 hours of youtube is more than enough to do what i did at the start of the season. Gaining "skill" is much less intimidating than ppl assume)

GorgannanSep 2, 20151 votes

Watch pro players smurfing. You can win by carrying 7/10, and contribute positively to win 4/7.

slipstreemSep 2, 20151 votes

elo hell exists at all elos.. that is the problem... this is plat 2-3 game

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1938354070/31699569

I was the diana... and I carried the heck out of my team up to 5k gold lead at 22 minutes and me being 3 levels ahead of everyone else in the game... but my teammates threw and they threw and they threw some more until we lost... I was ready to strangle nasus for his negativity for the last 35 minutes(of a 37 minute game) of the game...

last season i went on a 18W-42L spell that had so many ragers and trolls(I'll never forget that talon support game where his only item at 15 minutes was a brutalizer) I almost quit the game from the elo hell like madness of it all.. I dropped from plat 50 LP division 1 and playing people in diamond division 2-3 to plat division 5 playing against plat division 5. but I kept playing and I eventually ended up getting back to division 1 and winning the promos up to the next tier where I belonged and by the end of season was playing against diamond div IV folks regularly.

HaloSep 2, 20151 votes

I am plat this season and was bronze last season and the season before that and have started surfing in silver i gotta say that ELO hell exists but if u are good you will get out no matter what. Some games are un winnable sure but that wont hinder u from climbing anyway. You have to learn what is good what to do in the right situation and you will get out. You are usually stuck for a reason and that reason is usually not your team

Arcane AzmadiSep 2, 20151 votes

"Usually". However, in this case, it generally IS my team.

What pisses me off so much about being stuck in Elo hell is that I've already PROVEN that I shouldn't be. People talk about what "should" happen, but in season 4 I was placed into Bronze III at the start of the season and fairly quickly pulled myself up into Silver. This season I AGAIN found myself dumped back into Bronze (thanks Riot and your stupid placement system) and this time I've been completely unable to get out- I got as high as 99LP in Bronze II but then got a 10-game losing streak of noobs, 4v5s, trolls and intentional feeders (including 1 feedbot who literally spent the entire game doing nothing but automatically walking straight up mid lane the instant he respawned) and dropped back to the bottom of Bronze III again and haven't managed to get anywhere since.

So what gives? Have I actually become worse at the game since season 4? No, a careful and unbiased assessment of my own skills and abilities suggest that I've become better at playing the game. So why am I losing? Well to be honest, I partly think it's because I seem to remember the LP system being a lot more generous last season- I got more LP for wins and lost less for losses, meaning that maintaining a roughly 50% win/loss ratio was enough to climb, while this season seems to be the reverse, with losses rarely costing me less than 21 LP and wins rarely gaining me more than 17. But really, I'm just getting far, FAR more than my fair share of people who really shouldn't be allowed to play Ranked- the dumbasses who pick without the slightest consideration for team comp, the idiots who think wards are for pussies, the retards who just die in solo fights against their lane opponent again and again and again and then whine "it's not my fault he's just tower diving me and killing me" (HINT: yes it fucking is), and, of course, the players who never connect to a game (or only do 10 minutes in) and are subsequently useless (it's always my fucking team too, I seriously lose about 1 in 6 losses because of 4v5 but win maybe 1 in 20 wins because of 5v4).

People say "well that can't be true, that shouldn't happen so it must be your fault". Which is fucking retarded. Yes, the only common factor in all my games is me. Well no shit Sherlock. But that would only mean something if I lost literally every game, and I don't. You need to look at the common factor in all my losses and when I only have a genuinely sub-par or poor performance in maybe 1 in 4 of my losses, something's not fucking right here.

HaloSep 3, 20151 votes

What pisses me off so much about being stuck in Elo hell is that I've already PROVEN that I shouldn't be. People talk about what "should" happen, but in season 4 I was placed into Bronze III at the start of the season and fairly quickly pulled myself up into Silver. This season I AGAIN found myself dumped back into Bronze (thanks Riot and your stupid placement system) and this time I've been completely unable to get out- I got as high as 99LP in Bronze

Bronze is the easiest ELO to climb in the whole game. You getting stuck there is only your fault.
ELO hell is a weird term because its all about how good you are. If you strugle in bronze that just means that you aint that good.
You have currently played 160 games in bronze. If you have played that many games in bronze you are probably not suppose to get out. You have currently got a negative winrate.

but then got a 10-game losing streak of noobs

How does one get a 10 game losing streak in bronze?

No, a careful and unbiased assessment of my own skills

Unbiased, yeah right. There is one reason your suck in bronze and that is cause you aint good enough to get out. And you opinion cant be unbiased if evaluate yourself. Your biased as fck if you do that.

meaning that maintaining a roughly 50% win/loss ratio was enough to climb

Your not suppose to be able to climb with a 50% winrate. With a 50% winrate your suppose to stay where you are and with a lower one your suppose to go down and with a higher one you suppose to go up. 50% winrate means that you are not the losing factor or the winning factor in the majority of you games and should therefor stay. Lower than that and your losing games for your team.

with losses rarely costing me less than 21 LP and wins rarely gaining me more than 17

screenshots or it didn't happen.

But really, I'm just getting far, FAR more than my fair share of people who really shouldn't be allowed to play Ranked

you are one of those you know.

the dumbasses who pick without the slightest consideration for team comp,

Im plat and we do that all the time. Its soloQ its not like we are gonna do some fancy as sht.

the retards who just die in solo fights against their lane opponent again and again and again and then whine "it's not my fault he's just tower diving me and killing me"

Those exist everywhere and if you are good it shouldn't be a problem.

the players who never connect to a game (or only do 10 minutes in) and are subsequently useless (it's always my fucking team too, I seriously lose about 1 in 6 losses because of 4v5 but win maybe 1 in 20 wins because of 5v4).

Its not more you. U just remember you getting butthurt better than you raping the enemy cuz you are 5v4.

People say "well that can't be true, that shouldn't happen so it must be your fault"

people are right

Yes, the only common factor in all my games is me. Well no shit Sherlock. But that would only mean something if I lost literally every game, and I don't. You need to look at the common factor in all my losses and when I only have a genuinely sub-par or poor performance in maybe 1 in 4 of my losses, something's not fucking right here.

Its impssible that you lose only because of the team so much. There is just as big of a chance that the enemies will get the shtty player as it is that you will
"n I only have a genuinely sub-par or poor performance in maybe 1 in 4 of my losses" yeah and the rest you just do ok. You NEVER acutally carry your team. If we say that its your fault that u lose 10% of the games and the rest you just do "ok" that measn that you should get downgraded. If you instead lose 10% but also carry 20% of the games and then go "ok" inte rest that means that you will go up and that is your problem. You epect to rely on your teammates. ITS SOLOQ U CANT DO THAT. You lose 10% of you games and dont carry any. Ofourse you cant climb like that. You have to be a winning factor. You cant just "not feed" you have to "get fed".
everything is fcking right here.

HaloSep 6, 20151 votes

Right so u just downvote my psot cause ur out of arguments. Great.

Arcane AzmadiSep 7, 20151 votes

Well I was going to respond... then I decided you weren't worth it. You don't care about anything I say, this argument has been rehashed a thousand times already, why should I bother getting worked up about it? I thought the more mature thing to do would be just to forget about it, since it really doesn't matter. So yes, I just left it at a downvote because I think you're full of shit, but no, I'm still not going to waste time and words on an argument that doesn't mean anything. And if you're the kind of pissy little bitch who comes back to try and restart an argument just over a downvote (you don't even get notified when one of your post gets downvoted, only when one gets replied to, which means you came back to this thread to check on it even though you hadn't received a response notification), maybe I'm not the one with the problem here after all.

So here, have another downvote.

HaloSep 8, 20151 votes

When youre complaining about hpw you cant get out of bronze u are a problem.

And yah i came back cause i was interesred in hearing ur train of thought. None of your previous arguments actually held up and could only be explained by ur own skill. So i wanted to hear what u actually thought or if u didnt.

Big HansSep 1, 20158 votes

Your performance and attitude has a big effect on the entire team. A good player constantly makes other people play their best by creating favorable opportunities. You do not have to "carry".

Adaptability is the key. There are a lot of people who may be mechanicaly quite good but they fail on the strategic level. They keep making the same mistake over and over. You will never become more skilled at hitting a skillshot in the duration of one game. However you can change your strategy and tactics several times in reaction to your opponents.

Monkey D LuffySep 1, 20157 votes

Oh yes, I'm not complaining about teams, I'm just saying the general saying is if you're good enough to get out then you should but in reality if you're good enough to get out it shouldn't matter since it's a team game, so it's kinda weird logic.

TheScholarlyDudeSep 1, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=I Am A Bad Blitz,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TAKusEzJ,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2015-09-01T08:10:19.315+0000)

Oh yes, I'm not complaining about teams, I'm just saying the general saying is if you're good enough to get out then you should but in reality if you're good enough to get out it shouldn't matter since it's a team game, so it's kinda weird logic.

If you're good and your team sucks you'll win about 55% of your matches. Maybe a little less of you support a lot.

Arcane AzmadiSep 2, 20153 votes

Sorry, that's simply not true. If your team sucks and your opponents don't then, no matter WHAT you do, you're gonna lose, unless you're on something like a Sated Devourer jungle Jax that literally CAN 1v5 the entire enemy team. You can only carry a bad team AGAINST a bad team, because if your team is useless then to win you need to be literally better than the entire enemy team put together. If there's even one player on their team better than you, or even reasonably comparable to you, you're sunk.

XonraSep 1, 20153 votes

[{quoted}](name=Big Hans,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TAKusEzJ,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2015-09-01T07:49:19.393+0000)

Your performance and attitude has a big effect on the entire team. A good player constantly makes other people play their best by creating favorable opportunities. You do not have to "carry".

Adaptability is the key. There are a lot of people who may be mechanicaly quite good but they fail on the strategic level. They keep making the same mistake over and over. You will never become more skilled at hitting a skillshot in the duration of one game. However you can change your strategy and tactics several times in reaction to your opponents.

This isn't always the case, as much as it should be the case.

I've had just as many people

intentionally feed
troll
refuse to listen to pings
refuse to take non-rude advice ("let me have ult up next time before we try to dive. Almost had them though" still have x person rage or throw a hissy fit)

Regardless of how nice I am, how much or little I talk, how well I'm personally doing or helping others do, I get the same results. I've never been warned, banned, restricted, not in all the years I have played, and it hasn't made a more positive or negative impact on any game I've played that I can remember.

I can make a great call that I know is logically sound, and have people ignore me to go chase someone into the enemy jungle, or decide to kill wolves on the opposite side of the map while the enemy team is taking dragon, and so on. People like to think they know best, even if they don't, and positivity sadly doesn't make much of a difference. A lot of the time even playing well doesn't create good opportunities when your teammates refuse to put pressure, or refuse to stop applying pressure.

there are cases where playing and being good help, but it isn't a guarantee as much as it is a matter of getting lucky to get a higher percentage of people who are willing to play as a team, compared to having a higher percentage that go into solo queue with no other mindset than "this is my game and gonna do what I want today", which defeats the purpose of a team game, and tends to be the higher percentage attitude in solo queue.

Support WukongSep 1, 20155 votes

You're looking at it wrong.

Ofcourse you can lose one or a few games because of your team mates, if someone never connects it's obviously not your fault. That won't happen every game though, and the enemy team is just as likely to get a feeder, disconnect, rager, afker or just a bad player. You can point to your team mates and blame them for one particular game, but you cannot say your team mates is the reason you're not higher up on the ladder.

Also, carrying doesn't mean you have to get super fed and go 1v5. If i play support, make plays bot lane, my adc is now fed, i roam mid, get him fed, i proceed to go top make him fed, who's the carry of that game? If anyone sits with his kills in his lane and doesn't do anything that benefits the team he's gonna lose more games than he should. Carrying isn't necessarly having the most damage, best kda, best farm (though in some games it's enough), carrying is when you actually make plays that benefits the team and not just yourself, ganking a lane, taking down a turret, getting a dragon, warding, peeling etc etc.

Just look at my history on this account.

Monkey D LuffySep 1, 20156 votes

I'm not blaming teams, I'm having a go at the "If you're good enough you should be able to carry" I'm saying, no, if you're good enough you shouldn't be able to carry, if league is a team game then it should be if your teams good enough, so it doesn't make sense for a team game.

crimdelacrim101Sep 1, 20152 votes

[{quoted}](name=I Am A Bad Blitz,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TAKusEzJ,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2015-09-01T12:07:59.928+0000)

I'm not blaming teams, I'm having a go at the "If you're good enough you should be able to carry" I'm saying, no, if you're good enough you shouldn't be able to carry, if league is a team game then it should be if your teams good enough, so it doesn't make sense for a team game.

The only thing I would have to say that backs up the "If you're good enough you should be able to carry" is that the people who make it to Diamond and Master and such, do it consistently over multiple accounts. Meaning somehow, as incredibly good players, they just don't lose. They carry. Whether mechanically, objectively, keeping morale up, combinations of all three, etc. they are able to ensure victory for themselves over and over, despite the trolls, feeders, afk'ers. So there's clearly something to it.

Trash ADC BtwSep 1, 20152 votes

Being fair, they also tend to have high MMR by the time they get to ranked, being placed in Gold+ and only playing with players of those ELOs in the first place, who tend to have an easier time BEING carried than low ELO players.

EDIT: An addendum; The only way you can TRULY carry games is if you play carries. For those of us who main support/tanks, there's less of a chance we can carry ourselves, even with MMR on our side.

Support WukongSep 2, 20151 votes

{quoted}

Being fair, they also tend to have high MMR by the time they get to ranked, being placed in Gold+ and only playing with players of those ELOs in the first place, who tend to have an easier time BEING carried than low ELO players.

EDIT: An addendum; The only way you can TRULY carry games is if you play carries. For those of us who main support/tanks, there's less of a chance we can carry ourselves, even with MMR on our side.

Now that's just not true. I've got 5 accounts, and i've done plenty of challenges, I've done Draven only to diamond, Blitzcrank only to diamond, Wukong top lane only to diamond and now i'm doing support wukong only to diamond. Guess which one so far got to diamond in the least amount of games. Blitzcrank. And not just by a small amount, it took me 122 games from unranked to diamond with a 68% win rate. You can carry just as easy with a tank, support as you could an assassin, ap carry or bruiser. You just need to figure out how to win more games.

Also, all of my accounts so far has been placed in silver 2, 1 and one got to gold 5 after placements. Playing in silver isn't harder than playing in gold or platinum, players are worse sure, but they also make a lot more mistakes, they lack objective control and they tend to drag out games longer than they should, if you are a carry you could start picking kills across the map and come back with a strong late game in silver, you cannot do that in platinum+ as easy.

There is a common misconception that it's much easier to play in gold or platinum+ because players are better, that just doesn't make any sense. If you believe that players in gold+ won't feed, overextend, play champions they suck at, rage, afk or troll you are wrong. That never stops.

Trash ADC BtwSep 2, 20151 votes

I said it's easier, not that they don't. That's a statistically proven fact. Bronze and Silver players troll more. That's a fact.

Blitz is an anomaly from a support perspective as well. He can singlehandedly win games with his hook. That's not something say... Sona, Soraka, Braum, etc. can do.

JAGMAGSep 1, 20153 votes

well my problem is i tend to get the bad teams in streaks i went on a losing streak were i would have roughly half of my teams kills and my team would have 4x+ the deaths i had put me on a massive lose streak and i lose more LP then i gain per win/lose i can undo a 4 game win streak in two losses its pretty dumb and makes it super hard to climb

Trash ADC BtwSep 1, 20155 votes

Statistically speaking you have an 80% Chance to get a feeder or a troll on your team for every 100% chance the enemy gets.

However, that also means that for 4/9ths of the playerbase will be held back potentially every game. It's almost a coin toss. Sometimes the coin legitimately comes up tails 10 times in a row. The coin ABSOLUTELY must come up heads at a statistical possibility of 2/3 in a row to win a promo

5/9 (the games you'll statistically win if you deserve to) < 2/3 (the games you need to win) by about 11%, ergo 11% of all promotion series, statistically speaking, are failed because of a failed teammate.

Let's assume that the numbers decrease as you go upwards in ELO for games with no feeders/trolls. Bear in mind these numbers count the TOTAL probability of having one on YOUR team OR the enemy team.

In Bronze 80% of your games will have at least one feeder or troll In Silver 70% of your games will have someone on one side like that. In Gold 50% of your games in Plat 30% In Diamond 15%

If we take the 11% base chance and augment it by including the possibility of a game with no feeders on top of the regular possibilities we get a total statistical probability of you failing a Promo series through no fault of your own;

Bronze: 8.8% Silver: 7.7% Gold: 5.5% Plat: 3.3% Diamond: 1.65%

JAGMAGSep 1, 20153 votes

sounds about right

Trash ADC BtwSep 1, 20154 votes

Back with more math. Assuming matchmaking has a 50% chance to pit you against better/worse teams, which it does, assuming MMR hits 2/3 of its games correctly and imbalances about 1/3 (a generous figure, I believe)

in 66% of games there's a 50% variance on win or lose,

Since you need to win 2/3 for a promo series; one game there should be no interferance one game there should be no interferance one game has a 50% win/loss chance.

This affects Matchmaking only slightly. Assuming you have a win/loss of 50% where you're at and you're slowly climbing, this will provide you with;

66.7-50 = 16.7

16.7/3 = 5.56%

Statistically speaking.

Bronze: 14.36% Silver: 13.26% Gold: 11.06% Plat: 8.86% Diamond: 7.21%

Assuming 66% of games are 100% balanced, since I do not have data to back this up.

These numbers leave out the X factor of how much imbalance affects teams at various levels of play as that is incalculable.

Imhotep14Sep 1, 20151 votes

50% chance to pit you against better/worse teams? I'm assuming the other 50% is against equal teams? So MMR would hit 1/2 of its games correctly - not 2/3 like you said.

You're basically spewing out a bunch of %s and numbers without any clue, logic, reason, data, argument, evidence, research, valid math, so please continue conjecturing professor.

Trash ADC BtwSep 1, 20152 votes

No... assuming 66% of games are balanced, and 33% of games are unbalanced;

66% of the time there's no conditional affectation that causes win/loss from imbalanced matchmaking

33% of the time there's a 50% chance you'll have a positive or negative unbalancing.

Assuming you're able to win 50% of your games at your current MMR, you'll have a 5.57% variance of negative compensation to overcome on average from matchmaking, because;

1/3 of matchmaking is a 50% win/loss without factoring personal knowledge/skill (assuming nominal 50-50 amounts of both), and you need to win 66.7% of your games, there's a 33% chance that the deciding game will be the MMR messed up one, ergo that 33% of the time the variance between that 50% and 66.7% you need will be applicable. the Variance is 16.7%/3 since it shows up in one of three games, that equates out to 5.57%

This 5.57% is the total % chance, assuming you're AS skilled as the opponents you're facing, that you will fail a promo through no fault of your own on an MMR mistake.

Adding that to the total from Potential feeder/trolls;

Bronze: 8.8% Silver: 7.7% Gold: 5.5% Plat: 3.3% Diamond: 1.65%

Bronze: 14.36% Silver: 13.26% Gold: 11.06% Plat: 8.86% Diamond: 7.21%

Leaving out, as I stated, the X factor of the amount MMR mistakes affect each ELO of play, because that is a number which we cannot have hard data for.

I hope this clarifies it somewhat. Bear in mind these are "Fail your promo series" numbers, not "Individual match" numbers.

djjomonSep 1, 20153 votes

That's on them. Yes, it's a team game. But you can't control what your teammates do. You can realistically only rely on yourself in game, unless you're playing premade. Why? Because you're the constant. By the same nature, your teammates can only rely on themselves. So if they're not playing reliably, they're hurting themselves more than you.

You get these people in one game. Unless you're D1 or higher, where you get them more frequently. But they're still not in every game. And if they refuse to be team players, they're hurting each one of their games. While only hurting yours on an individual basis.

FeathermaneSep 1, 20152 votes

Baron and dragon are team objectives. That's why anyone can solo dragon, and almost anyone can solo Baron. :^)

CrettSep 1, 20153 votes

{quoted}

Baron and dragon are team objectives. That's why anyone can solo dragon, and almost anyone can solo Baron. :^)

The issue doesn't lie in a champion being able to solo a team objective. They're going to do it slowly, and if the enemy team contests it, there's probably no way you're going to get away with it

TurquoiseYoshiSep 1, 20157 votes

1: Not everyone can solo Baron. It requires you to have high lifesteal and attack speed.

2: The reason why those are able to be solo'd (late game) is that it will take a long time. If there are wards on one person going for Baron, you can expect that one person to get beaten and Baron to be stolen. If the Baron-getting team wants to send more people, then they open their base up to attacks from the enemy team.

DalenthasSep 1, 20152 votes

And how often do you get carried? For every game that you lose because your team is so bad you can't carry them, there's a game that you get carried by someone else on your team.

Gojira PrimeSep 2, 20151 votes

This game is 70% luck and 30% skill IMO.

siilentdeathSep 2, 20151 votes

shouldnt have to carry 1-2 bad players to win all of your games. this the reality of climbing out of bronze. if its a team game then why dose 1 feeder often start the snowball effect on bronze league games? personally i think they need to not Q you up with anyone on your block list. id rather wait 5 minutes for a game i have a chance of winning as opposed to getting to getting people on your team in ranked that can only play 1-2 roles effectively. those players that can only adc or mid cost players games.

GorgannanSep 2, 20151 votes

Averages. Your team isn't terrible every time. If you have a 40% winrate and someone has a 60%, I'm gonna have to say it's you.

slipstreemSep 2, 20151 votes

I'll just leave this ranked loss here...

http://matchhistory.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/#match-details/NA1/1938354070/31699569

I was 9/0/5 at one point and 3 levels ahead of everyone in the game(I was lvl 17 when next closest was lvl 14 and most people were still 12ish) and our team was 5.1k gold ahead pretty much all on me over their nunu... but my nasus kept typing gg right from the start and asking for a surrender vote every 2 minutes and destroying team morale and just doing everything he could to cause the rest of us to play worse and I am sure he missed some stacks and cs over his negativity.(He only had 400ish at the end of a 37 minute game... unacceptable at plat)... throw in some highlights of him and annie hating on each other and so eventually the enemy team actually worked together(because in plat.. people sometimes do work together and group up and it was over... :(, janna, nunu, ori, frostborn ez was a tough nut to try to crack.

HaloSep 2, 20151 votes

Hardstuck G4Sep 2, 20151 votes

I can say that League is a team game, completely and utterly, and some games are impossible to carry on your own. I have a prime example from a game last night. Syndra took AD Runes, J4 took AP and Mana Runes. Top Lane lost, Mid Lane lost. I was Vayne, playing against Ashe. At the end of the game, I was 34/9/10. A very solid score. I had full build at 30 minutes. Yet, since my team lost, we had no way to fight against them. Needless to say, we ended up losing in a very embarrassing display. TL;DR- Not all games are able to be carried. Your team matters. To all those players who say you have to carry. It's not true...

SimplicateSep 2, 20151 votes

Though if can work with your team without raging and just play your role effectively you should climb. I mean if you are good at your role but everyone in your elo is "shit" then the other team is likely to have 5 shit players while yours only have 4.

LylessSep 2, 20151 votes

[{quoted}](name=I Am A Bad Blitz,realm=OCE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=TAKusEzJ,comment-id=,timestamp=2015-09-01T06:27:36.080+0000)

That's why if you're good enough you should be able to carry yourself. (Logic/10)

And before anyone says it's your ability to work with your team, then what about your teams inability to work with you?

THANK YOU! That's what I have telling these morons for the longest time. But they don't seem to get it!

Dr PoroSep 6, 20151 votes

If 2 teams are equally good, they'll have 50% win chance against eachother. If one of those teams gets a player that's significantly better (because he's actually better than his rating says), then that team will have a higher win chance. A higher win chance doesn't mean that you'll win that game, but if you play a lot of games, it does mean you have a higher winrate. A higher winrate means that your rating will rise. Eventually, you're not better than your rating suggests anymore and you will have a normal win chance and winrate again and your MMR will stagnate.

In reality, both teams aren't equally good because

It's hard to find people with exactly the same MMR. The system will adjust for this by giving the underdog team more MMR gain for a win and less for a loss and vice versa for the team that has a higher win chance (based on MMR).
MMR is never an exact indicator of one's skill or performance. Not only is this because it requires a LOT of games to evaluate someone correctly, but also because human performances are very variable and one day a player can play really good while playing really bad the next day (or game). Also, if people are forced into a role they don't main, they will probably play worse (on average, in some cases they play better because they play safer).

This means that even though you are higher skilled than your MMR suggests, there could be a player in your team with lower skill than his MMR suggests. There could also be a player in your team who is last pick forced into ADC and sucks with it. There can also be a player who is having a bad day or is playing in conditions that aren't optimal (for example playing while ill). This will hinder your smooth climb.

BUT all of this is random stuff and random stuff go both ways. These players can be in your team or the other team, also undervalued players can be in both teams. In the end, all of this randomness WILL even out. For some people the luck-badluck evens eachother out from the very beginning and only has a marginal impact, but sometimes you will have consistent badluck for 50 games with only a few spikes of good luck and you'll have to play atleast 100 games for it to even out. Complaining won't help though. The only thing that helps is play more games for a bigger sample. If you keep getting badluck, maybe you should reconsider whether it's really badluck or just something that isn't random but caused by yourself. A great example of this is the presence of flamers or AFKers. Some people complain that they are consistently queued up with these guys, but very often are they causing or stimulating this themselves. Also, people with the "screw you, I'm first pick" mentality will have bad teammates much more often than those who listen to their teammates, check their lolking, and give up their position if the others would do better in it/worse in the position they'd otherwise be put in. I can't count the amount of times I allowed Riven mains to go top even though their winrate was only slightly above 50% with riven while my wukong winrate was 70+%, but they barely played games as other lanes so they'd naturally do worse when forced into it.